Constance Marten & Mark Gordon - Baby A case

[SportMum1982]

What have I just read? What the actual fuck is wrong with the world. That poor baby. These utter idiots. Sorry I’m so so angry.

Constance Marten and partner ‘killed baby to keep her out of care’

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/24e56090-f175-4bf8-ac07-380621d9954f?shareToken=186074e86c05c4df704ef1889186acdc

lucky you, congratulations on your brain

Why thank you 🤗

@Yerroblemom1923 it's called the Trial & available on Apple Podcasts (I presume other places too).

I feel so sorry for the poor baby. What a horrible life it must have endured.

@BritneyBookClubPresident thank you.

Does anybody know whether the other children could be living with relatives? Or is it confirmed that they're within the care system? I was really hoping that her family might have stepped in.

Although there are instances of bad people coming from 'good' families, the general rule is dysfunctional families produce dysfunctional people

Perhaps they were assessed and found wanting, perhaps they refused to take the children on.

For the surviving children's privacy, this information will likely never be released

There was a scheme in America to pay women like this to sterilise themselves. The founder was demonised for it, but she had actually adopted the children of people like this several times. I think it’s a more humane approach than just letting people like this continue to give birth to children that will have mental and physical challenges due to their parents’ bad choices.

According to their Wiki they were trying to expand into the UK

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Prevention

Perhaps they were assessed and found wanting, perhaps they refused to take the children on.

Are siblings always adopted or forstered together or are they split up?

It entirely depends on their needs, which dictates their care plan, sibling assessments of whether on balance they should be placed together or apart, if assessments say they should be placed together searches for done for that, but if no adopters or foster placements can take them together then the care plan may have to change.

Its a very complicated set of factors determining that decision and it can be fluid with contingency plans built in

With family placements for example you might get a grandma saying, I can take Johnny but I cant take Sarah. So she is assessed to care for Johnny, but a sibling assessment might say they need to be placed together, so you have to decide on balance what is the best case scenario, for Johnny to be placed with family, have a permanent place with family outside of the care system and not be severed from his family by way of adoption, or is it better he is placed with his sister which is one of the longest relationships children have in their lives, their sibling relationship

On the other hand she might want to care for both, but the assessment finds she cant meet Johnny's particular needs but she might be able to meet Sarah's needs, so you then need to decide again what the best option is.

Depends entirely on the needs of the siblings and availability of placements/adopters

Thank you soupfiend and RowanMayfair.

But its a possibility? She has two brothers so they could have stopped in. Only one brother is pictured outside the court.
Maybe they weren't suitable/dysfunctional, as you say.
The whole thing is just so sad and unnessary and happens far too often. Only the other day I was reading about a couple who adopted a baby and ended up adopting a few more kids because the birth mother wouldn't stop having babies despite knowing they'd he taken at birth. All of the siblings have autism and developmental issues.

@therealduchess someone I know adopted the 11th child from the same woman who's had all of them removed at birth 😞

It's honestly sickening.
I've watched friends absolutely broken by fertility issues and then you've got people like this just churning innocent babies out.
I do genuinely think that the authorities should force contraception on some people!

Is anyone else still following the trial? I know the fire at the Old Bailey on Wed has meant some days have been lost but it all seems very slow.

When does it continue?

@Sonora25 they were supposed to be back in yesterday at midday but what with lunch and breaks there wasn't much news on The Argus live feed - which seems to be the fastest updating online newspaper.
Maybe today will bring something new. It's supposed to finish early March and apparently they're still on track.

Thanks. Still so many unanswered questions. I hope they both go down for a long time.

I read that they won't be resuming until tomorrow now (Wednesday) - something to do with 'administrative matters' to be dealt with by solicitors today! So with the fire and this, it will have delayed things by a whole week.

Sorry @mathanxiety just stepped away from this thread for a while to help my MH. I find this subject takes a toll and sometimes I have to disengage.

Would you say the parents considered love to be a feeling they experienced, and the baby reflected a feeling of 'love' back to them (almost like an interactive toy)? But they couldn't do the verb 'to love' - which involves an appreciation of the reality of the baby's nature (and needs) and a great deal of thankless work?

Yes, I think they had a very immature idea of what love was like and had no ability to think about her needs. To be honest, I think even meeting their own needs was a massive challenge for them both. I would guess that it only worked between them because they could each talk to each other - so adding the needs of someone who could not speak for herself was too much for them.

I feel so sad for that poor little baby girl. I had my baby at the same time that she would have been born and I am feeling haunted that she was freezing, hungry, dirty and being mishandled and cared for, and that she was left in a shed in a plastic bag. I cannot stop thinking about it, I feel truly so sad for her the poor little thing and it’s driving me a bit mad that they let that happen to a baby.

I just read something awful on the bbc news website. Their actions are incomprehensible.

Their behaviour in the clip released by the court today is bizarre.

A Lidl bag that also contained two empty drink cans.

And a copy of The Sun.