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Harry Potter plotholes/ goofs that really annoy you

222 replies

Aproductofmyera80s · 11/06/2024 19:21

I absolutely love Harry Potter, I watch it twice a year, would watch it more if I had the time. One plothole that gets me every time, so Fred and George had the marauders map all that time and didn’t notice that Ron’s rat was Peter pettigrew?
every time I watch it, it grinds my gears.
any one else notice anything?

OP posts:
PinkFrogss · 11/06/2024 23:47

A plot hole for me is why people didn’t question Sirius’ guilt more. He supposedly betrayed his best friend so that Voldemort could kill Harry.

And then when that didn’t work he flies over to see Harry, doesn’t try to kill him himself, just gives his magic motorbike to Hagrid to ensure Harry’s safe removal, and then goes off to kill his other mate.

And how useless Lupin is. He either believes Sirius is innocent and does nothing about his rotting away in Azkaban, or he believes he’s guilty and doesn’t mention Black is an animagus and knows secret entrances to the school. I know that’s partly written off as not wanting to reveal the marauders we’re illegal animagus’, but surely he could have lied and said he’d heard rumours and it must have been another secret thing he was up to while betraying the order.

FirstFallopians · 11/06/2024 23:54

A lot of the Hagrid stuff really irritates me.

Appreciate that he helped introduce Harry to the wizarding world, and occasionally offered an encouraging word or two, but that’s about it.

He’s constantly getting Harry in trouble, or relying on him, Ron and Hermione too much. Sort out your own hippogriff defence ffs!

Janefx40 · 12/06/2024 00:18

Not sure it's a plot hole but the Tri-wizard challenges bother me. Who created a spectator sport under water! The audience would literally have been standing there talking amongst themselves and seeing nothing! The maze is similar. Literally the worst spectator event ever!!!

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StuntNun · 12/06/2024 00:24

toothieruth · 11/06/2024 21:20

Would love for someone to explain theories about the final book when harry drops the resurrection stone before getting 'killed' by Voldemort. By dropping it is he accepting death and that's why he was allowed to come back? Or did it still work for him even though he dropped it? Or did he not die because Voldemort only killed the horcrux of himself that lived inside harry? Never understood that scene...

It's really complicated. Harry learns that he is the final, unintended, horcrux and therefore he must die to make Voldemort mortal. He drops the resurrection stone because he knows that he has to die. Harry is master of Voldemort's Elder wand because he defeated its previous master, Draco, in battle at Malfoy Manor. A wand won't turn against its master so, when Voldemort casts Adava Kedavra, it kills the horcrux soul fragment instead than Harry. Because Harry and Voldemort are linked by Lily's dying protection (because Voldemort was revived using Harry's blood) both Harry's soul and the fragment of Voldemort's soul go to limbo. Harry chooses to return to life but the soul fragment is too damaged and deformed and, I assume, can't return to life. Then, in the final battle, when Voldemort casts Adava Kedavra and Harry casts Expelliarmus at the same time, the fact that Harry is the master of Voldemort's Elder wand causes Voldemort's spell to backfire upon himself.

I'm pretty sure Dumbledore's ghost explains all this to Harry in the book although he wasn't quite certain of all the wand lore, especially around the Elder wand.

JamSlagsNowPlease · 12/06/2024 00:24

It's unfeasible that the existence of witches and wizards could have been kept secret from almost all Muggles. Surely the proud parents of some Hogwarts pupils would have blabbed?

AmyandPhilipfan · 12/06/2024 00:26

I can't remember the quote but I'm sure there's a bit in one of the books where Ron says something about his oldest brother to do with a timeline that couldn't be true as he was so much older than Ron.

The forbidden Forest. Why is it forbidden but allowed for detentions? 'Naughty' kids who need detentions probably shouldn't be allowed to explore a dangerous forest. Especially when Hagrid allows 11 year olds to be out of adults' sight, in the forest, in the middle of the night!

The Philosopher's Stone was incredibly valuable and sought after. So, among other things, it was guarded by a fierce 3 headed dog. But they didn't think to lock the door in a way that magical children couldn't open it and come face to face with said dog. Also, what were the arrangements for walking and toileting said dog?

Grandparents. I know there was a wizarding war but was it explicitly said that Harry's grandparents on both sides were killed during it? Why would Lily's parents be killed? And if they had been surely Petunia would be in hiding, not living in a very ordinary house pretending wizards and witches don't exist.

GwenogJones · 12/06/2024 00:27

PinkFrogss · 11/06/2024 23:47

A plot hole for me is why people didn’t question Sirius’ guilt more. He supposedly betrayed his best friend so that Voldemort could kill Harry.

And then when that didn’t work he flies over to see Harry, doesn’t try to kill him himself, just gives his magic motorbike to Hagrid to ensure Harry’s safe removal, and then goes off to kill his other mate.

And how useless Lupin is. He either believes Sirius is innocent and does nothing about his rotting away in Azkaban, or he believes he’s guilty and doesn’t mention Black is an animagus and knows secret entrances to the school. I know that’s partly written off as not wanting to reveal the marauders we’re illegal animagus’, but surely he could have lied and said he’d heard rumours and it must have been another secret thing he was up to while betraying the order.

But from the perspective of everyone else, Lily and James are dead because they were betrayed by their secret keeper, Sirius was the secret keeper ergo they are dead because of him and he must be the spy. This is compounded by his "murder" of Peter and the 12 muggles and him standing over Peter's remains laughing his head off.

There's not much anyone would question.

Hagrid even comes up with an explanation for what Sirius is like after James dies - he says Sirius was all white and shaking and he comforted him, thinking he was upset about James when really he was grieving his master's downfall. Sirius asks Hagrid to give him Harry, and Hagrid supposes that if he had Sirius would have thrown Harry off the motorbike at his own convenience, but that when Hagrid says "no" Sirius hands over his motorbike as it will be too easy for the authorities to trace and he has to make a run for it.

Everyone thinks it was Peter who tracked Sirius down, not the other way around - so Sirius was on the run, Peter found him, Sirius killed him (and 12 other people and then stood there laughing).

From the information everyone has, everything makes sense or can easily be explained away. As the truth is that one of the dead heroes was actually the spy, no one is going to guess that. It would be a dishonour to Peter's memory to even think it. So even someone who wanted Sirius to be innocent couldn't possibly come up with another version of events that made sense.

With the information he has, Remus can either stand by Sirius or stand by the memory of James, Lily and Peter. But he can't do both.

As for Lupin not giving up the entrance to the Honeyduke's passageway - he is presumably going with Ron's assessment of the situation: that Sirius cannot break into Honeydukes with all the dementors floating around Hogsmeade therefore the passage is useless to him. Therefore no one needs to know about it - even if it's still there (after all, the fourth floor passageway behind the mirror has caved in since the marauders' time). There are actually 7 passageways out of Hogwarts, and Filch knows about four of them, maybe Lupin is choosing to believe that in the past twenty years some of the other passages have been found - or perhaps he never knew Filch didn't know about it. Lupin is a character who runs away from his problems and buries his head in the sand, it is a core part of him, he will be coming up with all sorts of reasons why he doesn't have to pass this information on.

The truth is, he could tell Dumbledore about the passageway and even hand over the map without revealing to him the truth about Sirius being an animagi and without having to admit to breaking any rules (it's not against the rules to know where the passages are, or to draw a map of the school). Cowardice explains why he doesn't tell Dumbledore Sirius is an animagus - he doesn't want to lose Dumbledore's trust - but it doesn't explain the other secrets he keeps... But it's love. He still loves Sirius even though he hates him, and though his head might accept that Sirius belongs in Azkaban his heart will not allow him to be the one who passes on the information that results in his best friend being thrown back to the dementors. So he keeps quiet and desperately trusts to Dumbledore and Hogwarts to keep Harry safe, and prays someone else will capture Sirius without him having to get involved.

AmyandPhilipfan · 12/06/2024 00:30

Oh and also, Hermione was petrified for a long time in book 2. Plus the troll attack in book 1. Battling past the 3 headed dog etc. Would you leave your child at a school like that? I'm not sure I'd have sent her back after the first year, but definitely not after the second, if I was Hermione's parent!

echt · 12/06/2024 00:31

A most enjoyable thread! It also illustrates the inevitable differences between book and film. I remember catching up on all the HP novels that existed when I moved to Australia and before I got a job - DD had never spoken much about the books but did once she knew I'd read them - our first real book conversation.

Occasionally I still use the audiobooks read by Stephen Fry on Hoopla to go sleep but find that all the irritating not-so-good writing that slipped by when reading sticks out a mile when spoken. BTW this works for all writing - as a teacher I often recommended students read their work aloud at home before sending it in.

I digress.

GrumpyPanda · 12/06/2024 00:38

ohfook · 11/06/2024 19:33

How were the weasleys poor. Surely as a wizard money is pointless because you can just magic stuff up. Like instead of living in a ramshackle old house why didn't they just magically fix/spruce up the house, likewise with the hand me down wizards robes.

Good point. Related to that - how did the Potters get rich, given they were barely out of school when they got killed? Had they picked up jobs by that point? And what happened to both sets of parents?

Wantedfghj · 12/06/2024 00:49

LifeofBrienne · 11/06/2024 21:21

On ‘not all Slytherins bad’, when my kids watch the films, a thing that annoys me is all the Slytherins being shepherded away before the final battle. Because it seems so black and white, Slytherin = not to be trusted. I would really like them to have been given a choice and a handful to have chosen to stay and fight against the Death Eaters. It would be even better if it included named characters who weren’t particularly nice to Harry and his friends, but maybe turned out to be a bit brave and not evil.
I think it’s done the same way in the book but I read it a long time ago (though I remembered enough to be annoyed that they changed Neville’s hero scene in the film).

Harry saw Charlie Weasley overtaking Horace Slughorn, who was still wearing his emerald pyjamas, leading what looked like the families and friends of every Hogwarts student who remained to fight, along with the shopkeepers and homeowners of Hogsmeade

The Slytherins did leave, but came back with reinforcements.

GrandTheftWalrus · 12/06/2024 00:57

James parents had him late in life. I don't think it's explained where their money came from but I think it's theirs. So can be believable about them being dead by the time James is 21.

However lily and petunias parents I don't believe would've been dead by the time they were 21/23 at a push? And lily as far as I'm aware didn't get money from her parents and petunias money came from Vernon.

OnePeachCrow · 12/06/2024 01:29

Pinkywoo · 11/06/2024 20:15

That right from book one, everyone has been banging on about Harry having his mum's eyes, yet in all the flashbacks her eyes are brown and his are blue!

That's just in the films because Daniel Radcliffe was alleric to the contact lenses. They both have green eyes in the books.

Moro93 · 12/06/2024 02:33

I feel like this post should specify movies. Most of these plot holes don’t exist in the books. The movies created tons by missing out important storylines.

Moro93 · 12/06/2024 02:35

I’m sure I’m not the first person to say this on this thread. I haven’t read everything, but I just wanted to add based on some early comments, Sirius Black is a Gryffindor…

Gremlinsateit · 12/06/2024 02:45

gingerale23 · 11/06/2024 22:29

He just repeated what he'd heard harry say before.

Exactly, he’d been listening to Harry repeatedly trying to open the Snitch. In the books, Ron is clever in his own way.

MariaVT65 · 12/06/2024 05:34

JellyBabiesSaveLives · 11/06/2024 20:54

No, they're green. From Deathly Hallows - "Lily’s bright green eyes were slits. Snape backtracked at once."

We are saying that Lily’s eye’s are brown in the flashbacks of the film. The little girl in Snape’s memories has brown eyes. That is what we are saying the problem is. That in the films, Lily and Harry have different eyes.

MariaVT65 · 12/06/2024 05:36

OnePeachCrow · 12/06/2024 01:29

That's just in the films because Daniel Radcliffe was alleric to the contact lenses. They both have green eyes in the books.

No, it’s also because the little girl in the flashbacks has brown eyes. Neither has green eyes and their eyes still didn’t match.

MariaVT65 · 12/06/2024 05:39

Pinkywoo · 11/06/2024 20:52

But half the cast were either wearing wigs or dyeing their hair (Dumbledore, Hagrid, Malfoy and his parents), even Fred and George aren't really redheads!

Yes I know. Still comes back to the original point we are trying to make that Harry and Lily having different eye colours in the films is a goof.

MariaVT65 · 12/06/2024 05:41

ladygindiva · 11/06/2024 22:24

I know a family of three siblings who all have red hair and blue eyes

Yeah, it does happen, that’s why I said rare. (My daughter has 2 different eye colours which is also very rare).

But my point is that it’s still very rare which likely explains why they ended up casting a red-haired actress with brown eyes.

Fivegodowntothesea · 12/06/2024 06:17

@StuntNun excellent explanation, I always find that hard to get my head round but you need all the back story from the books to really understand.

Rycbar · 12/06/2024 07:06

Moro93 · 12/06/2024 02:35

I’m sure I’m not the first person to say this on this thread. I haven’t read everything, but I just wanted to add based on some early comments, Sirius Black is a Gryffindor…

No one has said he isn’t…they’re pointing out that Hagrid tells Harry that basically all the bad witches and wizards came from slytherin however at this point, Sirius is deemed guilty and in Azkaban but he is from Gryffindor so … not all bad witches and wizards were Slytherin.

gingerale23 · 12/06/2024 07:08

@StuntNun that's good explanation I never fully understood that part either.
So essentially it's all to do with the wand rather than the stone? If that's the case it was very risky of dumbledore. He tried to equip harry with the deathly hallows so he could overcome death but the wand element was always going to be tricky.

StarsBeneathMyFeet · 12/06/2024 07:17

Students are allowed pets - a cat, toad or owl. Why does Ron take a rat? No rat - no Peter Pettigrew in school. Why didn’t the books just say rats were allowed pets?

Also it irked me in the movie POA that it was never explained who had created the marauder’s map. It would have taken less than a minute’s dialogue.

YellowHairband · 12/06/2024 07:30

PinkFrogss · 11/06/2024 23:47

A plot hole for me is why people didn’t question Sirius’ guilt more. He supposedly betrayed his best friend so that Voldemort could kill Harry.

And then when that didn’t work he flies over to see Harry, doesn’t try to kill him himself, just gives his magic motorbike to Hagrid to ensure Harry’s safe removal, and then goes off to kill his other mate.

And how useless Lupin is. He either believes Sirius is innocent and does nothing about his rotting away in Azkaban, or he believes he’s guilty and doesn’t mention Black is an animagus and knows secret entrances to the school. I know that’s partly written off as not wanting to reveal the marauders we’re illegal animagus’, but surely he could have lied and said he’d heard rumours and it must have been another secret thing he was up to while betraying the order.

I also don't think it's that logical that dumbledore wouldn't have known they were animagi anyway. Once they left school and were in the order, working with dumbledore, wouldn't they have mentioned, "oh btw, in case it's useful, I can turn into a dog"

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