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Original poster

Ds gas lighting Dd

106 replies

271726a · 06/10/2023 19:41

So ds who's 16 has caused alot of problems in the family. This includes DV and aggression.

Things are better compared to what they were. But things are still hard and I kind of fucked up but I don't know how to manage it. Incase he kicks off. which is why I fucked up.

So basically he seems to be gas lighting. ( I think that's the right word) he sends me messages telling me DD is banging on the floor to annoy him and she's doing it on purpose. He does this often. He's on the 1st floor she's on the 2nd floor. A few days back I heard heavy banging . It sounded like parm of his hands slapping on his desk. As if pretending to play drums on the desk. I know it came from his room as I was in the hall way . He then send me a message demanding I tell her to stop. She had not done anything. I ignored him. But also I done fuck all about it. I'm really angry with myself.

He will do things like mute his tv to see if he can hear dd TV then he will get onto me again about sounds from her room.

Ds slept at his friends for 2 nights everything was so relaxed . Everyone chilling out doing their own thing . No hes back within 10 mins he was demanding.

Also whilst he's demanding no noise he's making more noise than anyone .

Please don't tell me to remove a a privilege we are way beyond that.

He does have emotional disregulation

I know I need to sort this I just don't know how.

I do have other threads regarding difficulties we have had.

OP posts:
Original poster
271726a · 07/10/2023 15:34

PatchoulOilandRoses · 07/10/2023 13:40

Is this the son that threw the bottle of hand wash at you?
If so this is a tiny part of your problem and you need him out of the house pronto.

It's really not a tidy part of the problem it's abuses to DD. And ir can't carry on line that .

Few months back when it all come to head I would have been saying same as you. I did want him out back then. Sometimes I still do. I can't see him being home still passed 18 but I hope I'm wrong.

OP posts:
PatchoulOilandRoses · 07/10/2023 18:13

Exactly, he is running riot and ruling the house.
Who else in the household does he have to start on before enough is enough?

SpacePotato · 07/10/2023 18:27

Why didn't you tell him you knew it was him banging on the desk?

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Families
Original poster
271726a · 07/10/2023 18:38

PatchoulOilandRoses · 07/10/2023 18:13

Exactly, he is running riot and ruling the house.
Who else in the household does he have to start on before enough is enough?

As I say I partly agree with what you say i really do . Social services have Been involved , things have got better (compared) to before. Things have been put in place. I'm afraid I do t have an answer which fixes things if I knew alm that there would mot be an issue its really not that easy

OP posts:
Original poster
271726a · 07/10/2023 18:39

SpacePotato · 07/10/2023 18:27

Why didn't you tell him you knew it was him banging on the desk?

I did acknowledge that in my op .

OP posts:
Hawkins0009 · 07/10/2023 22:19

@271726a what about having cctv, in the communal areas ?

Original poster
271726a · 08/10/2023 11:34

Hawkins0009 · 07/10/2023 22:19

@271726a what about having cctv, in the communal areas ?

How would that help ?

OP posts:
AliceOlive · 08/10/2023 11:49

He is complaining to you about DD, but how is this impacting your DD? Are you telling her to turn her music down when it’s not loud? Or to stop banging on her desk when you know it’s him?

AliceOlive · 08/10/2023 11:54

If you could monitor the noise levels in each of their rooms, you could tell him each time “that’s not possible as I can see the level of noise she is making.”

But he will move on to a new way of manipulating and controlling the household.

Id just say “she’s allowed to make noise until the point that i find it disruptive.”

Hawkins0009 · 08/10/2023 12:03

271726a · 08/10/2023 11:34

How would that help ?

Show quote history

Help to minimise any of the x is making x noise or x is doing y, ect as if the cameras have sound then they can soon know if there are loud sound levels etc

Chocolatemarshmallowss · 08/10/2023 12:22

Nothing to add as such , just to say I feel for you.

My brother was like this , but my DM wouldn't say a word against him. Still won't now and he's 30 yo , living with her even though he has a good job. He controls my DM. I genuinely think my DB is a psychopath (obviously I'm not saying your DS is). Just I understand how hard it is for your DD.

theduchessofspork · 08/10/2023 12:29

Can you not just tell him you know he is making this stuff up, and you aren’t going to take anymore notice.

Also sounds like he needs a counsellor

Mrsttcno1 · 08/10/2023 12:36

There is no easy way to say this OP but you simply have to be the parent, and actually parent your child.

Your son is telling lies about your daughter trying to get her into trouble, you know for a fact this is the case because you were stood there and heard him doing the banging, so you tell him exactly that. You tell him you know he’s lying, you don’t want to hear it, and he must stop. You won’t be engaging with his lies any longer- tell him that. By “ignoring” it, you aren’t preventing it, and he gets to keep some control.

You’re the parent, he’s the child. Not the other way around.

He “likes having his music on loud so the sound fills the room”- tough. He doesn’t have his own house, he shares the house with his family, that means everybody has to live harmoniously together. Music is fine, but at a low volume, or headphones is the answer, that’s not up for negotiation, that’s a fact.

You have a chance here to teach your DD that you do not let people walk all over you, bully you and torment you, no matter who they are to you. It’s NEVER acceptable for someone to treat you like that. Because one day she’s going to have a boyfriend who may gaslight here, or lie to her, or manipulate her, and if you set a good example here then when the time comes she will be able to know that actually nobody, even people who say they love you, should treat you badly. If you continue the way you are then all you’re doing is teaching her that it’s easier to roll over and make herself smaller, compromise, all to pacify other people, and she’s also going to learn that her mother left her open to that kind of behaviour.

Decide what kind of parent you want to be and then behave that way.

MrsSlocombesCat · 08/10/2023 12:40

You need to tell him his behaviour is having a negative effect on the whole family and won’t be tolerated. Tell him that if it continues you will ask social services for a place in a hostel for him. You really have to call him out on this because it’s not fair on your other children,

loverofpants · 08/10/2023 12:47

Your poor DD.

All of these pointless excuses for his behaviour, does it matter why he does it? He's doing it and it's impacting everyone in your house.

I grew up in a household similar, and my DB is still causing problems now, takes all of my parents money so they're in debt and can't retire, he doesn't do anything to contribute to the house or the wider world. His sole purpose seems to be angry and cause misery.

All of the other children, myself included left home at the earliest opportunity and have never gone back. In fact we've all moved hours away and I've emigrated to get away from him and the problems he causes.

If my parents ever complain that they don't see us, we remind them they've made the choice to support him and continually choose him over any of the rest of us.

This is what will happen with your other children OP.

PatchoulOilandRoses · 08/10/2023 12:47

@MrsSlocombesCat @Mrsttcno1 OP has had a few threads on her sons behaviour (apologies if you have already seen them) and he is well beyond her stepping up her parenting.
He rules the house and gets violent when he doesn't get his own way.
Social Services have been involved and OP thinks things are getting better (I assume her daughter wouldn't agree). She previously posted that she (understandably) wanted him out of the family home but he is obviously still there.
I think OP should have revived her old thread as the well meaning advice on here is pretty much useless without the background info on what this young man is actually like.

Cheeesus · 08/10/2023 12:50

Would swapping their rooms help? Then you are closer to her?

Or if his is the better room, then perhaps you need to suggest they swap to save him from the noise from her.

Original poster
271726a · 08/10/2023 13:07

Mrsttcno1 · 08/10/2023 12:36

There is no easy way to say this OP but you simply have to be the parent, and actually parent your child.

Your son is telling lies about your daughter trying to get her into trouble, you know for a fact this is the case because you were stood there and heard him doing the banging, so you tell him exactly that. You tell him you know he’s lying, you don’t want to hear it, and he must stop. You won’t be engaging with his lies any longer- tell him that. By “ignoring” it, you aren’t preventing it, and he gets to keep some control.

You’re the parent, he’s the child. Not the other way around.

He “likes having his music on loud so the sound fills the room”- tough. He doesn’t have his own house, he shares the house with his family, that means everybody has to live harmoniously together. Music is fine, but at a low volume, or headphones is the answer, that’s not up for negotiation, that’s a fact.

You have a chance here to teach your DD that you do not let people walk all over you, bully you and torment you, no matter who they are to you. It’s NEVER acceptable for someone to treat you like that. Because one day she’s going to have a boyfriend who may gaslight here, or lie to her, or manipulate her, and if you set a good example here then when the time comes she will be able to know that actually nobody, even people who say they love you, should treat you badly. If you continue the way you are then all you’re doing is teaching her that it’s easier to roll over and make herself smaller, compromise, all to pacify other people, and she’s also going to learn that her mother left her open to that kind of behaviour.

Decide what kind of parent you want to be and then behave that way.

You are totally right although it's beyond the parenting thing . But I also get what your saying . The thing is when you have domestic violence from a partner things are very clear you basically fuck them off and social services tell you that you must get rid or you risk loosing your children.

But when it's a child of 16 who's like 6ft 4. You get told things can work out we will give you help/support you can do this and that , we will put you on a course to support you. We will put him on a DV programme. He has support for mental health etc .

As much as things have got better (compared) to what they were it's very hard to say to him . I know what your up to. I know it's you I heard you etc etc . Because I don't know if he will kock off. By the same token I do t have a choice because it will just continue... I think I'm actually going to contact his DV person that he's working with and get advice from him.

On the whole your right though its just I need to move beyond the fear of what might happend

OP posts:
Original poster
271726a · 08/10/2023 13:13

PatchoulOilandRoses · 08/10/2023 12:47

@MrsSlocombesCat @Mrsttcno1 OP has had a few threads on her sons behaviour (apologies if you have already seen them) and he is well beyond her stepping up her parenting.
He rules the house and gets violent when he doesn't get his own way.
Social Services have been involved and OP thinks things are getting better (I assume her daughter wouldn't agree). She previously posted that she (understandably) wanted him out of the family home but he is obviously still there.
I think OP should have revived her old thread as the well meaning advice on here is pretty much useless without the background info on what this young man is actually like.

I agree with some of what you have said.

I have said things have got better . Which they have. I have not said they are good or ideal.

Dd does feel things have got better ( compared) to what they were like before.

If I was just to add to an old thread my question/statement I have here would get lost as people often only read the 1st op.

OP posts:
Original poster
271726a · 08/10/2023 13:17

Cheeesus · 08/10/2023 12:50

Would swapping their rooms help? Then you are closer to her?

Or if his is the better room, then perhaps you need to suggest they swap to save him from the noise from her.

I did think about that. But then he would be above her . So I don't know if it would make a difference.

OP posts:
Mrsttcno1 · 08/10/2023 13:17

I wasn’t aware of that backstory @271726a, it does sound like you’ve had an awful time of it and I am truly sorry it sounds as though the systems who should be supporting you as a family are failing to.

However to put that into some perspective, you are the system that should be supporting your daughter, and at the moment you are not. As you say yourself, you don’t have a choice but to confront this, is there another adult who can be there for you to have that conversation? Can you ask a support worker to be present?

I understand there is no easy option, but continuing as you are isn’t an option either.

A member of my partners family had a similar situation with her eldest son, he was only 14 at the time and had never harmed his mother however he was constantly threatening his 2 younger siblings, used to throw things around the house, smashed multiple TV’s and iPads, escaped the house in the night and hid knowing they would all have to go look for him, put his hands round his little sisters neck even. He too was sent on a DV course for minors, but it made no difference and in the end, totally at the end of her tether, she took him to the office and left him there and surrendered him to their care. He didn’t end up staying in their care for more than a few weeks, however when he was returned he did so with a support worker who was constant support, she had begged for this beforehand but it was always a “no make it work” before she physically left him there. It shouldn’t take that extreme length to get proper support but if that is the only way then it may be the only way x

PatchoulOilandRoses · 08/10/2023 13:20

@271726a perhaps link to your other threads?
Your son was well on the way to becoming a dangerous young man, as you say at 16 and 6'4 he is well beyond you stepping up your parenting. He already knows throwing his weight around gets him exactly what he wants. I feel so sorry for your daughter (and you!).
I honestly would be washing my hands of him but I understand its not that easy.

Hermittrismegistus · 08/10/2023 13:23

Swapping rooms won't work. Her son is an abuser, he'll just find another excuse to bully and torment.

It's time you chucked him out. If social services are bothered they can house him. He's beyond you helping him.

Cornishclio · 08/10/2023 13:34

Sounds like a control thing for him. Has he got a diagnosis of PDA? I am not sure about the DV and how you deal with that but I think I would confront him when he does things like that to gaslight your DD. You have to support her through the abuse whilst acknowledging his need for control. It must be very difficult though so maybe contact his therapist or whoever is supporting him with his mental health. It can't be nice to be living on the edge all the time. If he is 16 is he doing exams or something which may be causing him extra anxiety?

Original poster
271726a · 08/10/2023 13:42

Mrsttcno1 · 08/10/2023 13:17

I wasn’t aware of that backstory @271726a, it does sound like you’ve had an awful time of it and I am truly sorry it sounds as though the systems who should be supporting you as a family are failing to.

However to put that into some perspective, you are the system that should be supporting your daughter, and at the moment you are not. As you say yourself, you don’t have a choice but to confront this, is there another adult who can be there for you to have that conversation? Can you ask a support worker to be present?

I understand there is no easy option, but continuing as you are isn’t an option either.

A member of my partners family had a similar situation with her eldest son, he was only 14 at the time and had never harmed his mother however he was constantly threatening his 2 younger siblings, used to throw things around the house, smashed multiple TV’s and iPads, escaped the house in the night and hid knowing they would all have to go look for him, put his hands round his little sisters neck even. He too was sent on a DV course for minors, but it made no difference and in the end, totally at the end of her tether, she took him to the office and left him there and surrendered him to their care. He didn’t end up staying in their care for more than a few weeks, however when he was returned he did so with a support worker who was constant support, she had begged for this beforehand but it was always a “no make it work” before she physically left him there. It shouldn’t take that extreme length to get proper support but if that is the only way then it may be the only way x

Well I'm going to ask his DV worker for a bit of advice abd see what he says .

I did actually kick him out when he throw a full shampoo bottle at me. Most people on mn ripped into me for kicking him out . It might sound petty but it really hurt me. And I thought if I let this go its going to become regular physical abuse.

Anyway adult dd who's vulnerable herself ends up letting DS stay at hers for a month .I think it was . So as much as in her heart she was helping which I totally understand. Had he Been made to go homeless route. It may have been different. Also the manager of social services had told me they (have) to try and work with the family to try keep ds at home etc. If ds ever plays up like that again I can kick him out and totally refuse him because I have Been there we tried etc but I don't want it to get to that .

Ds has Been diagnosed with emotional disregulation. So I'm doing a oases on that . As much as it msy be helpful to understand how the person might be feeling. What may trigger them . It really no excuse to ve aggressive towards people .

Also I pretty sure emotional disregulation does not mean you can make uo shot abd also act our shot and say it was someone else.

Anyway I'm basically agreeing with you .

OP posts: