The post office scandal

[Bringonthesun24]

Not sure if there is a thread. There probably is. I've just watched this video and I'm utterly in shock!

It seems that there could be potential for people at fujitsi to have altered the post masters accounts which could have been ordered by the top at the post office.

Why did they get rid of only that 1 vistor book. Why did they pay that guy a visit the day after he went to fujitsu.

There is so much more to this than meets the eye. I've watched some of videos and clips of other post masters and it breaks my heart to see how broken they are. How their lives were ripped from them and the shame they had to bear whilst knowing they were innocent. I actuay feel so angry for them.

Why is something only being done now after a bloody drama on TV. Why were the public not as aware of this scandal?

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGejPxjAx/

Sorry for the very many typos btw

Several threads.

One here:
www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4975307-to-draw-your-attention-to-mr-bates-vs-the-post-office?page=1

Another here:
www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4975888-to-be-absolutely-aghast-after-watching-mr-bates-v-the-post-office?page=1

And yes, it's absolutely gobsmacking.

Sorry I thought there may be others. Thanks for linking

Don't apologise! Worth helping others find them!

'Why is something only being done now after a bloody drama on TV. Why were the public not as aware of this scandal?'

This scandal has been public knowledge for years Op but for some reason has not been headline news, which it should have been. And so the Government has known about it for years too, but has dragged its feet in doing anything positive about it.

Now that it has been brought to wider public attention they are doing something about it and arranging proper compensation and quashing of prosecutions. Things they could & should have done years ago.

The fact that these victims have had to fight for so many years to get redress is a massive scandal all on its own. I am glad they are finally getting some justice but it is years late, it has come too late for some.

It's yet another example of ill-thought-out technology sold to make lives easier, but capable of doing much more harm than good. Once upon a time, the Post Office used pen and paper records, which worked perfectly well. Nowadays, it's trial by "computer says no". No doubt the technology was sold to make postmasters' lives easier, or foisted on them, and look where it got them.

See also:
Keyless cars: now much easier to steal than before.

Smart meters: although lauded by many, whole threads have been dedicated to the wrongs of them.

Electric cars: limited range, they catch fire spontaneously, if you're stuck in a jam in snow, you can't keep the heating on, they break roads and bridges because of their weight, and the electricity to power them has to come from somewhere. (That's what they don't tell you.)

Cashless society: fine until your internet provider pulls the plug on your wifi, then you might not be able to take money at all. (I've seen this happen: businesses with signs saying "we are cashless" looking sheepish, and having to say "sorry, we can only take cash today, our internet is down".)

Everything stored in your phone: oops, forgot to charge it, now you're absolutely screwed.

Alexa. Can you close the curtains without her?

Why now? Because the scriptwriters, all praise to him/her/them, assembled 20+ years of amorphous bits and pieces into a single, understandable, whole unit then humanised it with an exemplary cast and production. It took 3 years to make. It's an astonishing achievement, all praise to everyone involved. Without it, everyone affected would still be in the limbo they were forced into. As I watched it unfold, my anger grew, as I'm sure happened to most of us. Each time something appalling occurred it was followed by something worse. I hope they get a resolution although many remain suspicious that they're near the end. Who can blame them? Awful to see the actual sub postmasters interviewed. So many lives trampled on for a bit if corporate face-saving. Like pulling the wings off flies for fun. Nothing can adequately compensate them.

It has had plenty of publicity over the years (one of the families featured is local to me so maybe greater awareness here) but it has never built up enough momentum to get everyone talking about it like this show has, it's an incredible achievement by the team.

Why is something only being done now after a bloody drama on TV. Why were the public not as aware of this scandal?

The public inquiry started nearly 2 years ago. BBC has been reporting on the issue for years - Panorama documentary from 2022 was repeated on BBC1 last night.

ITV drama appealed to parts of the public that news and current affairs doesn't reach. Kudos to ITV.

There's been news available about this for years. As a PP said, Panorama reported, there was a public enquiry, Marina Hyde's been pushing it in the Guardian, I'm all over it because I read the Law Society Gazette. Computer Weekly and Private Eye have been pushing it for ever.

But it's always been the way that a compelling prime time terrestrial drama will capture the general public's attention and make them feel things like nothing else (apart from really dramatic live news footage).

Why were the public not as aware of this scandal?

I was, Private Eye having been covering for years, but the Tory government constantly washed their hands of any responsibility.

And now this government have suddenly decided it's so very urgent that they're planning a government intervention in judicial decisions – damaging the principle of judicial independence. <facepalm>

Can scheme to quash Post Office convictions work?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-67940193
It will be some weeks before the legislation is presented to Parliament, but we have a pretty clear idea of what the headlines translate to - and why, on a much deeper level, it represents a constitutional leap into the dark, albeit for a noble cause.
[...]
The only realistic alternative to all of this was to find some way to speed up the Court of Appeals process.
The former Lord Chief Justice, Lord Thomas, told the BBC earlier this week that the courts could handle the workload.
There are, for instance, recently retired highly experienced Court of Appeal judges who could help run the cases in large batches.
Serving judges don't comment on Parliament and politics - but there is a lot of nervousness in the legal world from which they are drawn.
Constitutionally, Parliament and politicians have no business interfering with the decisions of courts - that is how power is separated and balanced in the UK. This plan tips that delicate balance.

This government are lurching from one dangerous wrong to another.

I'm really squeamish about parliament imposing justice by law. But the problem is that if you let 900 wrongful convictions go back to the court to be overturned properly, even with a Supreme Court finding that all Horizon-based evidence should be disregarded, the already desperately overloaded criminal justice system would take years to run through them.

It would also mean that existing criminal cases were delayed even longer, causing immense problems for innocent accuseds or victims waiting to give evidence and see justice.

Yes indeed, they'd have to do something like set up sessions with the "recently retired highly experienced Court of Appeal judges who could help run the cases in large batches" in order not to impinge too severely on the existing workload of the criminal justice system.

The writer was Gwyneth Hughes, there's a moving interview with her here: Writer of Post Office scandal TV drama ‘astounded’ by reaction | Post Office Horizon scandal | The Guardian

www.politicshome.com/thehouse/article/lord-arbuthnot-reviews-mr-bates-vs-post-office

This from the Tory MO portrayed.

In addition, the Post Office is still hindering the official enquiry into it all (two years and counting), presumably in the hope it will all disappear.

The scandal has been known about for years. I don't know whether to be furious that it has taken a TV drama to galvanise our politicians into actually doing something about this, or simply to feel grateful that ITV has produced something that has finally made people pay attention.

The drama was exceptionally well made, so it's easy to see why it had such an impact. All kudos to ITV. However, what I still can't really understand is why the whole thing has been allowed to drag on for so many years. Some of the victims have been waiting for justice for 2 whole decades, and their lives have fallen apart in the meantime.

Maybe we are all responsible for not putting more pressure on our MPs to get this stuff sorted. Maybe we have too much faith in the system and assume that justice will be done when so often it isn't? How many other scandals/miscarriages of justice are still not being addressed, and are we going to have to wait for ITV or another broadcaster to come along and make a drama out of it?

A Post Office Investigator is currently giving evidence to the Inquiry on BBC2. They've just gone for a break, resuming at ten to twelve.

They're reprising. He may be an investigator but he's an extremely poor witness. Quite concerning.

"I'm not technically minded" says the man responsible for accusing dozens of people of fraud courtesy of the PO dodgy software. What next? "I don't know how to use a knife, says 3* Michelin chef"

There was an excellent, detailed Radio 4 series about it in 2020. www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/brand/m000jf7j