Uni and foreign students would you say anything?

[thebraispink]

My DD is at uni doing a creative subject and basically she is having to help and support all of the foreign students with their work.

The uni have taken on so so many students who don't speak English over 60% of her course and put no translators in place, so my DD is having to help explain everything to those poor students who have broken English at best.

The uni has literally just taken all the money, it's making my DD course really dumbed down and keeping her back, it's not great for the foreign students as they are pretty out of their depth and miserable.

From my stance we are paying a shit ton for this course, and its teaching is poor and the overall experience is a bit shit.

All of these students will leave after 3 years, and take this education to their countries which is great but it leaves the UK students with a sub standard experience and shitty degree.

Should there be a limits on how many students can be from overseas? Should the uni have to provide interpreters? Is anyone else's kids in the same situation?

We are considering moving her from the uni on these grounds as she spends more time helping her peers than she does being taught.

In fact it is used as a route for migration as they're given visas to stay and work afterwards including dependants. There're plans to review this.

1. The vast majority (95%+) of students here on student visas return home.
2. From January dependants can no longer arrive with a student visa holder (unless for post grad research).

EnidSpyton has it spot on, and said pretty much what I was going to post, as someone who's worked at a London university for 20 years.

Also throw into the mix that lots of international, and at our place especially Chinese, students just want/are told to get any degree from a good UK university, so they are on courses they don't care about which means they often don't try to understand.

We also have so much cheating on assessments, eg when questioned about something they've written they cannot answer. All very sad as I get the impression those type are only here under pressure from parents.

Again im not sure by I would make this up?
I mean I can post the register if you'd like.

What would that prove? Unless you’re someone that thinks ‘foreign’ sounding names mean those people can’t speak English....which sort of says a lot about you.

I've already been over this.

I've already been over this.

I can’t see where you’ve explained posting the register would prove low levels of English. How would it show that?

I teach at a university. there aren't many international students on our courses but on those courses that do, the level in English is very varied so I'm not hugely surprised by what you say.
Has your daughter approached the module convenors? If not, her academic advisor?

She hasn't yet no, but heading into her 2nd year and with the information I can pass to her she will.

Her first year she raised a few concerns but we've just let her settle in and didn't think it was going to have any major impact.

It's frustrating that she is not getting the quality of teaching she expected. I would consider complaining to the uni on that front, particularly if she can evidence that the curriculum hasn't been covered.

I think she might come out of this with positives too though. The working world is becoming more and more international, and cultural competency is a very useful skill, so her experiences working closely with foreign students at uni could stand her in good stead.

Because over 60% of the students are Chinese and have poor English. Their surnames are Chinese names they have their English names as well.

She is living with the experience of the majority of students from mainland China on her course not being able to speak sufficient English to enable the lectures to work at the correct speed of the course.

What do you want me to say? She's a racist?

I believe you @thebraispink !

I don’t know what the answer is for your daughter in the long term but I believe you!

Is this one of the fashion BAs, or another course?

Graphic design

I agree 100% I've lived and worked in Asia for many years following my degree. Shes far from hating them individually hence feeling sorry for the poor buggers who are far away from home with zero language skills.

Shes just clearly getting annoyed by having to go over and over work.

@thebraispink I’m not sure when the universities started to have the power to self assess the English requirement for visa applications but a quick look at the archived immigration rules shows it’s been there since 2019 at least.

In theory it’s a good idea, as universities are better placed to determine their own language requirements for each course, but as with most changes to the immigration rules there are always people/organisations that abuse it which then normally results in stricter changes being introduced. This is why we can’t have nice things…

Just to reverse things a bit...I had a lecturer whose English was so bad that no one, and I mean not one single person in the class, could understand him. Well we could catch a couple of English words but his Korean accent was so thick there was no point in listening. And so maybe the university should not have employed him.

The saving grace was that it was a maths class (so lots of symbols and numbers instead of words) AND he wrote very comprehensive notes on the blackboard. The notes were in impeccable English so we all just copied them. He could have just handed out something but giving lectures was a mandatory part of the course.

Interesting, I’m slightly more surprised than if it was the fashion courses, but still completely believable.

Is she enjoying the course and London other than this? Has she got friends?

https://www.arts.ac.uk/study-at-ual/course-regulations/making-a-student-complaint

But you offered to post the register to prove your point. That wouldn’t prove anything about their English ability, would it?

Loves it thank you, and yes lots if friends from halls and house share.

No no it wouldn't. Happy?

My DH is still in touch with a man from Hong Kong who was at uni with him 15 years ago and has remained in Uk.
Despite passing all written exams at university the man really struggled in seminars and debates. 15 years on he still struggles in English and has never managed to get a "decent" graduate job

https://www.arts.ac.uk/study-at-ual/language-centre/english-language-requirements

Thank you

When I was at uni first time round (around 20 years ago now) I regularly used to get paired for lab work with a boy from China whose English was pretty poor. He couldn't follow the instructions that the lecturer would give at the start of the class and I would be asked to help him. Even when I explained it he didn't always get it, you needed to speak to him slowly in very simple English. Our Scottish accents may have been part of the reason that he found conversation difficult to follow, I don't know. I also don't know if they had English language requirements back then.

I didn't say anything at the time because to be honest, I didn't really mind, it was only a 4 hour lab weekly. However I can understand why it would impact on your daughter if it's a regular basis that she's being asked to support others. I can only suggest speaking to the lecturer.

Ahh that’s interesting from @StrawberryJellyBelly ’s link.

From September 2024/25 intake onwards, UAL will no longer accept any online at home English language tests.

which means right now they DO accept online at home English tests…surely ripe for abuse.

I’m so pleased she’s loving the rest of the art college/London experience. It would be a shame if she decided to leave as she’d lose all this.

Kind of explains the current situation.