Thread 49 Sunak: He Left them on the beaches

[DuncinToffee]

3 Weeks to go

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https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5090939-thread-48-sunak-capsized-on-the-ship-of-lies?page=40

I can't read the Jenrick article, but the headline at least is a good illustration of what Peston was saying. Instead of attacking Reform, the line is just about a vote for them helping Labour.

Jenrick's got to be on the bingo card for GE night. Will be lovely to see him get the boot.

Jenrick is 1st on my bingo card. (I appreciate bingo doesn't work like that!!)

Until the Conservatives are prepared to slug it out with Farage - point out the magical thinking/inadequacies of his "manifesto" they are sunk.

Whilst Farage is playing Disney Dad offering unicorns and sunlit uplands at zero tax & immigrant free, what is the point of the Conservatives?

Unfortunately they aren't prepared to tackle him head on for fear of retribution and that they'd have to acknowledge the failure of Brexit.

As I said I can't understand Labour's position here - if they had been doing a good job of opposing they would have been pointing out every unicorn not materialising since Brexit. They could have opened up the floor for proper discussion on what was actually wanted and not achieved and why. They've kept the weird vow of silence and it has resulted in Reform. Even now, faced with that, they are refusing to tackle the bear.

Of course Farage is also a problem for Labour - whinnying 3 word slogans from the Telegraph & BBC whilst Labour inherit crumbling public services, a Shit List the size of Lord of the Rings and a cynical exhausted electorate.

Agreed Fabio - far too much tip toeing around Brexit voters feelings. It was a shit idea, poorly executed and still hasn't been fully implemented because that's how shit it is.

Of course the media could bury Farage in a heartbeat. I have no doubt they are sitting on information.
The fact that they aren't doing just that goes to show that their owners have benefited from Brexit - it's just the voters and country that have missed out.

It also suggests that the Tories have served their purpose and can now be discarded. Boo hoo.

I'm currently looking in my rather pre millennium wardrobe for the appropriate attire. I may even treat myself to new dancing shoes. Because you would have to ram me with a police car to stop me dancing in the streets when those fuckers are having their first post election meeting in a phone box. And the revenge will be even sweeter, as they are entirely to blame for their own downfall. It's a shame in a way that they are such ghastly people and therefore can't be the plot for a decent opera or mythological cycle like the fall of Troy. Even if the letters are all the right ones - but not necessarily in the right order 😀

@SerendipityJane opera maybe not, but one of those dramatisations that the BBC does so well would be fun.

@SerendipityJane i suspect there will be a lot of drunken dancing in the streets. I fancy an old fashioned conga.

My worst nightmare would be a Conservative - Reform coalition.

It's a shame that Inside No. 9 has finished

Look at what has happened to Labour over the years - when it went "very Left" .If Labour win, how long would they be in power - and how will the Conservatives change if they keep losing elections.

Remember that Thatcher was in power for 20 years.

Which is why I am worried we aren't debasing the Brexit lies. We saw how they won with the bots before....foolish to expect it not to happen again.

Has Starmer been asked how he would work with a Reform coalition? Maybe that is why he is refusing to speak up - he can see what is coming if the bots are allowed?

Interesting article on why campaigns ignore Gen X in The ST magazine today.

The writer spends some time going through this and pointing out that the otehr ends tend to have views at the extremes so are easy to woo (although I'd argue there is fuck all wooing of the young - and when they are wooed they are often betrayed) and Gen X tend to be moderate especially in things like Culture Wars where t they basically end up with two lots of views so aren't easy to pin down . They ted towards moderate/progressive on climate , too.

The argument is this makes them hard to campaign to, so we (Gen X ) feel overlooked.

The most interesting bit at the end though is about Starmer. The basic inference is that he is found 'dull' and 'boring precisely because it is targeting Gen X (known in the past under various guises such as Stevenage Woman or Mondeo Man) who are themselves really quite moderate and dull. And that's why he'll win because he is going for the middle. Not sexy, not earth shattering - but a compromise position that reflects the heterogeneous (can't think of better word) views of Gen X.

If only the rest of the ST was quite so measured!

I don't understand anything about labours tactics other than - "we're in the lead. Keep your mouth shut!"

Their manifesto seems like more of the same. PFIs all the way! It offers me no hope.

Ds (far more politically aware and astute than I...) would like to vote LD as their manifesto most closely aligns with his values. He realises he must vote tactically to GTTO. But it's not particularly exciting or hopeful.

I've been saying for a while that I think reform will get seats (many on here very strongly disagreed). I still think they will. Not many, granted, but some.

A reform/tory coalition terrifies me too, but geopolitically, Europe is moving to the right.

As a historian, I know how this ends.

Labour should be radical in their proposals for fixing our country. Instead we are getting "don't worry, we won't raise taxes to pay for better public services, NHS and teachers will be no better off, and safeguarding children and women's rights just isn't a priority".

Its utterly heartbreaking for an old leftie like me 💔

I'm gen x

I wouldn't describe myself as a moderate

@user8800 exactly how I feel - I wanted to vote Labour but it feels like watering down in many areas. Also don't like the "just don't talk about it" side which seems to grow every week. I want debate and to not make the same mistakes with a red label on it. Will also be voting Lib Dem.
My fear is a Labour/Reform coalition, because nothing would get done. Starmer would talk around in circles and Farage would end up pushing his ideas more and making Starmer look like a pansy.

Why would there be a Labour/Reform coalition?

Brian Cox is mentioning Brexit on LK this morning, it wasn't in the script going by LK's reaction

I don't like that they are using all the tools they used for Leave and people are still thinking Labour will win by a landslide...

The precise chances of a Labour Reform pact is nil.

More likely to be a Lib Dem/Labour coalition if it is needed

Saying Europe is moving to the Right somewhat ignores the whole of Scandinavia who are wandering leftwards again...