The EBSA support thread (emotionally based school avoidance/absence)

[BrambleyHedge]

Following this thread https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4996315-a-question-to-all-those-who-think-school-refusal-in-schools-is-increasing-due-to-lazy-enabling-parents?latest=1

I wondered if some people would welcome an EBSA support thread. I haven't seen another one so if there is already one I can delete this one. For those dealing with EBSA - I don't know about you but sometimes I just want to cry and scream with all the stress and I thought it might be healthier to write it down and share with others going through similar issues.

My son is 15 yr 11 and is currently upstairs refusing to go to his mock GCSE this morning. He is too anxious. He is only doing 5 GCSEs and has small group tutoring in his school rather than the normal classes. There are several in his year with EBSA so they have their own group. He is finally being assessed for ASD after 2.5 years in CAMHs list and also finally being assessed for EHCP after mediation due to council refusal to assess. He is what they used to call high functioning but unable to deal with education. I am practically in tears this morning trying to get him to go in. He usually doesn't go in until about 11 so this is early. He doesn't sleep.

So enough about me. If you too are having a crappy morning then please talk.

It would be good if this thread can be for those who are dealing with EBSA. Well meant advice or judgement from others may not always be welcome or helpful. I have tried literally everything over the last two years to get my son to school and am learning much of this is beyond my control. Sometimes there just isn't an answer.

I have put this in Chat for now so it gets seen. It could fit in education, SEN, or some other subjects.

How is everyone's week? This is week 4 of total non-attendance (or any home learning). It is hard to keep trying as it seems pointless. I went to an interesting ADHD talk last night but it was also depressing. The message seemed to be that if I don't get him on meds he'll become a drug addict or criminal. Not sure that is that I need to hear at the moment.

A good day yesterday.. (a half day) but as ever.. a good day is so often followed by a day under the duvet as a good day takes so much out of her.

@BrambleyHedge you are right it's so tiring to keep going. That sinking feeling when you open the bedroom door and know instantly what kind of day it's going to be.

I did give up and let her be when we had this back in year 9 - which I now realise was autistic burnout. The CAMHS person she was seeing (or not really seeing) was the person who suggested it could be autism rather than just depression. I had no idea at the time.

Anyway I digress. I know your DS is in year 11 and so it's a particularly stressful time. My DD missed all of her mocks and the 3/4 months in the run up to GCSEs this time last year and did end up improving and took 5 in the end. This seemed like an impossibility in March last year.

I know it feels utterly soul destroying at the moment but know that things can come good out of nowhere as quickly as they go downhill.

It's a huge exercise in holding your nerve isn't it. You are not alone.

Thanks. That is encouraging and gives me hope. Maybe he will still take his five GCSEs even if he doesn't go to school.

Glad you had a good day yesterday.

@lemonsaretheonlyfruit thank you for posting that. @EHCPerhaps I hope your week is going ok.

We are having a mixed week so far. The end of term is heading onto the horizon, which I have mixed feelings about because it's another term of mostly missed education, but we do feel things are a bit more stable (or maybe less unstable) on his now heavily reduced timetable.

Has anyone involved GPs? Is there much point while waiting on CAMHS referrals?

Anyone feel like a lot of the stress is caused by people around you, not your child? I know that I am currently a prisoner at home most of the time. I know that if they are out of school for a long time they will probably be behind their peers. I know that they "should be in school". I know that this didn't happen so much in the past. Etc.

I also know that the school environment is not conductive to my kids feeling safe and secure, so surely that will limit their learning anyway. Calming them down will lead to a better return than dragging them kicking and screaming.

Why can no one accept that the issue is that the environment doesn't meet their needs instead of putting all of the responsibility onto autistic children to fit into mainstream?

Only just seen this thread so a bit late to the party. I have a DS aged 15 (year 10), he's been diagnosed with ADHD/ASD and Anxiety. The last couple of years have been a nightmare, he's been on a reduced timetable for what feels like forever but, even when he was in school he wouldn't go to classes, just wanted to be in a smaller group just left to get on with his work. Last year his mental health plummeted to a worrying low and we had CAMHs involved as he was self-harming and talking about feeling pointless and disappointing to everyone. His EHCP is due through any time now as we've recently returned the draft.

My suspicious mind tells me school have been trying to shift the problem for ages as, against the advice of his ADHD specialist who joined us on a zoom call at our last meeting, they decided that an Alternative Placement would be best for him. This was then rushed through and decided after a brief visit which he's totally rebelled against and refuses to go because he had no say as to whether he liked it.

He got suspended at the end of last term (just before Xmas) because he had a melt down and, once again, despite being repeatedly told otherwise, a member of staff chose to stand over him, trying to get him to talk when he goes non-verbal (schools reasoning is that they "can't leave a child in a room on his own" but surely they can sit away from him at the other end of the room?), anyway, he started rocking in his chair and the teacher decided to grab it which led to DS flailing out and physical contact was made. He's supposed to be slowly being reintroduced into the school but so far, he's just having 1 hour 1-to-1 sessions twice a week in a room that's not part of the main school.

The place he is supposed to attend 3 times a week is fantastic and they're bending over backwards to get him to attend, suggesting he just attends for 1 hour like he does at school and even now talking about someone coming here after Easter to try and form a relationship/bridge. It's really heartbreaking as it would be absolutely perfect for him and a brilliant opportunity to do things he's actually interested in if he'd give it a chance.

So, I'm currently working from home 3 days a week, spending hours talking to a duvet which usually doesn't even respond, expecting a phone call from school about where the £100 a session funding is going (answer = not my choice, not my problem) and worrying myself sick about his future. He was given expected grade 9s a few years ago and now has 2 hours of education a week!

@YorkshireTeaDrinker2
sorry for a delayed response.

How are things with your DD?

My reasons for home educating were different to yours in that I didn’t have an anxious child, but children whose love of learning was being metaphorically beaten out of them by school (primary). I was a teacher too and I was seeing the same thing happening to my own DC as to the ones I was teaching. Like you say, life is too short to spend years being forced into something you hate. To learn on another’s timeline. I was hating the ‘one size fits all’ rigid, dry, boring, academic approach to school. The arts and creativity have been squeezed out in favor of a heavy emphasis on Maths and English 🥱 yes it’s important to be literate and to be able to add up but the teach to the test style of education is killing not just creativity but many kids love of learning too.

We love our home ed life. We are quite ‘unschool-y’ which means we don’t do school at home, we create opportunities for our children to learn through their interests and through life unforced. It is joyful way of life and I enjoy spending lots of time with my children and doing life together. We go to lots of groups and workshops so they have lots of friends and opportunities to socialize. I highly recommend it.

It sounds like you are a very curious about it all yet I understand what you say about not wanting to make the wrong decision. I can relate to that! I remember feeling that way when I finally clicked send on the email to deregister them! Not once have I regretted it. Not for one single second.

For those with a child under the duvet I’ve been there daily when we were trying to get her into school. really recommend listening to one of Naomi Fishers webinar zooms on how to talk to PDA kids. Also is there anything they are interested in? I’ve tempted my child with board games lying around, jigsaws half started, I’ve started baking and suggested they may like to join in. This reduces the perceived “demand” on them (she’s nearly 13) so it’s almost like parallel play or an activity which if I can slowly engage them with it opens up opportunities to chat. Going for a drive to the “shop” when actually I’m just giving them the chance to chat & I just listen. The pda website has some good low demand parenting tips. Hope it helps someone

I have a couple of Naomi Fisher books but I've just looked on Spotify and there are a number of pods with her on really worth a listen when you think you are battling alone or can't see the wood for the trees.

Reading posts on here liike @HoobleDooble you wonder exactly what century are we in. I've started thinking we have gone back to looking after our kids with SEND at home again and schools/LA's are pushing parents into this.
My thoughts are with everyone going through this.

My DD school is now saying that until we provide medical evidence of EBSA from her GP, they will mark her as an unauthorised absence. I’ve already shared with them the psychologist’s diagnosis of anxiety, ASD, SPD. School have referred her to CAMHS themselves for anxiety and EBSA. What more do they need the GP to add?

@EHCPerhaps, does the psychology report specifically say your child is currently unable to attend school for medical reasons, i.e. anxiety? If not, that might be why they need the GP's letter. The fact that a child has anxiety, ASD and SPD does not in itself demonstrate that the child is unable to attend school as a result.

Ideally a medic needs to be prepared to say something like "X has a diagnosis of anxiety connected to his diagnoses of ASD and SPD. His anxiety is severe and he is not currently able to attend school as a result. If any attempt were made to make him attend, this would be seriously prejudicial to his mental health. Currently we do not know when, if ever, X will be able to return to school."

@EHCPerhaps email the school and copy in the LA reminding them the DfE’s attendance guidance states absences should be recorded as authorised where pupils cannot attend due to illness (both physical and mental health related). And, unless the school has genuine and reasonable doubts about the authenticity of the absences they should not be requesting medical evidence. Also, the regulations (Education (Pupil Registration) (England) Regulations 2006) make it clear where a pupil is absent because they are unable to attend due to their medical needs the absence must be regarded as authorised.

If alternative education under s.19 of the Education Act 1996 is not in place and/or an EHCNA has not been requested go on to say the school and LA could have done and still can do more to support DD with her needs arising from her MH/SEN.

He has gone in for two hours today for the first time in a month. I did a happy dance.

@BrambleyHedge
Yayyyy!!!

Hi, I'm late to join but I'm in the same position. DD aged 16 has barely attended school since November. She's autistic and I believe depressed or in burnout. School have said today that she sits her GCSEs this year or leaves. She's extremely clever and would likely pass them all despite missing content and not doing work, just not with the 9s she'd like. I don't know if she can manage it though.

@BrambleyHedge That's great news.

You need an EHCP. Mine made it through GCSE and fell apart at A level.

Hooray! It must feel like a (bit of) a weight has lifted.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow I assume that there's no disadvantage in applying for an EHCP? I mean, if she actually manages to do her GCSEs and go onto sixth form.

Ideally she wants to redo year 11, but remotely and just go in for exams. I actually think she'd be best getting them over with but I don't know if she'll manage that.

Also, am I right in thinking that you can take longer over A levels if you have an EHCP? I know some pupils have done a year 14 (although I think new head is putting a stop to it) but if she takes 3 years over GCSEs, I think the usual funding would only last 2 years for A levels.

@Dandelionsordaffodils rven without an EHCP, resits and retakes in a Y14 can be possible where there are exceptional circumstances or good educational reasons. You can read the 16-19 funding regulations here. The relevant paragraphs are 88-90 (about resits and retakes) and 44/45 (about age).

An EHCP would allow even more flexibility and can remain in place until 25, or 26 in some circumstances. An EHCP would enable DD to continue with GCSEs, including via an online provider if that is required.

The benefit of an EHCP is if they are required it can also include therapies DC wouldn’t otherwise get, more frequently, for longer and without the need to sit on the normal waiting lists.

I can feel and relate to the pain and despair you all experience with EBSA. We had got to a point with DS11 of really considering home ed for him as he was so deeply unhappy, like others he has ASD and was struggling with lack of friendships, struggling on the academic side, struggling to just understand the world I think. I did pull him out of his mainstream school and had him home for 13 weeks. We were then in the incredibly privileged position to move him to a very small independent specialist school and have seen positive progress. He now fits in, as over 50% of his class have diagnosed SEN, and I think he finds it much easier to relate to other neurodiverse children, they are also all much more tolerant of one another. The support for his dyslexia is allowing him to gain some confidence in his abilities and they allow voice to text software in the classroom. We still have days where he doesn’t want to go in, usually after a school holiday or if he has been unwell but the difference is that he does find the strength to go back on time despite the anxiety.

I recognise that this isn’t an option available to all, and also can’t relax into this new normal as I know it only takes something small to take a massive leap backwards, but it has given me hope for the future.

@SearchingForSolitude Thank you, that's useful.

@Feralgremlin Glad to hear that things are better for your DS.

It’s all so difficult
DS hasn’t attended really now since Christmas
We had the EHCP decision not to issue panel outcome meeting yet and they have started talking about other provision - a robot which will stream lessons to home (he’s Y6 so primary so don’t know how this will work) or maybe tutors

so positive that he might access learning but they’re still not addressing the underlying issues and just talking about anxiety. How do you convince an LA that the problem isn’t anxiety, that’s the symptom? I don’t see how even if we manage to send him back into the same learning environment without any extra support is going to have a different outcome. Especially when he transitions to secondary where the sensory overwhelm, social problems will get worse

we have a follow up meeting next week so hopefully they’ll start to get it

If my child was year 6 this point in the year is just all Sats focus hugely anxiety inducing on an already stressed child I would just stop the formal learning. Sats are of No benefit to the child it’s all about school league tables. Focus on your child’s mental health follow their interests develop learning in other ways to keep them engaged whilst you can. Im speaking as a parent of a child who sounds similar who has now fallen out the main school system in secondary but is slowly re engaging with learning (at a high level) because they want to not because they are being made to fit in a square box they didn’t fit into. Trust your instincts you know your child best and what they need to thrive.

Thank you! He is bright and really bored at home where we both work full time so we thought the learning would give him something to do. But it’s so dry! Obvs just sats practice! Tons of worksheets without teacher input

He passed the 11+ and has a place at grammar for sept so we were worried about him getting behind and that causing more issues in Sept

but we made a big decision late last night (deadline for changes to offered school was midnight) and have put him on the waiting list for the comp where all his friends are going and have also filled out the appeal forms. Just to remove some of that pressure as I really don’t think he’s up to it

he’s ASD and if he was himself (although he’s been on a downward spiral for 2 years since Y4 including a clinically diagnosed and treated eating disorder) I think he’d thrive there and they’ve got loads of asd provision. But we’ve recognised that 2 years is a lot to unpick by Sept and sending him constantly back to a mainstream without support is just never going to get any better - especially in a competitive academic set up

so there we are
hopefully we can now give him the time to heal and hope and hope that the LA will address the fundamental underlying issues with MS and not keep focussing on the resulting anxiety

hope everyone else is able to enjoy the relative peace of the weekend before we go again next week…