Witnessed a will payment dilemma

[justasking111]

Husband was asked to witness a neighbour will as was another neighbour.

Neighbour had a solicitor draw it up, signed it then passed it to another neighbour then my husband to sign. He did this, other neighbour signatory then said that the will neighbour had given them some money as a thank you. Husband said no you keep it. Neighbour said thanks they'll buy a bottle of wine. Well it turns out that the elderly neighbour gave £200 as a thank you.

We're in a quandary now because husband didn't witness the elderly neighbour signing, nor did he take any money for signing as a witness.

The neighbour who told us about the payment is a recipient in the will so no reason to doubt her.

Could we be in trouble. I ask this because the person whose will it is has disinherited a child because he's been caught emptying accounts of hers.

Would he have grounds to drag us into this mess if he finds out he's getting nothing?

If your husband signed as a witness but didn't actually see the will being signed by the person making the will then the will is not legal and husband should flag this to the solicitor or potentially the police. It's tantamount to fraud. He could plead ignorance as to the proper process and say that on reflection it didn't seem right.

Anybody could have put anything in the will, forged the elderly person's signature and your husband has said that it's genuine.

As for being given a gift - don't think it's right or standard but don't know for sure. Certainly one pays solicitors and others to sign things. As for a bottle of wine - if I wanted a friend to sign something for me I'd be happy to invite them over for wine and cheese or whatever and make a little party of it. As it was for my passport application I got 2 different friends to sign but while they are friends they are also business acquaintences so I do pay them for their business services (one's a hairdresser, the other a tutor)

https://www.gov.uk/make-will/make-sure-your-will-is-legal

The will is not valid as the 2 witnesses did not see the will signed in their presence

Just tell the neighbour they need to print it off again and then you and your husband go round and witness it properly. You won’t be called into the mess with the disinherited child but your husband may be called on to confirm that the will was properly executed - which it wasn’t.

Well your husband certainly doesn't know the meaning of the word 'witness' does he?

If I were you I'd make an anonymous report to social services and tell them that this poor neighbour is being financially abused by a family member.

Morally you need to act @justasking111

Agree with PP you can't just leave it be now. Your husband made it in your business by making you aware of a fraud.

So your husband didn't see anything wrong in being offered a bribe financial inducement to 'witness' the will of a very frail, housebound elderly person (quite possibly not long for this world) who he barely knows and hasn't even seen for years, and he didn't even see them sign the document?

Your husband is a blithering idiot.

I have a feeling the OP may end up withdrawing this thread.

Signed a neighbours will who he hasn't seen for years by a solicitor he doesn't know, is there any chance the will is fraudulent and not even made by the elderly neighbour.

This - you are witnessing the act of the will being signed. If you did not, it’s fraud.

Just read the updates. It sounds like there's a real risk that the carer is a beneficiary and has perhaps encouraged/coerced the making of this new will, plus the dodgy witnessing for payment.

Your DH won't be in any trouble, all he's done is wrongly witness a signature, rendering the will invalid. I'm a solicitor and people "witness" deeds regularly like this, just through ignorance of the formalities/not having been instructed properly on what to do by the solicitor. A witness is also not required to (and it would be unusual to - with something like a will) read the document before witnessing the signature. All they are supposed to do is sign to confirm they witnessed the signature.

In this situation my conscience would not rest without addressing the situation. If you don't know and can't find out who drafted the will, then perhaps it would be appropriate to contact local social services if your husband isn't prepared to go round and tell the neighbour he's realised he didn't witness the signature properly and therefore the will is invalid.

If he isn't prepared to do that, then frankly he's a real tool.

If he knows the name, he can find out where they work through this website. I would suggest that your husband contacts the senior partner just in case there is something going on with the relation.

Maybe he is feeling defensive and will come round OP.

You were right to raise it with him.

Your DH sounds like an idiot, signing a will of someone he hasnt seen in 5 years and who wasn't present and he sees nothing wrong with this??

For what it's worth, any witness to a will does NOT inherit. Even if they're mentioned in the will. That bit is automatically struck out.

If DH is worried about the signature then he should pop on and say hello. Then, if the old lady is happy all should be well.

Let's be honest here, your husband signed a will for someone he doesn't even know is alive!

He didn't witness the signature and hasn't seen the neighbour in 5 years.

He's clearly not blessed with brain cells.

He could potentially be an accessory to fraud.

He hasn't got a clue of this is a legitimate will.

And he's abusive to you.

I would absolutely report this.

Well he won’t be in any trouble or have to go to court but if he’s asked to sign an affidavit to say he did witness the signature he won’t be able to unless he’s willing to lie, so the Will is invalid and it was a waste of £200.

Why don’t you contact the solicitor and tell them what happened so they can contact their client and see if she wants to do it again, properly?

Well then why did he sign it??
the Will is invalid now. Given the high chance of a dispute after death i’d be telling the will maker to arrange for his solicitor to witness signatures or get another copy sent out and actually do the job right.

He should speak up not only on the presumption that the will is fraudulent, but ALSO if it actually represents the will of the person, as the neighbour would be under the impression they have a valid will, which they don't.

You should report this to the police or social services before the person dies. It really does sound like one of the beneficiaries has created a fraudulent will and paid people to sign it as witnesses. Whether your DH accepted money or not doesn't matter, he lied about witnessing the signing.

I think the neighbour knows full well they don't have a valid will, that's why they've paid £200 to get it fraudulently 'witnessed'.

Why on earth did he sign it? The point is literally to witness the signing!

What on earth did you think a WITNESS was?!

So your husband doesn't even know if this elderly woman even wrote the will or signed it?

It could all be the creating of the neighbours?

Did he not find it strange that they asked him, the new neighbour who doesn't even know them to witness the will?

There could be any type of fraud going on.