Any Employment Lawyers or HR people around?

[Marie2023]

I could really do with some guidance, if that’s OK.

Basically I have been bullied at work by a very senior member of staff. The Board are now involved. It is clear that me and the member of staff can no longer work together so I have offered to leave.

I have been told that I will receive a ‘generous payout’. The thing is, I don’t know what I should be expecting. Given the time of year, I may be out of work for some time.

So what does a ‘generous payout’ look like, in relation to monthly salary? Any ideas please?

Thanks.

Yes as you have been told multiple times by multiple people

You said in your op you offered to leave, which is it, forced or offered

below 2 years they can just fire you and say it’s not working out. As long as it’s not discriminatory then they can just get rid.

Are they offering a settlement agreement? I’ve seen it done for under 2 years service when there have been events happen that the employee wants to keep quiet

I’d imagine they’ll compensate you for loss of office and pay up your notice period.

if they go the settlement route, they also have to pay for you to get advice from an employment lawyer - but again, under 2 years you don’t have as many rights so probably don’t have much negotiation power

Ah OK, I didn’t know that. My Notice Period is 2 weeks 😞. I live paycheck to paycheck in insecure rented accommodation. That’s me screwed.

Yes, an employer can end your contract for any reason other than discrimination for having a protected characteristic at any point in the first 2 years.

You might want to get onto the ACAS website and get an idea of your rights but in all honesty, within 2 years you are not likely to be able to take them to a tribunal and if you did, any award given would be pretty pathetic. And that's after a few years of stress so best to cut your losses.

So as others have said, unless there is clear discrimination of a protected characteristic, they are likely only to pay your notice period because there are no legal grounds on which you can claim over and above that (unless they are feeling particularly generous), also ‘bullying’ isn’t recognised - it comes under harassment instead.

I just got 6 months payout after 6 years service. I could probably have got more if I’d been willing to take to court for sex discrimination but I was suicidal at the time and didn’t have it in me to do so. What happened to me was much more severe than what appears to have happened to you (from what you have written so far). There is an element of being realistic in this; a company will only pay what it is contractually/legally obliged to pay, or whether they think there’s a real risk you can take them to court for discrimination and win (doesn’t seem like this applies In your case) and it seems in this scenario that that is likely to be your notice period.

for your own mental health, start looking for new roles now whilst you negotiate your exit and you might find you walk straight into a new role (I did), good luck!

in theory no however with less than 2 years service in a company legally you can do very little about it if they do so reasons to end your employment can be created. Role no longer required, a ‘ restructure’ budget/ funding issues, new direction for the company going into next year, concerns about performance, attendance, behaviours and attitude. If your company want you to leave and there are concerns unfounded or not and directors are in agreement it will more than likely happen one way or another.

I had this recently. I got two months salary and a good reference but I had to sign an NDA to not talk about my time there unless it was an interview. I forgot one time, not saying anything bad and got a solicitors letter within a week.

Then I suggest you start looking for a new job asap!

I’m nearly 60 years old, no-one will want me.

You need to get a new job asap op. It doesn’t sound like there is even a grievance found in your favour,. No one can say if you’ve been bullied or not, without seeing evidence, but I suspect you will be offered 2 weeks pay, maybe 3 or 4, they are not going to give you more as it would be an acceptance of them doing wrong, as such. It’s likely to be two weeks notice.

Why wouldn’t anyone want you? Your age isn’t relevant. You need to agree with your employer on the reason you left and references.

You can be discriminated on for age, it's illegal. I'm nearly 60 and had no trouble finding another job, even tho this happened during COVID. Don't put yourself down

You should look for at least double this.

What you are looking at is a settlement agreement to go quietly and never speak of them again (NDA). Ignore redundancy options here - this is not relevant. You will need an employment solicitor go over the agreement with you once offered. I suggest you contact ACAS and/or an employment solicitor to get a feel what you could ask for. I would say to leave with immediate effect no less than 6 months (I would say a year if you have been there longer) + notice period + 3 months pension. This might be better coming from a solicitor to show you have done the homework.

Remember HR are there for the company, not you. Follow the money and remember who pays them.

Rubbish

She has no grounds to bring a claim.

OP the last two posters are clearly people who know nothing about employment law.

Hi Marie2023 - you're 60, presumably you have years of work history behind you. Get your CV buffed up (leave your age off it and only have the past 10 years employment), sign up with a few temp agencies and keep telling yourself the reasons any employer would be damned lucky to have you.

FTR, my last perm job I got aged 63 and was there four years. I'm going back to temping in the NY, where age doesn't matter as long as you're reliable and can do the job. Chin up and shoulders squared, you can do this.

Get a seasonal retail or bar job whilst you look for something else, OP. You’re not going to get enough of a payout to be able to chill until things pick up in the New Year, realistically.

The posters taking about six months’ payout are leading you up the garden path. You are not in a strong position. Please listen to the sensible advice from experienced posters. Your employer could give you two weeks’ notice tomorrow, remember, perfectly legally, with no obligation to provide a good reference.

Age discrimination?

Are you the oldest person in the team and do you feel that has a part to play as to why you are treated differently? is your manager much younger?

As other have said they can dismiss you for any reasons as long as it is not based on something discriminatory (gender, ageism, sexual orientation, disability) but if you can claim/show that your age influenced the bullying then you might have a case.

Make sure you get the content of your reference agreed with HR in writing as well so that this manager does not have further opportunities to sabotage your future job opportunities.

I’m baffled by why the Board has got involved in what sounds like a perfectly run of the mill conflict between a demanding boss and a demotivated employee! Presumably you contacted the Board @Marie2023?

I agree with the advice you have been given that the payout is unlikely to be significant - maybe a month’s salary in these circumstances - and would suggest to you that the most important thing to get out of this negotiation is a top notch agreed reference. Otherwise you will get a dates worked reference at best.

I would say to leave with immediate effect no less than 6 months (I would say a year if you have been there longer) + notice period + 3 months pension.

I don’t work in HR but have been a manager whose has seen dozens of settlement agreements. I’m stunned with that suggestion for a person with one year tenure, no protected characteristic and no allegation of wrongdoing that can’t be explained away by “fit” at the end of the day.

I agree with the advice you have been given that the payout is unlikely to be significant - maybe a month’s salary in these circumstances - and would suggest to you that the most important thing to get out of this negotiation is a top notch agreed reference. Otherwise you will get a dates worked reference at best

Agree this is the best outcome poster can hope for given how long she's been there.

Do you have legal cover as part of your buildings/contents insurance? They will be able to advise you/act for you.

Someone I know who was being made redundant unfairly was advised to lodge a formal grievance about all issues and also to submit a subject access request with reference to their name/job role etc.

The company presumably did not want to deal with this or release the information and the payout was increased substantially on the basis that the grievance and SAR were withdrawn.