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Would you agree that my father is mean?

107 replies

Armyofprawns · 23/09/2024 11:21

You would think that I would perhaps be able to work this out myself but family life is complicated especially the deeper you ar in with situations and I honestly don't know if my father is being mean/mean spirited or not. My friend thinks he is.

Before I start, I will say this is not about me wanting any money off my parents (I know this is heavily frowned upon on MN!). Since leaving home 26 years ago I have never asked for a penny from my parents nor have I been given any.

Up until 6 or so years ago my parents were living a pretty good life. They have never had any money worries and imo have lived a comfortable and fairly stress free, easy life. My parents are now in their early 80's and my dad has enjoyed good health and apart from needing a pacemaker and suffering from osteoporosis, so too had my mum. Dad would spend his week on the golf course or touring around in his classic motorbike, mum did some charity work in a local shop and at the weekends they were always out with friends. I live around the corner and would visit them a couple of times a week, often going out with my mum and my dc when they were young (my dc are their only gc).

However, in 2018 everything changed. My mum was diagnosed with Alzheimer's. She then developed glaucoma and cataracts and this year she has received a breast cancer diagnosis.

Since the dementia diagnosis and seeing dad struggling with mum's health needs (he is not a natural born carer) I started to help out more and more and before you know it I am going round 4-5 times a week, helping with all of their life admin, financial stuff, organising all of mum's medications and many hospital appointments (which I always attend with them) and health administration, helping with changing beds, doing their washing, taking mum to her day centre twice a week and making mum a packed lunch for both of those days too (all from my own pocket).

I don't earn a lot as I only work part time due to health issues. Money is often tight and my dad is fully aware of this.

I do all of these things to help because I know my dad struggles with mum's diagnosis and he feels the disease has also taken his life away, I know he is suffering also and it breaks me to see my parents like this. I do these things to repay my mum back for being such a lovely mum.

But I suppose the bugbear is that my parents have a lot of money (well in my opinion anyhow). Hundreds of thousands invested (from inheritance from my grandparents), £50k sits in a current account, £15k in another and they live in a very large house worth over £600k (which is now too big for them and beoming a noose around my father's neck as it is 100 years old). Dad is very hesitant to spend any of their money as I know he is worried there won't be enough to over mum's care home needs when she has to go into care, I understand his worries. They currently have a carer in for an hour Mon-Fri to help mum shower (it took me two years to persuade dad to agree to this). A hairdresser comes once a week to wash mum's hair and she attends the two afternoon sessions at the day centre per week and that's enough, dad will not pay out for anything else. My sister does their cleaning once a week/fortnight or whenever she can do it.

For our 'wages' as my dad calls it ,he gives my sister and I £40 per month each. When I told my friend this she was taken aback, she thinks this is very mean. The money helps me alot but I suppose with the amount of phone calls I make for them, the driving my mum to her day centre and paying for her packed lunch it probably covers that and leaves me with not much more!

He isn't very generous, I must admit but is this mean?

OP posts:
Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 08:33

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:19

Have you ask directly for petrol money?

Why is your dh resentful? He doesn't sound very supportive!

Why can't you tell your dps that you need to work more hours for financial reasons?

I do ask but my father is the type to pay once or twice then 'forget'. Unless you've been in this situation then I can not express just how draining it is when you have to keep asking for small amounts of money each time.

I find it hard to see how you can come to the conclusion my husband is not supportive from one line. I have been with my dh for 35 year, since I was 16, he knows full well what my father is like. My husband works long hours to support his family. So you think it's ok for my dh to support my father who has hundreds of thousands in the bank?

You so very obviously have never found yourself in a situation.

OP posts:
MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 24/09/2024 08:34

I do a lot for my elderly parents and for another elderly relative. It wouldn't occur to me that they should pay me, and I wouldn't accept money if they offered.

If money is tight, I think it's reasonable to want your costs covered, e.g. petrol money and lunches etc. I wouldn't personally take any more than that.

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 08:39

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 24/09/2024 08:34

I do a lot for my elderly parents and for another elderly relative. It wouldn't occur to me that they should pay me, and I wouldn't accept money if they offered.

If money is tight, I think it's reasonable to want your costs covered, e.g. petrol money and lunches etc. I wouldn't personally take any more than that.

BUT do you feel appreciated by them?
Does you father begrudge you picking up your dc from college and moans when you do but happily expects you to take or collect your dm from her day centre without question?
This is where the difference lies. Feeling appreciated or not makes a huge difference towards the mental health aspects of caring for elderly relatives.

OP posts:

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:40

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 08:33

I do ask but my father is the type to pay once or twice then 'forget'. Unless you've been in this situation then I can not express just how draining it is when you have to keep asking for small amounts of money each time.

I find it hard to see how you can come to the conclusion my husband is not supportive from one line. I have been with my dh for 35 year, since I was 16, he knows full well what my father is like. My husband works long hours to support his family. So you think it's ok for my dh to support my father who has hundreds of thousands in the bank?

You so very obviously have never found yourself in a situation.

Edited

I look after two elderly parents/relations.

It wouldn't occur to me to ask them for money. I work part time and am retraining at college one day a week.

If I was really out of pocket I would ask them directly for petrol money - I have done this when I had to drive them a very long way. They also buy their own food (I buy it and they pay me back).

I say your dh isn't supportive as he's telling you that he feels as though he's supporting your parents by working 50 hours a week. This just makes you feel guiltiter and amplifies the resentment you feel.

If you had boundaries, like I do, you'd say - this is what I can offer. These are the times I can do it. This is what I can afford.

Daisy12Maisie · 24/09/2024 08:41

I dropped my mum off some milk the other day as she has a cataract removed so I didn't want her to have to go to the shops. She offered to pay me for the milk. I said don't worry obviously but she will always at least offer to pay for things as she is conscious she has a lot more spare cash than me so it doesn't sound like your dad is being overly generous but then it says in your post he is worried about pending care costs.
That might be the issue.

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:43

You keep mentioning how much money they have, so clearly there is huge resentment there, even though you insist that there isn't.

If you feel drained asking for small amounts of money, then say, dad I'm going to keep a tally of how much extra I'm spending on petrol and you must reimburse me every month or I can't do this anymore.

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:44

Also pending care costs are terrifyingly expensive.

He will be aware of that and maybe trying to be frugal now so you aren't saddled with those as well!

Redburnett · 24/09/2024 08:49

Mean is a gross understatement. You have my sympathy. I do not understand these elderly parents who sit on vast sums while their adult DC struggle financially. But I do think that as they age they become totally out of touch with the value of money. In their later years mine sat on vast sums while giving tiny monetary gifts for Christmas and birthdays and relying heavily on relatives for care of the sort you describe. They cancelled the private agency carers that I arranged twice. It is true that care/nursing homes are expensive but that is no reason not to pay properly for care provided by relatives before residential care becomes the only option. My parents' money is now being used to pay huge nursing home fees. As a retired person myself, I am determined not to make the same mistake, and I am giving some of my spare cash to my own adult DC to help with house deposit should they ever be in a position to get a mortgage.

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:50

My parents' money is now being used to pay huge nursing home fees

So what is your issue? Would you rather have been gifted that money earlier and have to now pay the fees yourself?

How are you planning to pay for your own care costs? My PILs care home costs are 6k a month. Luckily he had 700k in the bank otherwise we'd all be stuffed.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 24/09/2024 08:52

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 08:39

BUT do you feel appreciated by them?
Does you father begrudge you picking up your dc from college and moans when you do but happily expects you to take or collect your dm from her day centre without question?
This is where the difference lies. Feeling appreciated or not makes a huge difference towards the mental health aspects of caring for elderly relatives.

Yes, my parents do appreciate it. My other relative not so much because she has little idea of what's going on most of the time.

I get that it's very hard if you're not feeling appreciated, but wanting appreciation is different from wanting money imo.

If you want to turn it into business arrangement where you're caring for your mum as a paid job, then I guess your dad should be paying at least national minimum wage as well as employer NI contributions etc, and you would need to pay tax and NI as well.

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 08:52

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:40

I look after two elderly parents/relations.

It wouldn't occur to me to ask them for money. I work part time and am retraining at college one day a week.

If I was really out of pocket I would ask them directly for petrol money - I have done this when I had to drive them a very long way. They also buy their own food (I buy it and they pay me back).

I say your dh isn't supportive as he's telling you that he feels as though he's supporting your parents by working 50 hours a week. This just makes you feel guiltiter and amplifies the resentment you feel.

If you had boundaries, like I do, you'd say - this is what I can offer. These are the times I can do it. This is what I can afford.

No, my dh does not make me feel that way at all. Can you not see his point of view?

So you help our elderly parents/relatives, work part time and are training etc....... this isn't a competition you know? You might be handling this well, some others may struggle more.

Count yourself lucky that you have parents/relatives who you can communicate so well with. Don't assume that I haven't tried this with my father.....I have. He is a very difficult man at times and caring for someone with dementia changes the whole dynamics of a family and people's tolerance to stress etc. Simply caring for an elderly parent is not the same as caring for a dementia sufferer (I know as I am in the caring profession).

OP posts:
Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 08:54

Daisy12Maisie · 24/09/2024 08:41

I dropped my mum off some milk the other day as she has a cataract removed so I didn't want her to have to go to the shops. She offered to pay me for the milk. I said don't worry obviously but she will always at least offer to pay for things as she is conscious she has a lot more spare cash than me so it doesn't sound like your dad is being overly generous but then it says in your post he is worried about pending care costs.
That might be the issue.

He has always been quite mean with money but he has become so much worse since mum's diagnosis. I do understand this but it is becoming quite an issue now, he resents spending out anything and believes the government should support them because he has worked all his life.

OP posts:
ssd · 24/09/2024 08:55

Notinmylifethyme · 23/09/2024 11:51

You seem to be well versed on your parents assets. How much money do you think he should give you?

She has to be well versed, doing everything for them.

And if course he's being mean op.

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:57

If you don't want to hear replies from people who are handling things differently then don't insist that you are the only one who knows anything about caring for difficult elderly parents.

You cannot change your parents. You can change yourself and how you react to it.

And @mrsbennetspoornerves makes an excellnt point about treating this as a job.

If you want to get paid for your time, but not pay tax or declare it, or be gifted large sums of money without declaring it for IHT reasons then that's another issue!

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:58

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 08:54

He has always been quite mean with money but he has become so much worse since mum's diagnosis. I do understand this but it is becoming quite an issue now, he resents spending out anything and believes the government should support them because he has worked all his life.

But he's intending to pay for his own care costs, so he's not relying on the government is he?

OK, OP, say he's being mean. Now what are you going to do about it?

PeggyMitchellsCameo · 24/09/2024 09:06

Just thinking of my lovely late dad and realising how lucky I was. I had issues caring for him right at the end and he also wanted hospice care - it was the same hospice where my mum had died and he actually found it comforting.
The last conversation we had when he was really cogent he asked me about giving ‘a few quid’ to people who were meaningful to him.
He didn’t have a huge amount by the way.
When I asked him if there was anything else he said..
No, that’s it, love. You are the person who has looked after me, you are the only person I want here now. You enjoy the rest, have a good holiday you deserve it.
After reading this thread, hope no one minds me chipping in.
Even though as the ‘daughter’ I was expected to provide more care, and it was tough, I do realise how lucky I am that it was appreciated.
A funny footnote: he rang me early from
the hospice one morning that I’d brought the wrong pyjamas.
I thought - here we go, another day.
I got there earlier than expected and he was behind the curtain with the doctor, and he was genuinely in tears. He told the team he just asked for new pyjamas as he wanted to see me, he was worried about me and said…
If you think I’m in bad shape I’m just dying, doc. She’s absolutely knackered.
I have never forgotten that day.
I still have the unwanted pyjamas.

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 09:09

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 08:57

If you don't want to hear replies from people who are handling things differently then don't insist that you are the only one who knows anything about caring for difficult elderly parents.

You cannot change your parents. You can change yourself and how you react to it.

And @mrsbennetspoornerves makes an excellnt point about treating this as a job.

If you want to get paid for your time, but not pay tax or declare it, or be gifted large sums of money without declaring it for IHT reasons then that's another issue!

It's not about hearing other people's opinions is it? You are cherry picking bits from my replies and trying to antagonise. I am indeed replying to others and at the end of the day my op was to ask if others thought the £40 a month was mean because my friend thought it was.
My op didn't ask for advice on how to deal with my father, it asked if he was mean. Read the last sentence?

OP posts:
Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 09:10

PeggyMitchellsCameo · 24/09/2024 09:06

Just thinking of my lovely late dad and realising how lucky I was. I had issues caring for him right at the end and he also wanted hospice care - it was the same hospice where my mum had died and he actually found it comforting.
The last conversation we had when he was really cogent he asked me about giving ‘a few quid’ to people who were meaningful to him.
He didn’t have a huge amount by the way.
When I asked him if there was anything else he said..
No, that’s it, love. You are the person who has looked after me, you are the only person I want here now. You enjoy the rest, have a good holiday you deserve it.
After reading this thread, hope no one minds me chipping in.
Even though as the ‘daughter’ I was expected to provide more care, and it was tough, I do realise how lucky I am that it was appreciated.
A funny footnote: he rang me early from
the hospice one morning that I’d brought the wrong pyjamas.
I thought - here we go, another day.
I got there earlier than expected and he was behind the curtain with the doctor, and he was genuinely in tears. He told the team he just asked for new pyjamas as he wanted to see me, he was worried about me and said…
If you think I’m in bad shape I’m just dying, doc. She’s absolutely knackered.
I have never forgotten that day.
I still have the unwanted pyjamas.

What a beautiful post. Thank you for writing it.

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 09:12

PeggyMitchellsCameo · 24/09/2024 09:06

Just thinking of my lovely late dad and realising how lucky I was. I had issues caring for him right at the end and he also wanted hospice care - it was the same hospice where my mum had died and he actually found it comforting.
The last conversation we had when he was really cogent he asked me about giving ‘a few quid’ to people who were meaningful to him.
He didn’t have a huge amount by the way.
When I asked him if there was anything else he said..
No, that’s it, love. You are the person who has looked after me, you are the only person I want here now. You enjoy the rest, have a good holiday you deserve it.
After reading this thread, hope no one minds me chipping in.
Even though as the ‘daughter’ I was expected to provide more care, and it was tough, I do realise how lucky I am that it was appreciated.
A funny footnote: he rang me early from
the hospice one morning that I’d brought the wrong pyjamas.
I thought - here we go, another day.
I got there earlier than expected and he was behind the curtain with the doctor, and he was genuinely in tears. He told the team he just asked for new pyjamas as he wanted to see me, he was worried about me and said…
If you think I’m in bad shape I’m just dying, doc. She’s absolutely knackered.
I have never forgotten that day.
I still have the unwanted pyjamas.

Your father sounded like he was a very lovely man. My fil is very much like this.

OP posts:
MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 24/09/2024 09:13

PeggyMitchellsCameo · 24/09/2024 09:06

Just thinking of my lovely late dad and realising how lucky I was. I had issues caring for him right at the end and he also wanted hospice care - it was the same hospice where my mum had died and he actually found it comforting.
The last conversation we had when he was really cogent he asked me about giving ‘a few quid’ to people who were meaningful to him.
He didn’t have a huge amount by the way.
When I asked him if there was anything else he said..
No, that’s it, love. You are the person who has looked after me, you are the only person I want here now. You enjoy the rest, have a good holiday you deserve it.
After reading this thread, hope no one minds me chipping in.
Even though as the ‘daughter’ I was expected to provide more care, and it was tough, I do realise how lucky I am that it was appreciated.
A funny footnote: he rang me early from
the hospice one morning that I’d brought the wrong pyjamas.
I thought - here we go, another day.
I got there earlier than expected and he was behind the curtain with the doctor, and he was genuinely in tears. He told the team he just asked for new pyjamas as he wanted to see me, he was worried about me and said…
If you think I’m in bad shape I’m just dying, doc. She’s absolutely knackered.
I have never forgotten that day.
I still have the unwanted pyjamas.

Beautiful post, made me cry!

Kiuyni · 24/09/2024 09:13

Armyofprawns · 24/09/2024 09:09

It's not about hearing other people's opinions is it? You are cherry picking bits from my replies and trying to antagonise. I am indeed replying to others and at the end of the day my op was to ask if others thought the £40 a month was mean because my friend thought it was.
My op didn't ask for advice on how to deal with my father, it asked if he was mean. Read the last sentence?

OK. What do YOU think? Is he being mean?

MaybeDawn · 24/09/2024 10:01

@Armyofprawns I do not for one second think you are a "money grabber". You sound like a wonderful daughter.

PenelopePitStrop · 24/09/2024 10:14

You and your sister could show him a list of your exact costs, including petrol , washing and cleaning material etc , in caring for him and your Mum.

Tell him that this care is actually keeping her at home longer and therefore saving money in the long run.

I am sorry about your Mum’s Alzheimer’s, it is so cruel on everyone and you are putting in so much care. Please do not overstretch yourself. I mean this, it is important. You must be able to sustain your own job, family life, marriage, health and mental health. Caring and juggling and the emotional aspect of it all all but broke my sibling.

Bignanna · 24/09/2024 15:58

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 24/09/2024 08:34

I do a lot for my elderly parents and for another elderly relative. It wouldn't occur to me that they should pay me, and I wouldn't accept money if they offered.

If money is tight, I think it's reasonable to want your costs covered, e.g. petrol money and lunches etc. I wouldn't personally take any more than that.

They can well afford to pay, they know what things cost, and the OP is being taken advantage of because she is family.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 24/09/2024 16:51

That's not how I would see it, personally, but the relationships in my family have never been that transactional. It wouldn't have occurred to my parents to ever charge me rent, for example, and they gladly helped with childcare etc when dd was little. They have always been happy to support me in whatever way they can, and I am equally happy to support them now that their circumstances have changed. For me, it is just what families do, and I wouldn't dream of accepting payment.

I do understand, of course, that some families are not based on loving, mutually supportive relationships like this. In that scenario, though, I would probably let my rich parents pay for carers instead of taking it on myself to do it.