Why is it always the same type of child picked for everything?

[Alittlebitofchaos]

My dd is starting secondary next year. She has been mentioning of late it's always the same kids picked for speaking, debating, acting rolls etc, head girl etc..
She is bright, friendly & always puts herself forward but it's always the chosen few who get selected.
Firstly why do this happen? Secondly how can I help her to develop skills that will help her shine in secondary?
Also if you have one of the lucky kids who is always picked, what extracurriculars /special attributes have they?

In DS year there was a "usual suspect" who always got main parts/Mary/main speaking roles etc. She left to go to private school and it was a breath of fresh air to see other girls on stage, doing solos etc and they were great. Maybe they would have got the part anyway but they had to wait til year 6 to get a look in

This happens at my children’s school. You usually find it’s because the parents are always up at the school about something on a weekly basis. They always pander to those that shout the loudest.

Why is it always the same type of child picked for everything?

Simple answer - it isn't.

She has been mentioning of late it's always the same kids picked for speaking, debating, acting rolls etc

Well, those roles all need the same type of skill.

Mine tended to get speaking roles, but then were disappointed they weren't 'the angel in the Nativity' or whatever. Didn't get picked for the school football team. Never fast enough to be picked for the gala at swimming club, etc etc.
We all have different things we are good at and things we aren't so good at. No-one is great at everything and no school picks the same child for everything.

At my DC school, it was generally the confident good speakers that were picked for the main acting/speaking roles, the fast runners/skilled pupils to represent the school in the borough sports and the ones who were good at a certain instrument for music competitions-that makes sense to me.

At our school kids are often chosen who might have had adverse experiences or maybe they just deserve a chance. Our current head boy was previously looked after, and our head girl was the only girl in the class who didn't get into the grammar school. I think they really deserved these opportunities to shine. My kids often don't get picked - but they have a lot on their side (parents who take them to extra-curricular activities etc) I tell them you never know what the teachers might know that they don't - and to take these decisions with grace.

It's confidence, it is frustrating as they aren't always particularly nice kids but especially with girls it's all about confidence.

In primary school, yes, it was clear that they choose people from a very small pool regardless of the other 40+ children.

In secondary it all changed. For plays, they often choose children with high attendance because they are seen as reliable to attend rehearsals. Main roles go to children who do drama/performing arts outside school or show talent in the school lessons/school drama club. But the plays are normally big and there are roles for lots of people.
DD's last play also was a 4 performance one, 3 months of weekend and after school rehearsals, it ate into her free time a lot.

HG - these are normally Y11 and Y13 students, plenty of time to show confidence. Often these girls do a lot of volunteering outside school, show responsibility, reliance, independence in class and are active in various socities and clubs.

In many schools it depends on the social standing of the parents

With respect, that’s as self-deluding as ‘Those girls don’t like you because they’re jealous’.

Teachers will want that performance/speech etc to be the best it can be to reflect well on them and their teaching so they choose the best possible pupil for the role.
Unfortunately this means if your child isn't naturally good, as there aren't as many opportunities pre secondary drama to learn and get a better chance at the roles, they get left out of these situations.

If it really bothers you maybe try some youth drama groups see if it helps

One of my daughters is that girl. She's just really confident and never shuts up. I don't think its something you do as a parent its just naturally who they are

DS1 was picked for everything at primary school. He was a fairly quiet child, but when he spoke he spoke clearly and politely. He had lots of friends but wasn’t a “cool” kid. He was clever and good at sport. But mainly, I think he was chosen for things because he behaved well, always. So the teachers knew that if he got chosen to show guests around, or represent the school at something, he would turn up and say the right things. They could always rely on him.

At secondary he continued to behave well, but was still quiet, and didn’t put himself forward. Consequently he never got picked for anything! He spent his entire secondary education staying safely under the radar.

As others have said, once kids get to secondary the teachers don’t know them anything like as well as at primary, so ironically kids have more control over the situation. If they put themselves forward for everything they’re much more likely to be chosen for things.

I had one who was picked for everything at primary (even the time we asked the teacher not to pick her because she'd been picked every time) and a few things at secondary, but those tended to be things where she had achieved and no one could argue.
And one who was picked for a few things at primary and more at secondary.

The different in ability was little for the primary school things. However, what I suspect made the difference was that the one who was picked was very reliably there. She had 100% attendance from year 4 upwards and missed less than a fortnight since starting preschool aged 3, including getting chickenpox). So they knew she would be there. The other one had much poorer attendance.

I have a third who has been picked once over school for anything (he's year 12) I think for something, possibly twice. I don't think he's that bothered, but I do occasionally chunter quietly to myself when I think he should have had a chance. Things like he's done a performance to around 1-2k people a day for a week five times now; the school can't claim they don't know as he has to get a week off school. Yet other children have had awards (they do drink and biscuit over assembly) for "being in their dance school performance", which feels a bit off to me. I have been wondering whether to drop a note to his tutor and say it would be really nice if it is acknowledged this time he does it, but I suspect ds would not be impressed at getting it. When he was performing last year he told his friends he was sick. Last Christmas he told them he'd been arrested and was on bail... 🤣

Yes I’ve noticed there are a lot of sympathy awards. At a talent show at my grandson’s school one girl refused to perform in front of everyone and would only perform to the teachers. Yep she won. Despite not even being that good (it was filmed and put on line). Makes a mockery of the kids who really worked hard.

My DD never got picked for these things, but my DS did, every time, it was his thing, confident and charismatic as a PP said , still is 10 years later. He never got picked for any sporting event or won the maths prize or played an instrument etc, it just was his thing and he did it well. Teachers are under pressure for it not to be rubbish, whilst giving as many as possible the chance. But some kids really hate this sort of thing. They should get their chance to shine in their own way

Can I ask how many schools you have worked in?

Is it a private school? I often think some parents put in a shift with the right school teachers to get their children ahead. My school was like that.

If you had parents who worked long hours or were not bothered in the slightest about acting this way then you were at a disadvantage.

Can I ask why I would need to work in a school to form impressions of the correlation between the ‘social standing’ of parents and the likelihood of children being chosen for things?

Because as someone who has worked in many schools o ca tell you it happens

Agree 100%

I have a p7 class. There tends to be the same group of children picked for several reasons.
The first is they volunteer, i try to give everyone who wants a speaking part a few lines.
The second is behaviour, if the dont listen, follow instructions etc then theyre unlikely to get main parts as there is always the chance management will say they wont be allowed in the show when the time comes.
Then its who is reliable, who will turn up at lunch time to practice, who will perform on the day, who wont decide the night before theyve changed their mind.

I would never force someone to speak on stage etc who didnt want to or felt uncomfortable so its easier to pick ones who do.

My youngest was an inn keeper last year and had the line "i suppose i can squeeze you in the stable but its a bit smelly"
Turned up to watch her deliver her line in an angel costume because she cried so much she didnt have a beautiful dress 🤣

So she was the inn keeping angel 😂

I love that story! And the thought of an Inn keeping angel. The school sounds great.

With respect, that’s as self-deluding as ‘Those girls don’t like you because they’re jealous’.

Exactly @InheritedClock , well said.

@ageratum1 I've worked in several schools, and, my dc went to different schools, and different schools from each other too.

Maybe just settle into the idea that this type of thing isn’t the be all and end all of things? Everyone shines at a different time. It’s part of life to to put yourself forward for things and not get them. It’s having self confidence and resilience that sees people through.