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Thread 9 Starmer : Return to Westminster

1000 replies

DuncinToffee · 02/10/2024 16:58

Previous thread:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5169266-thread-8-starmer-cat-fur-on-new-clothes?page=40&reply=138729672

Taxes are voluntary Brew

OP posts:
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78
SerendipityJane · 06/10/2024 21:00

I had to watch my DM suffer an incredibly aggressive dementia - from OK in 2013 to catatonic in 2015. In the end she broke her hip while my DF and DB were helping her move around, but they didn't realise for days. Then it was a hip replacement and just existing in hospital (having caught pneumonia) till 2017.

The only saving grace was once she couldn't feed herself my DB cured her diabetes and got her off the cocktail of 9 meds doctors insisted were needed.

I have something in my eye, sorry. Better log off for now.

BIossomtoes · 06/10/2024 21:03

💐 Serendipity. As a fellow dementia daughter I’m offering you a big virtual hug.

cardibach · 06/10/2024 21:21

@SerendipityJane that must have been very difficult 💐
My mum had dementia, but before she completely succumbed to it she fell and caused a brain bleed which took her fairly quickly. Even then, the days in hospital were incredibly difficult.

pointythings · 06/10/2024 21:38

@SerendipityJane I'm so sorry. Dementia was involved with both my parents - with my dad it was Parkinsons dementia and yes, very aggressive. With my mum it was self inflicted and caused by alcohol. She fell down the stairs in her home four days before she would have been sectioned. My Dsis and I fought and fought to get her help, but because she had the capacity to refuse it until the very last, it didn't happen.

She could have had an assisted suicide as she lived in the Netherlands but chose not to.

tobee · 07/10/2024 02:17

Such sad stories Flowers to @SerendipityJane , @BIossomtoes , @cardibach and @pointythings and others on this thread sharing their personal tales

itsgettingweird · 07/10/2024 04:08

Sorry for all those who watched parents succumb to dementia.

It's so tough Flowers

DuncinToffee · 07/10/2024 08:23

The latest story from the Times is that Angela Rayner bought her boyfriend a suit for Christmas Hmm

OP posts:
Efacsen · 07/10/2024 08:39

Seems like the 'silly season' has been never-ending this year - now that the conferences are over maybe we can hope for a return to normal reporting

PickAChew · 07/10/2024 08:53

DuncinToffee · 07/10/2024 08:23

The latest story from the Times is that Angela Rayner bought her boyfriend a suit for Christmas Hmm

How very dare she!

BIossomtoes · 07/10/2024 09:11

Efacsen · 07/10/2024 08:39

Seems like the 'silly season' has been never-ending this year - now that the conferences are over maybe we can hope for a return to normal reporting

To be fair, the Downing Street comms operation has been absolutely dire. There have been no positive stories coming out and the donations story and the infighting one have filled the vacuum. There should have been a grid of key issues and the steps being taken to address them to be fed to the media in place. It’s good to see that belatedly a highly experienced comms director has been appointed, hopefully he’ll hit the ground running.

Piggywaspushed · 07/10/2024 09:22

Much as I know they divide opinion, it seems to me Starmer's Labour need a Campbell or Mandelson.

bombastix · 07/10/2024 09:35

I would be much more critical. Every Labour government faces a great deal of hostility. No comms strategy, waiting for a budget, gloomy predictions for the future? Then the only major policy that cuts through is a cut to what is presented as a vulnerable group? Keir Starmer is not a Blair. He is not charismatic and he cannot afford mistakes like this. They should have had double the comms that Blair did. Blair was charming. Keir is often deemed a robot. The media landscape is much tougher than in 1997.

These people are naive. It shows in the freebies and also the failure of a grand narrative. Boris Johnson, who I think is contemptible, absolutely knows the value of narrative. He writes it. Even if it is utter rubbish he shapes his own agenda all the time. The fact that no one thought this was important for Labour suggests a serious lack of political nous. Bad start.

bombastix · 07/10/2024 09:37

BIossomtoes · 07/10/2024 09:11

To be fair, the Downing Street comms operation has been absolutely dire. There have been no positive stories coming out and the donations story and the infighting one have filled the vacuum. There should have been a grid of key issues and the steps being taken to address them to be fed to the media in place. It’s good to see that belatedly a highly experienced comms director has been appointed, hopefully he’ll hit the ground running.

I reckon the damage is significant. The glasses thing. Every time people look at Starmer they say to themselves; did he pay for those?

Fool.

PandoraSox · 07/10/2024 09:39

bombastix · 07/10/2024 09:35

I would be much more critical. Every Labour government faces a great deal of hostility. No comms strategy, waiting for a budget, gloomy predictions for the future? Then the only major policy that cuts through is a cut to what is presented as a vulnerable group? Keir Starmer is not a Blair. He is not charismatic and he cannot afford mistakes like this. They should have had double the comms that Blair did. Blair was charming. Keir is often deemed a robot. The media landscape is much tougher than in 1997.

These people are naive. It shows in the freebies and also the failure of a grand narrative. Boris Johnson, who I think is contemptible, absolutely knows the value of narrative. He writes it. Even if it is utter rubbish he shapes his own agenda all the time. The fact that no one thought this was important for Labour suggests a serious lack of political nous. Bad start.

I agree with all of this. It is pretty shocking really. Starmer is an intelligent man. How could he not see that the WFA decision was a very bad move?

PandoraSox · 07/10/2024 09:41

Although I think keeping the budget under wraps is a good thing.

BIossomtoes · 07/10/2024 09:45

I can’t disagree with a word of that @bombastix. Particularly the lack of narrative and the naivety.

bombastix · 07/10/2024 09:48

This is just the start; it’s not even a very tough time in the country. Who advises Starmer? Someone who believes their own Labour hype? They need to get real. It’s not about a good man doing good works. It’s about a good man avoiding the kind of political attack that dogs the left in this country. Then you talk about what you’ve done.

I suppose Starmer had an easy ride. Sunak was terrible. Johnson dug his own grave. He won’t be doing much more finger wagging or sermons as PM for a while.

MaybeNotBob · 07/10/2024 09:50

Maybe they should start the Budget with the litany of dreadful things that CCHQ have started threads on here about.

And then say, "Oh, my mistake, that's what the Daily Mail said we were going to do. What we're actually doing is this..."

newnamethanks · 07/10/2024 09:53

Depressingly, I have to agree with all the above. I haven't got the words to describe the perception of naive lack of competence that's been allowed to arise. It's not bloody good enough. Unbelievably poor.

CassieMaddox · 07/10/2024 10:00

Reading Chris Mason it sounds like Sue Gray was in charge of comms and that's one of the reasons why she's had to go.
I'm questioning the choice of putting a senior civil servant in charge of comms because I think comms to the civil service is markedly different to trying go stay on top of public perception. Just my hunch though.

I hope this is a good change for them.

SerendipityJane · 07/10/2024 10:04

newnamethanks · 07/10/2024 09:53

Depressingly, I have to agree with all the above. I haven't got the words to describe the perception of naive lack of competence that's been allowed to arise. It's not bloody good enough. Unbelievably poor.

Bear in mind there aren't many Labour MPs who have experienced government before. same as in 1997. And unlike 1997 - thanks to the Brexit which is like a stain that will seep though the pages of history - the competence of the civil service has also been severely compromised.

Another reason to question whether the UKs way of "doing government" is optimal or not.

Remember there are still those (Tory) politicians that would have civil servants take an oath of loyalty to the government and Brexit. The Brexitprinzip is still a thing.

Meanwhile, Irish unity creeps on apace ...

https://www.irishnews.com/opinion/noel-doran-its-game-on-as-new-generation-joins-irish-unity-debate-Q7QLNGJDOBGDZCEEA44DEKC64U/

Local children gather around the campaign car of British politician Enoch Powell during campaigning for the Ulster Unionist Party (UUP) for the South Down constituency, County Down, Northern Ireland, 6th October 1974. Powell won the seat, receiving ove...

Noel Doran: It’s game on as new generation joins Irish unity debate

Young people coming on to the electoral register will make up their own minds about what happens next

https://www.irishnews.com/opinion/noel-doran-its-game-on-as-new-generation-joins-irish-unity-debate-Q7QLNGJDOBGDZCEEA44DEKC64U

newnamethanks · 07/10/2024 10:10

Fair point jane, I have overlooked the possible contribution of the CS and its unfailing 'impartiality'.

bombastix · 07/10/2024 10:10

CassieMaddox · 07/10/2024 10:00

Reading Chris Mason it sounds like Sue Gray was in charge of comms and that's one of the reasons why she's had to go.
I'm questioning the choice of putting a senior civil servant in charge of comms because I think comms to the civil service is markedly different to trying go stay on top of public perception. Just my hunch though.

I hope this is a good change for them.

The senior civil service instinct is to confirm or say absolutely nothing. Or the bare minimum. It does not say a lot about the political judgment of those at the top that they do not know this rather big difference. Politics is theatre. The civil service are those behind the curtain.

BIossomtoes · 07/10/2024 10:15

Brilliant analogy, I like it.

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