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Inheritance - karma

100 replies

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 13:25

I may well be shot down in flames so have namechanged, but I just felt like sharing my amusement at what looks like poetic justice following the death of my father last week. Sorry if this offends anyone - I am mourning for him but my feelings are a bit all over the place.

I always assumed there would be no inheritance from my father who was an ordinary working class man renting a flat with his second wife, with no owned property except a small shed-sized garden hut on rented land, which I was told years ago belonged to his wife anyway. She also owns a flat inherited from her parents which my younger half-brother lives in, but I never even entertained any thought of that as it belongs to her and my half-brother after her.

But after he died his wife brought up his estate and asked me to do my part in obtaining necessary forms etc. During the discussion she casually mentioned that there was a modest pot of joint savings which they had agreed would go to her after his death unless I wished to contest it. I just laughed and said of course not. But it turns out the estate may be rather larger than I ever imagined, consisting of possibly larger savings than she declared (she declared £10k), the hut which in fact is part of the estate and not hers only, and even potentially the flat which, while small, is in a prime location so might fetch £400k, easily.

What got me suspicious was that she was only talking about the estate as consisting of very modest savings of £10k or so, which divided between her and three surviving children would only yield 1-2k per child which is not worth fighting for, but what she didn't make clear was that the two properties are most likely going to count as part of their joint marital assets, and that she was trying to persuade me not to contest the fact that it would all go to her! Before anyone says anything this is in a different country where the widow does not automatically inherit everything if there are surviving children. And by the sounds of it he didn't make a will which would have been characteristic of my father who was very obstinate at not being forced to do anything and didn't want to even think about his death. I think her talking about 'contesting' is misleading as I don't think there is a will at all.

I'm not so desperate for the money as it won't be megabucks anyway, but it's the principle. I have two children who are my late father's only grandchildren so it does surprise me that they wouldn't even feature in my stepmother's calculations. We are not well off as a family while not on the breadline either. My older brother, however, who is a single man, is almost literally on the breadline after a very difficult childhood living with my father and his second wife and having multiple problems due to the trauma.

And while this is an already long tale just to point out that my stepmother and father had an affair and he left my mother and his two children for her, and she was already pregnant when they were still married. And while these things happen, they both went on to inflict much cruelty on us over the years, which has not exactly endeared them to me.

Anyway, my stepmother is carefully manoeuvering away and I think trying to butter me up, but it is increasingly beginning to look like the state will not let her simply claim everything but that we, the surviving children, will see the extent of the estate in due course and can then make up our minds as to what we do. I already said to her that I thought it would only be fair that the proceeds from the sale of the hut would be divided between the four of us.

Apologies for the sketchy details, I'm really not clued up about these things!

OP posts:
DrSbaitso · 04/07/2023 13:27

Sounds like you should talk to a solicitor and get a very clear picture of the situation.

redhaire · 04/07/2023 13:32

if they're married it will go to his wife, unless he specifically mentioned you in his will.
You can contest it, but that will
probably cost a lot of money and ultimately a very tiny chance of getting anything. Did
he mention you in his will? Does he have one? Have you seen it?

redhaire · 04/07/2023 13:34

ok, I've just re read it. He doesn't have a will so the money from his assets will transfer to his legal next of kin, his wife. Unless she's feeling kind and generous, very slim chance of you getting anything. Unfair,
probably.
But the law.

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 13:35

redhaire · 04/07/2023 13:32

if they're married it will go to his wife, unless he specifically mentioned you in his will.
You can contest it, but that will
probably cost a lot of money and ultimately a very tiny chance of getting anything. Did
he mention you in his will? Does he have one? Have you seen it?

This is not in the UK so the law is different and she won't automatically get everything even in the absence of a will. I don't think there is a will, she didn't mention one. I'm not going to get a lawyer as it won't be worth the cost, but I think the state will divide the assets between us without me having to do anything.

OP posts:
SometimesMaybe · 04/07/2023 13:35

if you are in Scotland you will have “legal rights” and therefore a claim on the estate.

Lizzt2007 · 04/07/2023 13:38

redhaire · 04/07/2023 13:32

if they're married it will go to his wife, unless he specifically mentioned you in his will.
You can contest it, but that will
probably cost a lot of money and ultimately a very tiny chance of getting anything. Did
he mention you in his will? Does he have one? Have you seen it?

Did you actually read anything the op wrote?

DrSbaitso · 04/07/2023 13:44

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 13:35

This is not in the UK so the law is different and she won't automatically get everything even in the absence of a will. I don't think there is a will, she didn't mention one. I'm not going to get a lawyer as it won't be worth the cost, but I think the state will divide the assets between us without me having to do anything.

It's surely worth the cost of a one off consultation. There are vast amounts at stake here and you should be clear on what you can claim. Is there a Citizens Advice equivalent where you are?

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 13:46

DrSbaitso · 04/07/2023 13:44

It's surely worth the cost of a one off consultation. There are vast amounts at stake here and you should be clear on what you can claim. Is there a Citizens Advice equivalent where you are?

I don't know. I'm seeing a notary when I'm there in August so I was thinking of asking them then.

OP posts:
radiatorpipe · 04/07/2023 13:48

Depending where you are you absolutely have rights & I think you should. It's dreadful here how children often miss out.

Fiddlerdragon · 04/07/2023 13:54

redhaire · 04/07/2023 13:34

ok, I've just re read it. He doesn't have a will so the money from his assets will transfer to his legal next of kin, his wife. Unless she's feeling kind and generous, very slim chance of you getting anything. Unfair,
probably.
But the law.

I think you need to reread it again, my year 1’s have better comprehension skills 🙄

Op I think you and your sibling need to have a good chat about what you want to do, and obviously seek legal advice. Legally you need to know what you have a potential claim to. If you’re asking from a moral/ethical point of view, I don’t think you’re in the wrong at all for wanting a part of the inheritance that most decent parents would want their children to have a share of anyway. Especially when your dads wife is already being deceitful and manipulative over it. Why should she and her children benefit from it, but not your dads former children? It sounds like the law is on your side.

AbacusAvocado · 04/07/2023 13:57

@redhaire - they are not in the UK, and - shock horror - different countries have different laws. Repeatedly asserting what will happen when you have no idea what the relevant laws are is just silly.

Fiddlerdragon · 04/07/2023 13:58

Does your stepmother have access to any money now? You’ve mentioned a joint pot so I’d be worried about anything getting squirrelled away in the meantime. I’d definitely keep your cards close to your chest and give her no indication of your plans in case she decides to make things difficult for you.

ComeTheFckOnBridget · 04/07/2023 14:00

I urge you to consult with a solicitor and consider making a claim on his estate.

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 14:00

Fiddlerdragon · 04/07/2023 13:54

I think you need to reread it again, my year 1’s have better comprehension skills 🙄

Op I think you and your sibling need to have a good chat about what you want to do, and obviously seek legal advice. Legally you need to know what you have a potential claim to. If you’re asking from a moral/ethical point of view, I don’t think you’re in the wrong at all for wanting a part of the inheritance that most decent parents would want their children to have a share of anyway. Especially when your dads wife is already being deceitful and manipulative over it. Why should she and her children benefit from it, but not your dads former children? It sounds like the law is on your side.

Well quite, and I don't actually feel any guilt even if i end up getting a share of the flat too although it was her parents' because I think she is trying to swindle me and my older brother out of any share of the estate. I had no thought of claiming any of their joint savings, but if she is basically trying to cheat us, then I think it's all fair game. Also, I forgot to mention that he never paid a penny in child maintenance (my mother didn't ask for any), so I don't feel bad at all if their assets are considered joint by the state and shared equally between his widow AND three children.

OP posts:
IhearyouClemFandango · 04/07/2023 14:02

Did you say some of it had belonged to her anyway?

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 14:04

IhearyouClemFandango Yes, there is a flat that was her parents' but I suspect may possibly be considered as part of their joint marital assets although I don't know. I won't contest it and have no wish to cheat my half-brother out of it but if the state awards me a share I will take it for my children with a clear conscience.

OP posts:
cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 14:12

Fiddlerdragon · 04/07/2023 13:58

Does your stepmother have access to any money now? You’ve mentioned a joint pot so I’d be worried about anything getting squirrelled away in the meantime. I’d definitely keep your cards close to your chest and give her no indication of your plans in case she decides to make things difficult for you.

She may, but I think it would be very difficult and expensive for me to try to stop that. Although I think the account may be frozen after his death to prevent it.

It's not really that I'm desperate to stop her, more that I'm sitting back and silently pleased that I may end up getting more than I expected (which was nothing) while she is beavering away trying to prevent me and my brother from getting anything.

OP posts:
QueensBees · 04/07/2023 14:25

As you are seeing the notary, I’m assuming you are in France.
In that case, she is in a really place because his money will go to his dcs first - plus there will be the issue of what sort if contract they are married under.

The notary will sort that out though as it will be their responsibility that assets are going to the right person ( incl banks if there is any debts).

id just be careful to mention the assets you are aware about to said notary….

QueensBees · 04/07/2023 14:30

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 14:04

IhearyouClemFandango Yes, there is a flat that was her parents' but I suspect may possibly be considered as part of their joint marital assets although I don't know. I won't contest it and have no wish to cheat my half-brother out of it but if the state awards me a share I will take it for my children with a clear conscience.

If it’s France, it’s most likely that what was part of her parents estate will stay hers.
However, money that she might have received and has then been put in the common pot would probably be treated as shared. It’s tte sort if stuff lawyers and notary hate because everything then gets extremely complicated.

IF their marriage contract puts everything in common, then it’s like the U.K. and yes it would be considered a common asset.

Ive seen what happens with inheritance with my grand parents, and i have to say, it can satisfying to see the ,aw/notary/executors put a halt to someone trying to put their hands on something that isn’t theirs….

TonTonMacoute · 04/07/2023 14:32

Well, you can hardly expect any meaningful advice (if that’s what you want) unless we know which country you are in. In France, for example, there are rules about how you can divide your estate.

However, you say you will be seeing a lawyer soon, only they can tell you the situation. Get whatever you are entitled to!

MrsRachelDanvers · 04/07/2023 14:35

You need to see a lawyer who is knowledgeable estate law for the country in which your father lived-not mumsnet. As for the morality of it all-see a lawyer.

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 14:39

I'm not after advice but just sharing as I don't have many people to talk to about this IRL. I'm enjoying all your comments, thank you. And I'm enjoying the karma, really, even if I end up getting very little. But she already said she will voluntarily give me something from the cottage sale if I don't contest things, or something to that effect. But I might just wait and see what the state awards me.

BTW it's not France but I'd rather not reveal where as don't want it to be too outing.

OP posts:
tara66 · 04/07/2023 14:39

As you referenced Notary - I also presume you are in France. See facebook group called Strictly Legal France. Children have precedence over spouses in France re. inheritance. You would have to renounce your rights to inherit for the wife to inherit everything. Inform the Notaire (notary) asap that your father had children and grandchildren.

1984Winston · 04/07/2023 14:43

My estranged dad lives in another country (he remarried when my mum died and treated me and my siblings really badly afterwards) I assumed we would get nothing when he dies which annoyed me only because it would mean my step sisters would get the house which was half my mums, however we have recently realised that in that country the estate does not go to the wife, it would go to the kids (a British will may over ride this but I don't think he has one) will be a nightmare to sort out when he dies though

cheekymaren · 04/07/2023 14:49

Meanwhile my mother and I indulged in a bit of gallows humour. While my father shared a modest rented flat with my stepmother he was a collector of books and curiosities, even some icons, so you never know what some of those, especially the books, might be worth! So my mother and I were joking that it would be fun to arrive at the flat with some experts in tow to evaluate the contents (which haven't even been mentioned by her), take pictures etc so we have proof of their existence before she squirrels them away.

Maybe it's just funny for me. Grief is a strange thing.

OP posts: