Lucy Letby guilty

[BarelyLiterate]

Lucy Letby has been convicted of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of six more.

My thoughts are with the families of the victims.

It is telling that the woman brought in the replace the chief executive and started the ball rolling with the investigations is suing for constructive dismissal. Does suggest the board at the hospital weren’t keen on shining any light on the situation.

And how they hell did Lucy Letby’s dad get involved? Why was he in on mediation meetings with the chief executive and her colleagues. She was a grown woman and apparently. Trained professional. He had no business pressuring the hospital for an apology. This must be against professional standards.

Look at how the press treated Christopher Jeffries, zoning in on his eccentricity and portraying it as morbid.

I remember reading an Australian PhD thesis about nurses who murder their patients. He had looked at cases from all over the world (there are frighteningly many of them) and the common thread was that hospital managements did nothing to stop the killers, either by dismissing the worries of colleagues (like the LL case now), or, even worse, encouraging the nurses to move on to get rid of them and giving them good references to work in another hospital, despite knowing they were almost certainly killing patients. Nothing changes, it seems. I'll see if I can track down the reference to the research. It was about 15 years ago, I think.

And not all the cases they did select have turned out to be murder/attempted murder. no. Not all cases they selected have been proven beyond reasonable doubt to have been murder/attempted murder. There is a difference.

I think it’s important to emphasise that fact,and to remember that if someone is capable of murdering multiple tiny babies, where there is a not guilty verdict in some instances, it’s certainly likely that some of those were murdered as well but that it couldn’t be proven.

Then there is: witness testimony from parents, colleagues, medical experts

her own notes confessing to this

her sickening behaviour obsessed with dressing/ handling the babies once passed away and being in a clearly excited state about doing this, even before a very ill baby had actually passed away

obsession with the babies and families likely getting excited by their grief in continued
FB and internet searches even years after the babies had passed away

This is very interesting, Would the parents of the children who survived but were left disabled get a bigger payout, due to increased costs to them of raising a disabled child?

I hope the families get all the support they need. I can’t begin to ever imagine their pain.

And may she rot in prison, and then hell.

Yes, the highest payout for a childbirth injury afaik stands at about £12million for a child who survived with serious brain injury. The high costs awarded were due to the need for round the clock care, etc for life.

Yes, it'd very worrying. Especially given how long and hard those colleagues must have thought before reporting her. It's not the sort of accusation you'd make lightly.

@LadyDanburysHat I'm not a barrister but I do work in the maternity and neonatal sector of the NHS - yes, that would normally be the way that it would work, however they wouldn't put a legal claim in now, more likely once the child was in their early teens where it becomes really clear what the nature of their ongoing care needs will be, and therefore a payout would be reflective of that.

I agree. I have a horrible feeling about the whole thing. I’m hoping more information comes to light about her past and it makes me feel more secure that it was the right call.

What don't understand is, if I was a hospital consultant, I and other colleagues genuinely thought a nurse was murdering babies, and my bosses refused to do anything about it....and more babies were likely to die....

Why didn't the consultants report directly to the police in the hope that would trigger action?

The motives are unlikely to ever be known.
she clearly had an obsession with childhood/ youth/ preserving innocence as can be seen in her very strange bedroom and belongings more akin to those of a 12 year old girl not adult woman.

Professor David Wilson, a leading criminologist, said this desperation to be acknowledged at work were signs of a 'hero complex,' and narcissism in Letby's personality.
Placing herself at the centre of a crisis was also indicative of the mental condition, Munchausen's, he said.

@Lenald2512 it does until you see the evidence which support it including texts where she asked him if he was on shift and saying how well they work together then within 10 mins he’d be crash called to an emergency.

There were notes found such as “I loved you and I wanted you to stand by me but you didn’t” and another with his name on and loads of love hearts.

lots of texts between them immediately before/after emergencies etc that the prosecution were able to prove only she could face facilitated.

Awful, just unbelievably awful, and abusing her power and privilege as a nurse - duty-bound to protect the safety of all in her care.

As a nurse for 35 years, I assure everyone of the special contempt and loathing we hold for people like Lucy Letby, Beverley Allitt, and the handful of others who’ve deliberately put patients into cardiac arrest for the “glory” of resuscitating them. They are not the norm, they disgrace the rest of us. We all know grumpy surly miserable nurses <avoids eye contact here> but sweet zombie jeebus, we don’t intentionally kill our patients.

It's a long-rehearsed trope in our society. Evil people are ugly, strange, scarred, deformed. Beautiful people are innocent and good. Just ask Disney.

That's disgraceful. Poor staff having to work alongside her, knowing (or strongly suspecting) what she was doing. How did they keep going? They must be traumatised too. I hope they are being supported.
Imagine being the consultant trying so hard to save a baby, having to hand them over to a nurse you suspect might murder them, deciding to report her, being ignored then being made to apologise to her. Awful.

Those poor, sweet babies. I hope their families can begin to heal 😔

I'm so happy and relieved to hear this verdict. Listening to the podcast and reading the live updates, it was obvious she was guilty. But then I would go on Twitter, Facebook or on here and read so many stupid and uneducated comments in support of Lucy Letby. It really started to worry me that there would be two or three equally stupid people on the jury and the case would collapse. Fortunately not.

Maybe. Perhaps you're right. But equally that goes for all those on the threads and in social media who thought she was guilty. And I didn't gather my opinion solely from threads but also from the livestreams from the court. But I am not medically qualified and so gathered extra info from those who are, on the threads.

I guess I'm saying to me the evidence seemed to hinge a lot on coincidence. Miscarriages of justice in female serial murder perpetrator cases are too common see here https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-65806606 and often rely on coincidence and that gives me pause.

Anyway. If she did it, then justice has been done and she'll suffer in prison. The Jury have delivered their verdict. I accept that I of course wouldn't have all the access to info they did.

Time, ultimately, will tell.

Serial killers usually look "normal" - it's how they get away with it.

PumpkinsAndCoconuts so agree. I used to think Mumsnet was a forum for vaguely intelligent people. Yet still now, today, after this verdict there are people on here saying they can’t believe it because she looks “so NORMAL”!!!!!! What- if she looked like Shrek you’d believe she did it then? Just utterly unbelievable.
Also that she “had such a normal upbringing” how on EARTH would you know this????!

It’s just so horrendous and difficult to think about

Those sweet babies and poor poor families

Just too evil

@freedomseeking Aside from compensation for the bereavement, many of the parents may well have secondary victim claims, i would imagine.

precisely.
We do not burn people a witches anymore. but society can still be incredibly unkind to anybody looking or behaving in a manner that isn`t deemd "ideal" or "normal".