A thread about Psychopaths…

[Thedryjanuarydiaries]

Spurred on from another recent thread and really just put on interest, I’m wondering if there is anyone out there that would admit to being/knowing someone who scored high on a Psychopathy scale…

Not the Netflix serial killer type but the possible high ( and sometimes ruthless) achievers with low empathy skills and who have to work hard to conform to our social standards and laws.

If so what do you think stops them from committing a crime, acting on impulse and being able to live a normal life.

I wonder what these kind of people look like, if I’d know when having a conversation with them that they were weird differently, how hard they have to work to understand humour, love and go on to me maternal/paternal parents…

I do always find the “Have you ever felt evilnesses” type threads interesting but I’m always left wondering if people are picking up on personality disorders especially when there is no reasons to be unsettled by said person.

This is an interesting thread, I hope you don't mind, but I have a question for you my fellow curious pals, would you ever be able to do something like be a pen pal to a incarcerated psychopath, like someone like bellfield? I don't think I could with a killer!

I've told this story(s) before but I'm not sure if I name changed to tell them but the first one is someone I was related to was murdered by a very famous 90s serial killer, I knew this person had died as I was very young, we didn't have a house phone (poverty stricken we were in the day!) And I remember having to walk the phone box constantly with my parents whilst they found out what actually had occurred with this relation, but I wasn't privy to the information due to my age and the horrific nature of his murder.
Anyway during lockdown when true crime YouTube reached its peak I was watching a video and it was actually quite a stomach turning case so I was going to turn it off but just didn't, no idea why not and then the youtuber said this relatives name and his picture flashed on screen. I never had been told that how he died, I'd been told stories like he'd been hit by a car or overdosed, always something sad but the story constantly changed. That was horrid, his killer is one of the cruellest psychopaths I've heard of.

My second psychopath story is when we moved house, this very charming and handsome man helped my parents move some furniture into the house from the rental van, I know I was early primary school age. He was our next door neighbour and he had a really cool workshop in his garden and he was a crafty type, very friendly. I had taken a shine to him and asked my mum could I go see his workshop, he'd said I could go around and see his model planes etc if I wanted and my mother would ordinarily have said yes, it was the 90s etc, but she said no each time I asked, anyway this neighbour ended up being arrested and jailed for collecting stray dogs or rehoming them from kennels and Killing them in his workshop. He'd have well murdered an annoying little chubby wee chatterbox me had I gone, wouldn't he?!

I think a family member has psychopathic traits, though not an out and out psychopath. A need to be the one in control in relationships, superficially charming, but a lack of the 'chip' necessary to be a real occupier of that family role. Always making the point that they are better educated in comparison to other family members, remarkably immature and using other people to achieve the control of others, not allowing partners to walk away but drawing them back by using their emotional vulnerabilities.

Your last sentence made me feel so sad. I understand what you mean because of your awful experience but you’re clearly an eloquent thoughtful person. You are worth being here. Sorry your mum was like that.

I think one guy I knew, he was in the SAS so it was possibly a desirable trait....

Yes I could but I’d get over invested and probably fall in love with them or something stupid like that so I would never. I was raised in such away that I have attachment issues and am far too empathetic. I’d reason out everything they’d done and end up feeling sorry for them. And if they were a psychopath I’m sure they’d easily trick me.

Are all killers psychopaths?

I’m pretty sure my cousin is a psychopath. A few traits I’ve noticed:

Zero empathy.
Immensely charming.
Completely in control of her emotions.
Very manipulative.
Incredibly spiteful and does all she can to hurt people, but in a sly, subtle way, saying things she knows will upset them or play on their mind.
Stirs things up and sets one person against another, often isolating and driving people out of the group for the sheer fun of it.
Hides the real person behind a mask.
Is narcissistic/histrionic and self-dramatising.
Compulsive liar.
Tough and fearless.
Fakes emotion - says things like “so sad isn’t it!” etc, yet you know she feels nothing.

>> Are all killers psychopaths?

A high proportion of murderers in prison are psychopaths but not all. some people kill through anger / rage / heat of the moment. But psychopaths don't feel much emotion - they are the cold calculating killers who plan things in advance.

@Devonshiregal I think a lot of killers are psychopaths, but not all. But the big names in the world of murderers, I'd say more so are, the Ted bundys etc.

What you say is actually really common with women who've grown up in quite unusual ways, so say domestic abuse. Women who write to serial killers etc in prison often have history of being abused throughout childhood/adolescence. So they seek to find what is their comfort zone, but at least with a serial killer in jail they're in more control than their imprisoned partner is.
Also you've said you're empathic, empathy, Reading the room/aware of others feelings is often a trauma response, so you've possibly been on eggshells etc and had to know your environment in order to protect yourself, maybe siblings or your mum maybe? It is all from my bits and pieces of reading on this I've done very connected. I'm happy you've never written to a dangerous monster. You deserve genuine love and respect!

Stay the fuck out of her way! Even reading that made my arm hair stand up 🤢

We have this thread a few times a year and there are a few of us who are happy to explain what it feels like to- this thread might be interesting to you https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/amiibeingunreasonable/4866125-psychopath

The ones I know definitely would kill or fuck over someone for monetary gain if they knew 100% they would get away with it and not care

I watched that documentary really enjoyed it.Very interesting

My mother. I think on first meeting most people will believe she's an entirely normal person, obviously some see through the charm. Unfortunately she usually takes set against most people she builds a relationship with, could take years. Obviously when this happens they realise how awful she really is. I could honestly write books about her and my experiences growing up.

I think my DH would score highly on a checklist but he's nothing like my mother in our home life.

I know two diagnosed. They are brothers. One was showing the signs from about 12, and the other from much younger. They have two normal sisters. Both are doing well now, in their 30s, having had a very bumpy 20s, criminal convictions, etc.

My mother is, at best, emotionally dead from the neck up and ,at worst, a psychopath. She was
far too short to use physical violence against us so she perfected manipulation. If we go to something that is neutral ( not about me) then she will be perfectly charming. If it's a thing that's all about her she comes across to outsiders as the most fabulous person ever. If we are at an event that's about me ( I am an artist and exhibit my work regularly) or someone says something positive about me then God help me quite frankly. When my father was dying at home ( Parkinsons so not a quick death) we had lots of carers and medical professionals in and out for months.She turned herself into some kind of saint. We just nodded and smiled when people told us how amazing she was and how they had never seen anyone care for a spouse like that. I am glad that I have discovered the grey rock method.It has made my 50s a lot easier.

This is so interesting. Awful to say about actual real life people but having just finished Alan Bates vs the Post Office this description seems an absolute fit for Paula Vennells and comms sidekick Angela van den Bogerd. How they both seek to come across as empathetic and understanding whilst turning the knife behind peoples backs.
There must've been a whole raft of socio/psychopaths at the Post Office though for that rampant prolonged gaslighting of innocent people to go on for so long- all in the name of "protecting the brand" above even their own personal human decency.
That series really should've shown more of them as well as those 2 women- seems they've been scapegoated when there must've been lots more at fault.

This word for word is my mother.

.

During lots of chats during lockdown my mother showed me a scar on her index finger and explained how she got it. When she was 5 her aunt had a baby boy. Aunt and uncle were living with my mother and her parents at the time.My mother walked in one day and her mother was holding the baby. She told me that she didn't like this so she went into the kitchen, got some scissors and cut her finger ( on the underside between the 2 joints). It bled so profusely her mother had to put the baby down and go and tend to her. Children get jealous of siblings but not many cut a chunk out of their flesh at 5

yes my sisters ex

charming no empathy ruthless and manuplative

I have a similar curiosity and on all the psychopath tests I've ever taken (which obviously are not "approved" ones as they're just whatever is available on the internet/psychology sites), I've always scored in the top 1% for psychopathic traits.

However (and it's a big however), I score very low for impulsivity. So I might have all sorts of thoughts about things, but I'm absolutely not going to act on them.
Also, while I don't "feel" empathy, I do "think" empathy - as in, I can imagine, dispassionately, how someone might be feeling in a situation, and as I do have a moral compass and strong ethics, I choose not to do the things I sometimes think about, or things that could be harmful to someone else, because they're not aligned with the person I want to be.

I'm very low anxiety, don't feel guilt/shame (but this is also because I don't act on ways that are contrary to my values, so I don't set much store by that) good at my job, largely unencumbered by negative emotions, and very very calm/good in a crisis. And I have lots of very good friends, great working relationships with my team and colleagues (evidenced by good scores in appraisals and peer & 360 degree feedback) and have never had a problem with partners/long term relationships, so I don't think it's a hindrance or affects my life much.

I have had to teach myself not to go for the killer lines when having a disagreement with someone though.... Mantra of "the argument is not worth winning at the cost of the friendship".

Similar to something mentioned by PP, I also have a number of autistic traits (commented on over a lifetime by multiple others, some of whom are qualified to make such diagnoses) although I've been masking them for so long (as I always felt very different to the emotion-driven way that everyone else seems to operate), that I have no idea whether I actually am or not, and whether these traits are more driven by possible autism, psychopathy, the interaction of the two, or something entirely different.

And for the avoidance of doubt, I am making no claims whatsoever about other people with autistic traits or diagnoses - I believe the phrase is "if you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person"...

I know a child protection social worker who seems to have strong psychopathic traits. She is actually very good at her job as unlike colleagues she does not get upset about what she hears about but is quite matter of fact. She cares about the children, but in the same way I would care about worms not being harmed. She has been doing the job for many years, while most people get burnt out or struggle to cope.
Psychopathic traits are not always a bad thing. There are theories that society needs people like this to do the work that is otherwise too emotionally draining.

On the darker side I knew a child who at age 7 tortured her pet hamster. Pinned it out on a board and literally tortured it. I worked in a school she attended.

I have an ex who stalked me. I strongly think sociopath or psychopath. He was in residential psychiatric care for a year when he was 11. I was naive in not overthinking his 'reason' for it at the time but I wonder what the genuine cause/diagnosis would have been then. A whole year in psych residential at 11. Can you tell from early adolescence?
All sociopaths have narcissism; not all narcissists are sociopaths.