Just a little moan about school reward trips

[Deathfingers]

Just want a vent because I can't vent to the school.

Ds year 7 missed out on the reward trip because of behaviour points. Fair enough I guess, they are all for low level things e.g. not having his blazer on at the right time, pen not working and no spare, low level backchat to teachers occasionally. Parents evening they all said hes a good kid, just some minor things but nothing bad and they all said they have a soft spot for him, which was really nice to hear.

Have found out that his pal, who landed another kid in a&e after a fight and is one of 2 kids who were pretty horrid to another kid who ended up having to move class, gets to go, as does the other kid, because they haven't had as many minor behaviour points.

DS now can't understand why he can't go because he's not had a pen or been 10 secs late to a lesson occasionally whereas these 2 other kids get to go despite assaulting/bullying another.

So I just wanted to say into the ether that "DS school, I think this is really shit and undermines your behaviour system, so I'm going to keep DS home that day for his own reward day eating Haribo in his PJs and playing on his xbox 🖕"

That is all.

We have positive behaviour points and negative behaviour points. The vast majority of students have only a few negatives. There are of course kids with very serious behaviour issues with hundreds of negative points and then others whose poor behaviour is at a lower level with fewer. I suppose the point I am trying to make is that most kids don't get many minuses because they generally turn up on time, wear the uniform, bring a pen and don't disturb lessons or backchat the teacher. Your son does and you minimise this. Imagine that the school ignores this low level stuff. More kids do it. Lessons are constantly disturbed and the learning is less effective. Classrooms are noisier and kids who want and need to concentrate can't. I can also tell you that when you let more stuff go, kids push more boundaries.

Not going on the trip feels harsh to you and your ds, but it is actually pretty easy to get to go on the trip. He chose to mess around a bit to be popular with his peers. You come along and tell him it's not fair so stay at home and have a KFC. You are undermining the school whichever way you try and dress it up.

I'm not actually having an issue with the points tbh. Sorry I thought I'd been clear on that.

Thanks for your comments!

I agree, I met a group of friends with dc in my ds year. They were all talking about the reward days that happened last week. I knew nothing about them, I asked my son and he said 'oh yeah I didn't get picked.'

There has never been any issues with his behaviour, he's a fairly quiet boy, flies under the radar but gets good grades and his reports have always been excellent. What kind of message does it send? It tells me son he's not good enough, or not worthy.

School only contacted parents of kids who were invited to go, so nobody else knew about it until the day of the trips.

Also sports day, they had a 'proper' sports day at the athletics stadium with specific invited pupils, and a token sports day for everyone else next week.

Rather than focus on others I’d focus on your child. Back chatting is a problem but you’re going to reward him for it!

34 instances of poor behaviour over 33 weeks is a lot. It means every week he is doing something he shouldnt be doing. so no you shouldnt be rewarding him and sticking fingers up to the school. Where do you think this goes for him if you reward this?

but i completely agree those fighting should not be going either.

Same re: 'secrecy' around it. DC didn't even know what the criteria was!

And DC school do the same, have trips like that where there's an unknown selection method, so some in history class go to a castle for e.g., others watch those 360 videos of the castle instead which is pretty shit.

My dc school has a similar points system so a forgotten pen is 1 sanction point, forgotten homework or swearing at a staff member is 2 points and throwing a chair at the teacher is 5 points. The punishments do escalate so 5 forgotten pens is 5 ten minute detentions, 2 forgotten homework is 2 after school detentions for an hour each etc. But sanction points on class charts means someone could get 6 behaviour points for forgetting homework once, no tie twice, no pen twice and someone else could get less points (5) for a one off incident where they threw a chair at a teacher. Thankfully at my dc school the reward thing (usually a bouncy castle on the school field or a cinema trip) is for children who get no sanctions all year so you don't get students with quite a lot of low level sanctions not going but someone who got 5 sanctions at once for something really bad being allowed to go.

Personally I'm on the fence about rewarding children like this. On one hand it gives the non academic, non sporty but well behaved children a chance to shine. On the other hand I think that there is always a reason for negative behaviour and it's often not the child's fault. My ds2 had one sanction point in the 5 years of secondary school and that was for having an autistic meltdown in class and throwing a sponge at the teacher. My DS3 got 13 sanction points in the first 2 terms of year 7 for low level disruption when we were homeless. When we got our own house his behaviour was suddenly ok and he has only had 3 sanction points in the last year and nearly a term.

Tbh I think 1 instance of forgetting a pen etc. a week is alright. Not great but not enough for me to be majorly concerned. It'll be less incidents because like I say it all seems a bit inconsistent with how many points are given.

I think it will go as expected, he'll be fairly happy at a chill day with a KFC but he'll remember missing out on a fab day out, so he'll learn his lesson. Im not at all concerned this will kick start a future of him being a yob. I know him quite well.

So is having a pen that isn’t working
not having a spare pen
not bringing any pen to school
being (occasionally!) late for lessons
back chat and cheek
not wearing school uniform properly, blazer, shirt

I do agree with you OP about the poor practice of not counting violence as sufficient to miss the trip, and am pleased you generally support the school, but your child sounds as though he is really getting to be a pain in the arse, and I think you need to make sure he sorts himself out for next year, he could even start practising for next year in what remains of this year.

Why are you worrying about other people's children instead of your own? How about installing some respect in your child and teaching him that back chat to teachers is never acceptable?How about teaching him to choose his friends more carefully and to stay away from thugs?
How about backing up the school's decision and giving him a rhetorical kick up the arse so he can go next year?
Haribo FFS!

I'm not worried about other children.

I am trying with the friend thing, im sure as he gets bigger and moves forms etc he'll expand his feiendship group. But his friendship group is not relevant at all to this.

I am backing the school. Ive told DS tough shit, do better then you won't be in this position again.

With all due respect, if he is staying home in his pyjamas, eating Haribo and playing on the Xbox, you are undermining the school and teaching him to carry on as he always has. I am amazed that you just can't see this.

No, I take that back, I am not in the least but surprised actually.

As unfair as this may seem, I wouldn’t concern yourself about who else did or didn’t get to go. Concentrate on your child, and what he can do next year to increase his chance of going on the reward trip. Point out to him that all these ‘minor’ incidents have cost him a treat, and talk about how he can improve behaviour next year.

Don’t confuse the issue by concerning yourself about fairness. Focus on your child.

Not that many pupils actually backchat to teachers, even the naughty ones generally don’t as they know it just creates hassle and more trouble. Being rude to people never goes down well or gets you on in life. The sooner he learns that the better.

Extrapolate the situation. When he's older, is he going to backchat his boss and turn up to work without the correct tools for the job. Will he be sacked and come home to play in Xbox and eat sweeties do you think?

No, I don't think that will happen.

Most people I know were very different at 18 than they were at 12. He's a tit but he'll learn pretty quickly to pack in the 'banter' (teachers words not mine!) and have pens/press submit for homework/blazer on at boundary etc.

I too think lots of low level behaviour is draining and disrupts the flow of lessons. As a teacher, saying you have a soft spot is just polite for he's likeable but that doesn't excuse the behaviours and the cheeky chappy in Y7, quickly turns into disruptive and annoying later on.

However I do think it unfair that the other child has gone on the trip and would question why your DS considers him good 'pal' material.

Wow what a great parent, no wonder we have to do it for you.

It's simple addition. Your kid got too many points. Very few kids are not allowed on trips so it's more than just 'a pen'.

This is the new behavior model, overly reward the bad kids when they behave well while ignoring their bad behavior in the hope they choose to behave. Meanwhile overly punish normal kids for sneezing. Discipline is unpredictable and out of proportion for normal kids and it makes them feel unsafe and anxious. It’s happening everywhere and parents drag their miserable bullied kids to school day after day and wonder why they end up with mental health issues.

You and your son are worrying about the wrong thing. Forget about who else does or does not get to go on the trip.The real issue here is HIS behaviour.

That is the only thing he can control. His aim should be to improve HIS behaviour and you should support him in that because it is important for the sake of HIS education and future life success, not because it will allow him to go on a day trip.

Unfortunately you’ve done your son a disservice and sent him a number of awful messages about your priorities and expectations of him with regards to his schooling and behaviour.

I remember being locked in the art block for 4 hours mid 90's because my GCSE mocks were not as good as the teachers decided they should have been. Everyone else in the whole year got to go to the West End for a show, I had never been. Even the girl who failed every exam. I got C's and B's for my sins.

I sat and cried and became quite petulant about doing any school work because of it, I have no idea what they thought it would achieve. It wasn't inspirational. I got expelled a few months later in the middle of GCSE's because I literally stopped giving a shit! These kind of punishments make you feel excluded and as if you are being picked on. They do nothing for confidence or to encourage.

Any of my teachers reading this will know who they are from that.

Excuses, excuses.

I don't agree with the sweat the small stuff policy many schools take these days. Dr Naomi Fisher does a good post on it that I'll find and paste.