Page 5 | What do I need to do differently to avoid being every man's friend?

Grumpyold · 2023-09-25T10:12:38+00:00

I like men and male company. I like women too but my interests are largely sports based and I work in a very male dominated industry so a lot of the people I spend time with/have things in common with are men. I have a wide circle of friends who are probably slightly over 50% male. However, I'm now single and even new men I meet seem to enjoy my company, even seek it out, but they never even try to move anything beyond friendship. I'm not glamorous, but I think I look OK, slim, active, groomed in a natural kind of way, take care with my clothes, classic more than obvious but modern and not too frumpy. (I'm mid 50s). For example, yesterday afternoon I went out for drinks with a man. I've know him for a long time but we've never been close friends. We were talking about some interesting issues previously and I suggested we could continue it over a drink. Which he jumped at, agreed with the first time and place I suggested and turned up 5 mins early! We chatted for 4 hours, he changed his plans for afterwards so he could stay longer than planned, we laughed, learned some stuff about each other, had quite a bit to drink, but still nothing. He walked me back to the train, we had a chaste hug goodbye (which I initiated) and I don't expect to hear from him again until we bump into each other at an event. Why?

Disturbia81 · 26/09/2023 10:52

I don't mean she was a victim or that he groomed her etc. just the fact that he got together with someone so much younger. 20 years!
I was totally in love with someone but once they revealed they were okay with big age gaps then it instantly gave me the ick. These men are immature and shallow.
I'm with someone now who has always gone for his own age or a couple years older, there are many men like this.

AnonyLonnymouse · 26/09/2023 11:01

beastlyslumber · 26/09/2023 10:50

It sounds like this guy isn't really for you, but in general, you are treating men like mates and not letting them know you're interested or attracted to them.

You don't need to say, "I fancy you, how about it?" But it's about body language, eye contact, the playfulness between you. For example, when he says, do you want another drink, you say something like, well I don't know... are you trying to get me drunk? With a mischievous look in your eye. Or when he comes back from the bar, you briefly touch his arm and say, thanks, you're a real gentleman. It sounds ridiculous, but it's just little ways to change the dynamic from 'matey' to sexy. If he likes you, which he almost certainly does if he's out with you, then he'll respond flirtatiously too.

And if he isn't into it, he won't flirt back and you haven't embarrassed yourself by making any kind of a declaration. All you're doing is giving an invitation for him to pursue you and leaving it up to him whether he chooses to take that up.

I think this is probably about right. It all sounds very 'obvious', but I think most men are not that subtle and would lap it up. Oh and hold his gaze for a bit longer than necessary.

Myfabby · 26/09/2023 11:56

@Grumpyold

You sound really lovely, articulate and I hope you find someone amazing for you soon.

copperchain · 26/09/2023 16:59

I 'd say that if you are usually classed as "one of the lads" then you need to make substantially more effort to break free from this.
You talk about not being "girly" but to remind men that you are effectively open to a relationship with a man , they need to see you in the light of someone they would want to be sexually involved with.
Nobody wants to be rejected, so if you want something more, and want him to initiate, just sitting and chatting about intellectual conversation without flirting is not enough.
This doesn't mean that you aren't true to yourself. You are someone who wants a sexual relationship, presumably, so let that be known. The easiest way for a man to understand, without spelling it out, would be to make a bigger statement with your physical appearance ( clothes/makeup) and physical closeness to him while you are together.
If he doesn't respond to these signals then generally he isn't into you.

YouJustDoYou · 26/09/2023 18:03

copperchain · 26/09/2023 16:59

I 'd say that if you are usually classed as "one of the lads" then you need to make substantially more effort to break free from this.
You talk about not being "girly" but to remind men that you are effectively open to a relationship with a man , they need to see you in the light of someone they would want to be sexually involved with.
Nobody wants to be rejected, so if you want something more, and want him to initiate, just sitting and chatting about intellectual conversation without flirting is not enough.
This doesn't mean that you aren't true to yourself. You are someone who wants a sexual relationship, presumably, so let that be known. The easiest way for a man to understand, without spelling it out, would be to make a bigger statement with your physical appearance ( clothes/makeup) and physical closeness to him while you are together.
If he doesn't respond to these signals then generally he isn't into you.

This. Also, and hate to say it, but if you were you but 20, they'd go for it hook line and sinker.

Original poster

Grumpyold · 27/09/2023 07:32

YouJustDoYou · 26/09/2023 18:03

This. Also, and hate to say it, but if you were you but 20, they'd go for it hook line and sinker.

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Yes, I'm well aware that when I was younger some of the men who were "friends" felt differently to friendly towards me. After a lifetime of making sure men don't get the "wrong" idea, I don't seem to be able to give them the right idea 😆

OP posts:

Fahbeep · 27/09/2023 07:52

I think you need to be more forward and contact the man you had the date with to tell him you find him attractive and would like to see him again. Maybe for dinner or the theatre, something more intimate than drinks at the bar (which is how friends meet). Tell him you want to get to know him better, and hear about his life. He probably has his own baggage and mental barriers, and a fear of rejection. He's in his fifties and single, so probably not what he planned. Worst thing that happens is that he says no thank you and you move on.

beastlyslumber · 27/09/2023 09:26

Fahbeep · 27/09/2023 07:52

I think you need to be more forward and contact the man you had the date with to tell him you find him attractive and would like to see him again. Maybe for dinner or the theatre, something more intimate than drinks at the bar (which is how friends meet). Tell him you want to get to know him better, and hear about his life. He probably has his own baggage and mental barriers, and a fear of rejection. He's in his fifties and single, so probably not what he planned. Worst thing that happens is that he says no thank you and you move on.

Don't do this. It's too much pressure at this stage to tell someone you find them attractive and want to see them again. You haven't even been on a proper date yet. It puts him on the spot and makes it seem serious, which will likely turn him off unless he's already serious about you.

You could definitely ask him out again, though. But be more low key and flirtatious about it, e.g. I had a great time the other night - fancy doing it again, but this time with cocktails? ;)

Something like that that's lighthearted, and a bit cheeky. It's all about being playful, teasing, and letting him feel like he's the one pursuing you.

Original poster

Grumpyold · 27/09/2023 09:44

I don't mind/prefer to take things slowly and a friendship, if that's how things work out is also good, it's this situation where no one seems to even consider that there could be anything else that confuses me.

OP posts:

SleepingStandingUp · 27/09/2023 09:58

Disturbia81 · 26/09/2023 10:38

@Grumpyold Gross! So he IS one of "those" men, he was with a 33 year old at 53. He's not interested in you like that OP, he's an entitled youth chaser and that's an instant red flag to me. Huge turn off that he would be with someone so much younger. He sees you as a mate.

Youth chaser? She was 33!!!! It's really odd people think adults can't have things in common with other adults because of a few years gap. If 20 is too much, what's ok? 15? 10? 5? What's the difference between 5 and 6 or 9 and 10?

I have a male friend who is 15 years older. We share common interests. Some overlap in music. Do a hobby together. Have similar politics. Certainly enough there for a functional and equal relationship.
Dfriend has a husband a similar age gap she met in her late 20s. They're a perfect match, very happily married with kids 15 years later. Being with a younger woman has pushed his to keep up physically so he's in the best shape of his life in his 50s.

PosterBoy · 27/09/2023 10:34

Grumpyold · 26/09/2023 09:47

I don't know, it didn't really feel like "confiding" more offloading. There was never a "moment" when we might have touched or kissed.

Maybe he's the same as all the others. His last partner/gf, who he was with on and off with for about 5 years, until a year ago, was c. 20 years younger than us.

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Grim

Well, there you go op. He probably sees you as Elderly Aunt.

Yes, I know he is the same age, but come on .. he dates women in their 30s ... he thinks he is a young stallion.

Disturbia81 · 27/09/2023 11:27

@PosterBoy Exactly, grim as fuck. Most people are thinking it.

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 11:52

I don't think men's deepest desire in a romantic relationship is to be "got" on an intellectual level or to have interesting conversations. That's big-brain thinking. Men (IMO) use their little brain for romantic decisions.

Also, well-preserved men in their 50s who have money (any amount of money, lol) feel they're at their status peak and that they deserve women also at their status peak. Which is 20-35.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 27/09/2023 11:57

TheresaBouvey · 25/09/2023 11:34

I was in this position a long time ago 😁

i used to play pool and drink beer with the guys (and girls) and worked in IT so more guys to be friends with …

IMO men decide in the first few minutes of meeting you if you are romantic/sexual or friendship material. A lot of this can be based how you project yourself

i used to give “sister” vibes, maybe due to having only brothers and do ding men easy to talk to. I sort of had to work on my own mindset and not subconsciously friend-zoning myself at the start

Oh I might be a bit like this - “sister vibes” does sound a bit like me. I’m not really on the look out for a relationship, is probably why!

I think it’s probably good to appreciate people’s friendship for what it is. Friendship is probably more valuable than a relationship in many ways. Friendship doesn’t tend to break down when the initial attraction has faded, or when one thing or another goes wrong.

I realise you are interested in a relationship but the right one may come along if you just keep doing what you’re doing. Or make it clear when you are interested in more and take that risk!

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 12:00

I don't get the impression this guy wasn't interested in you. I get the impression you're impatient! 😂

Just carry on living your life and if he's into you, he will make that clear.

Disturbia81 · 27/09/2023 12:09

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 11:52

I don't think men's deepest desire in a romantic relationship is to be "got" on an intellectual level or to have interesting conversations. That's big-brain thinking. Men (IMO) use their little brain for romantic decisions.

Also, well-preserved men in their 50s who have money (any amount of money, lol) feel they're at their status peak and that they deserve women also at their status peak. Which is 20-35.

I definitely didn't feel at my peak at 20.. I knew nothing, hasn't found my look, no confidence, insecure. At 38 I'm happier with my looks, wisdom, life experience, confidence and get chatted up so much more now.
Not that that makes me happy, just an observation. Don't understand the obsession with youth, they are kids to me.

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 12:21

@Disturbia81 I agree, I wasn't at my best till I was 38-39. But you're trying your best apply big-brain logic to little-brain thinking. Little-brain decisions don't make sense.

Original poster

Grumpyold · 27/09/2023 12:30

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 12:21

@Disturbia81 I agree, I wasn't at my best till I was 38-39. But you're trying your best apply big-brain logic to little-brain thinking. Little-brain decisions don't make sense.

This is interesting because I'd probably agree re the initial "fancy" stage, I don't think many women here would say DH used his smallbrain to pick them? I'm certain my late DH didn't and I don't think my father did either, both relationships based on mutual respect for ability and intelligence.

I'm not looking for a DH though.

OP posts:

Disturbia81 · 27/09/2023 12:35

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 12:21

@Disturbia81 I agree, I wasn't at my best till I was 38-39. But you're trying your best apply big-brain logic to little-brain thinking. Little-brain decisions don't make sense.

True.. and they often regret those little brain decisions when it involves losing/missing out on a diamond of a woman.

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 13:33

I don't think many women here would say DH used his smallbrain to pick them? I'm certain my late DH didn't and I don't think my father did either, both relationships based on mutual respect for ability and intelligence.

Marriage is attraction first PLUS respect for their ability and intelligence. A man would never pick a wife due only to her ability and intelligence. They have friends for those things.

Sex is just attraction. Men will happily shag people they don't respect, admire or even want to talk to.

Do you think you're trying to attract men to you by demonstrating the same qualities you find attractive in them?

Soonenough · 27/09/2023 19:58

Following along with interest . Met a bloke in a work situation that was immediately suggestive . While that is flattering do I really want someone that maybe just sees me as a shag ? But as a guy in his 50s , he could easily have women in their 30, 40s which is still decades younger than me. So hard , don't want meaningless sex but don't want it ruled out either.

Disturbia81 · 27/09/2023 20:32

Soonenough · 27/09/2023 19:58

Following along with interest . Met a bloke in a work situation that was immediately suggestive . While that is flattering do I really want someone that maybe just sees me as a shag ? But as a guy in his 50s , he could easily have women in their 30, 40s which is still decades younger than me. So hard , don't want meaningless sex but don't want it ruled out either.

Not "easily", most older men don't get anywhere.

Original poster

Grumpyold · 27/09/2023 20:39

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 13:33

I don't think many women here would say DH used his smallbrain to pick them? I'm certain my late DH didn't and I don't think my father did either, both relationships based on mutual respect for ability and intelligence.

Marriage is attraction first PLUS respect for their ability and intelligence. A man would never pick a wife due only to her ability and intelligence. They have friends for those things.

Sex is just attraction. Men will happily shag people they don't respect, admire or even want to talk to.

Do you think you're trying to attract men to you by demonstrating the same qualities you find attractive in them?

I'm not doing it "to attract men", I'm just being me.

OP posts:

HenryCavillsWife · 27/09/2023 20:55

I'm not doing it "to attract men", I'm just being me.

Maybe start trying to attract men, then? I thought that was the entire point of your thread..?

pantypant · 27/09/2023 21:03

BiscuitsandPuffin · 25/09/2023 11:18

@anareen why did you quote the (long) OP?? You were literally the first poster, what else could you possibly have been replying to?!

I know right. Does my head in