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Original poster

Any Employment Lawyers or HR people around?

243 replies

Marie2023 · 19/11/2023 06:31

I could really do with some guidance, if that’s OK.

Basically I have been bullied at work by a very senior member of staff. The Board are now involved. It is clear that me and the member of staff can no longer work together so I have offered to leave.

I have been told that I will receive a ‘generous payout’. The thing is, I don’t know what I should be expecting. Given the time of year, I may be out of work for some time.

So what does a ‘generous payout’ look like, in relation to monthly salary? Any ideas please?

Thanks.

OP posts:
Original poster
Marie2023 · 20/11/2023 07:32

@AlisonDonut, I thought the same thing, but she didn’t mean that.

Any Employment Lawyers or HR people around?
OP posts:
wildwestpioneer · 20/11/2023 07:41

I had a compromise agreement with a previous employer, they gave me 4 months tax free lump sum, I didn't work my 1 months notice period so had another months pay (5 months in total), the compromise agreement means that I couldn't take them to court but they had to give me a positive reference. So this might not be what you want if you're planning on going to a tribunal.

Starseeking · 20/11/2023 07:48

When I was in a similar situation, having experienced sexism, racism, ableism (of a close relative) severe bullying and sidelining I ended up resigning for a new job, and raised constructive dismissal.

I asked for 6 months and they negotiated me down to 3 gross. By the time £30k tax free was covered, it amounted to 4 months net, so I was pretty pleased. I could have continuing arguing for more, but by then I'd started my new job, and wanted to leave all that stress behind me.

Get a solicitor quickly, gather all your paperwork, show you mean business, and don't be afraid to push for them to compensate you for what you have suffered.

Having been there myself, it's relentless and awful going through something like this, as there's no way of getting away from it. I hope you are able to recover from the experience quickly.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Employment advice
Rosscameasdoody · 20/11/2023 07:48

IMustDoMoreExercise · 19/11/2023 16:56

Of course it does. That is exactly what she meant. What else could it mean?

Show quote history

It means exactly what this poster said. To use more neutral language - neither nice nor nasty.

pam290358 · 20/11/2023 07:51

Starseeking · 20/11/2023 07:48

When I was in a similar situation, having experienced sexism, racism, ableism (of a close relative) severe bullying and sidelining I ended up resigning for a new job, and raised constructive dismissal.

I asked for 6 months and they negotiated me down to 3 gross. By the time £30k tax free was covered, it amounted to 4 months net, so I was pretty pleased. I could have continuing arguing for more, but by then I'd started my new job, and wanted to leave all that stress behind me.

Get a solicitor quickly, gather all your paperwork, show you mean business, and don't be afraid to push for them to compensate you for what you have suffered.

Having been there myself, it's relentless and awful going through something like this, as there's no way of getting away from it. I hope you are able to recover from the experience quickly.

The OP hasn’t worked for the company for the statutory two years to be able to raise a case at tribunal. If she has no protected characteristics to claim discrimination, there’s not much she can do.

Katrinawaves · 20/11/2023 07:58

That’s a good offer but given some of the posts you’ve read on this thread, to set your mind at ease, I’d respond

”Many thanks for your text. To enable me to consider your offer I’d like to get some legal advice. Please would you provide me with a draft settlement agreement and confirm that the company will cover the costs of one hour legal advice in respect of this matter.”

This is a commonplace request - and you will need legal advice on the settlement agreement to make it legally binding, so companies routinely pay this as part of a settlement agreement so they will be expecting this cost.

Good luck - sounds like you are close to being able to put this all behind you.

Katrinawaves · 20/11/2023 08:01

Starseeking · 20/11/2023 07:48

When I was in a similar situation, having experienced sexism, racism, ableism (of a close relative) severe bullying and sidelining I ended up resigning for a new job, and raised constructive dismissal.

I asked for 6 months and they negotiated me down to 3 gross. By the time £30k tax free was covered, it amounted to 4 months net, so I was pretty pleased. I could have continuing arguing for more, but by then I'd started my new job, and wanted to leave all that stress behind me.

Get a solicitor quickly, gather all your paperwork, show you mean business, and don't be afraid to push for them to compensate you for what you have suffered.

Having been there myself, it's relentless and awful going through something like this, as there's no way of getting away from it. I hope you are able to recover from the experience quickly.

Those are all protected characteristics however which mean that there is no cap on compensation and no statutory qualifying period. The OP hasn’t raised any protected characteristics in any of her posts so is in a completely different position

SawX · 20/11/2023 08:08

I had a settlement agreement with less than two years' service. It was about 2.5 months' salary. In hindsight I probably could have got a bit more but I knew I was entitled to nothing so didn't rock the boat. I'm still not sure why they didn't just fire me as there was no potential for a discrimination claim.

user701 · 20/11/2023 08:10

She’s received the bloody offer and still the bollocks continues.

OP that offer is fair given everything you’ve disclosed. I’ve been doing this for 26 years. You don’t have a claim. Take the money and move on. Next time don’t overplay your hand.

Janeandme · 20/11/2023 08:24

Katrinawaves · 20/11/2023 07:58

That’s a good offer but given some of the posts you’ve read on this thread, to set your mind at ease, I’d respond

”Many thanks for your text. To enable me to consider your offer I’d like to get some legal advice. Please would you provide me with a draft settlement agreement and confirm that the company will cover the costs of one hour legal advice in respect of this matter.”

This is a commonplace request - and you will need legal advice on the settlement agreement to make it legally binding, so companies routinely pay this as part of a settlement agreement so they will be expecting this cost.

Good luck - sounds like you are close to being able to put this all behind you.

She’s not going to get more, what they have offered is very generous. They wish her to resign immediately, so clearly more here than the op is saying, specifically as the allegations she is making appear recent and the ceo is asking for them in writing.

Cazziebo · 20/11/2023 08:25

That is a very fair- to the point of generous - email from the CEO. I'd suggest you accept this as you obviously have lost faith in the employer. Ask for a settlement agreement in writing and as part of that, a guaranteed positive reference. As others have advised, the company will fund limited legal advice.

In my business, we would recognise this as a "bad hire" and assume joint responsibility for the employment relationship not working out. I'd like to think we would strive to be fair but I don't think we be as generous as this.

Original poster
Marie2023 · 20/11/2023 08:26

@Janeandme can you explain what you mean here? I don’t quite understand.

They wish her to resign immediately, so clearly more here than the op is saying, specifically as the allegations she is making appear recent and the ceo is asking for them in writing.

OP posts:
soupmaker · 20/11/2023 08:29

user701 · 20/11/2023 08:10

She’s received the bloody offer and still the bollocks continues.

OP that offer is fair given everything you’ve disclosed. I’ve been doing this for 26 years. You don’t have a claim. Take the money and move on. Next time don’t overplay your hand.

Completely agree. OP take the deal, move on.

Janeandme · 20/11/2023 08:33

Marie2023 · 20/11/2023 08:26

@Janeandme can you explain what you mean here? I don’t quite understand.

They wish her to resign immediately, so clearly more here than the op is saying, specifically as the allegations she is making appear recent and the ceo is asking for them in writing.

Sorry yes op, the letter says if yoh wish to resign immediately.

honestly it’s a very generous offer, you don’t want them to rescind it.

OdeToBarney · 20/11/2023 08:37

user701 · 20/11/2023 08:10

She’s received the bloody offer and still the bollocks continues.

OP that offer is fair given everything you’ve disclosed. I’ve been doing this for 26 years. You don’t have a claim. Take the money and move on. Next time don’t overplay your hand.

I agree (also an employment lawyer) although I'd want to know exactly what she said when she raised concerns, just to rule out any potential whistleblowing claim (which seems very unlikely, but just to be sure).

Rosscameasdoody · 20/11/2023 08:38

Starseeking · 20/11/2023 07:48

When I was in a similar situation, having experienced sexism, racism, ableism (of a close relative) severe bullying and sidelining I ended up resigning for a new job, and raised constructive dismissal.

I asked for 6 months and they negotiated me down to 3 gross. By the time £30k tax free was covered, it amounted to 4 months net, so I was pretty pleased. I could have continuing arguing for more, but by then I'd started my new job, and wanted to leave all that stress behind me.

Get a solicitor quickly, gather all your paperwork, show you mean business, and don't be afraid to push for them to compensate you for what you have suffered.

Having been there myself, it's relentless and awful going through something like this, as there's no way of getting away from it. I hope you are able to recover from the experience quickly.

These are all protected characteristics for which you can raise a claim without the statutory 2 years service. The OP doesn’t have any of that so with only 14 months service is not eligible to claim for anything.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 20/11/2023 08:43

wildwestpioneer · 20/11/2023 07:41

I had a compromise agreement with a previous employer, they gave me 4 months tax free lump sum, I didn't work my 1 months notice period so had another months pay (5 months in total), the compromise agreement means that I couldn't take them to court but they had to give me a positive reference. So this might not be what you want if you're planning on going to a tribunal.

OP can’t take them to tribunal - she has worked there less than 2 years.

Rosscameasdoody · 20/11/2023 08:47

Katrinawaves · 20/11/2023 07:58

That’s a good offer but given some of the posts you’ve read on this thread, to set your mind at ease, I’d respond

”Many thanks for your text. To enable me to consider your offer I’d like to get some legal advice. Please would you provide me with a draft settlement agreement and confirm that the company will cover the costs of one hour legal advice in respect of this matter.”

This is a commonplace request - and you will need legal advice on the settlement agreement to make it legally binding, so companies routinely pay this as part of a settlement agreement so they will be expecting this cost.

Good luck - sounds like you are close to being able to put this all behind you.

Why would she do this ? She’s worked there for less than 2 years and has no leverage. The offer is a good one - company is offering more than the legal minimum. She’s not going to get more, so why risk them rescinding the offer ?

Original poster
Marie2023 · 20/11/2023 08:48

May I ask how your responses would differ had I been there for the magic 2 years?

OP posts:
MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 20/11/2023 08:54

Marie2023 · 20/11/2023 08:48

May I ask how your responses would differ had I been there for the magic 2 years?

What's the point? you haven't been there for 2 years, you've been there for 14 months and received the offer that a lot of us said was around the most you could expect.

The offer is a good one - company is offering more than the legal minimum. She’s not going to get more, so why risk them rescinding the offer ?

Exactly this. Start haggling and you'll piss them off and they'll withdraw it. You've pretty much resigned already, don't forget.

DaftyInTheMiddle · 20/11/2023 09:04

Well after 2 years you have the right to claim unfair dismissal. This means your employer would need to provide a fair reason for the dismissal and follow a fair dismissal procedure. Right now, they don’t. But playing whataboutery won’t help OP. Take the offer, keep them
onboard for a reference and put your energy into finding a new job.

Rosscameasdoody · 20/11/2023 09:07

Marie2023 · 20/11/2023 08:48

May I ask how your responses would differ had I been there for the magic 2 years?

With less than two years service you don’t have full employment rights, and aren’t entitled to raise a tribunal case. So I would think that had you had the required 2 years service, responses would differ mostly in that based on what you’ve said, you could potentially have a case for constructive dismissal. But you’ve only been there 14 months so tribunal isn’t an option and with no leverage the company has no obligation to pay you more than the legal minimum. They’re offering you more than they need to and if you start dicking them around they’ll rescind it.

Poonmig · 20/11/2023 09:11

OP- take the offer and start looking for a new job. You have 6 weeks to find something new and don’t have to work in that time, which will be helpful for your wellbeing.

remove the images of the text messages on this thread straight away - if they find them you may be in breach of your disciplinary or social media policy and face being dismissed.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 20/11/2023 09:13

OP- take the offer and start looking for a new job. You have 6 weeks to find something new and don’t have to work in that time, which will be helpful for your wellbeing

This. However hard done by you feel, you are very unlikely to get an offer better than that from your employer. Polish up the CV and start applying to agencies for temp work.

Janeandme · 20/11/2023 09:21

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 20/11/2023 09:13

OP- take the offer and start looking for a new job. You have 6 weeks to find something new and don’t have to work in that time, which will be helpful for your wellbeing

This. However hard done by you feel, you are very unlikely to get an offer better than that from your employer. Polish up the CV and start applying to agencies for temp work.

Exactly. It’s often fairly easy to pick up seasonal work over Christmas.

op you need to start applying for jobs if you live pay cheque to pay cheque. Take whatever you get, be it stacking shelves or wrapping parcels. And then at the same time, sign up to an agency for temp work and also applying for jobs you’d like longer term.

you got this job at 58, no reason you can’t get another at 59. But honestly you have had a really good offer, grab it with both hands and get yourself sorted, time will get away from you otherwise.