What do private schools do that state schools don't?

[Mommymoments]

For me the local private does
Weekly swimming
Learning an orchestra instrument (extra cost)
Debating
Language (Spanish, French, German & afterschool Latin, Mandarin & Russian)
Yoga
Hockey & Lacrosse
Lots of sporting & drama opportunities
Excellent field trips out of school
Ski trip from Y7 onwards..

Would love all that for my dc's but can't afford it. But would love to hear about all the nice extras your dc's get at their private.

A good private school will instil more confidence than your average state school pupil has.

🤣🤣🤣

I think you're right. I know a lot of people who never even considered sending their dc to state schools.

I think that's true, if you're talking about averages. But the difference will be much less noticeable once you start adjusting for stuff like family background, access to extra-curricular activities etc. It isn't the school that is necessarily making the difference, it's all the other stuff that often goes alongside a private education but can also be reproduced quite easily without one by a canny parent.

I think that is the only reason I might have sent DD to private school.

We did look at one. DD took the exam, passed and was offered a place, but we weren't awarded the bursary that we applied for, so she went to the local (very good) comprehensive where she excelled academically, and also excelled in her degree. But I always wonder if she might have had more self confidence if we could have afforded the private school.

Very true. But what you can’t replicate as a parent is a calm classroom environment with children who generally want to learn. And that’s what is lacking at my local state secondary. Classrooms are chaotic, those who want to learn and are quiet and studious are bullied, the older children make the younger children’s lives miserable. If we had a good state school near us I would absolutely send my children there, but sadly we don’t.

Well, in a lot of cases, yes, because I've encountered quite a lot of them when interviewing for roles where that line of would have been relevant.

MrsBennet thank you for answering my question. This is interesting - genuine question, but when you are interviewing people what sort of questions to you ask to find out if the candidates have insights into less privileged lives?
What sort of jobs are you interviewing them for?

It is amazing how people automatically assume that state schools lag behind in equipment, demanding subjects, and teachers of ability. Your son is proof that this is nonsense (hope he does well with his Mandarin!) and the children.of the other posters who told of Mandarin and Russian in their schools too.
In my first school, a young teacher couldn't cope with her classes and finally walked out one sunny day, never to return. She was last heard of teaching in a private school, her assumption being that she would encounter nicer pupils. But children are children the world.over..
I sometimes wonder how she got on...

I get that, and I understand why you might send your dc to a private school in that scenario. I accept that some kids would find the low level disruption that goes on in many state schools to be difficult or distracting.

My dd wasn't really affected by any of that - she has quite a low boredom threshold and actually rather enjoyed the "livelier" atmosphere in some of her classes. It was mostly very good natured, which no doubt made a difference. And she found the work easy, so it didn't really affect her learning in any way. And by the time the work started getting a bit harder with A-levels, the kids all wanted to be there anyway, and so there was no issue with disruption.

Bullying is of course an issue at many state schools, but I know quite a lot of kids in the private sector who have also been badly affected by this. I don't think private schools are necessarily any better at dealing with it. A lot depends on the school leadership and how they approach it. We were lucky not to ever have to test dd's schools out with regard to this issue!!

I haven't read the whole thread, but I think the two main advantages of many private schools are

• Smaller class sizes so more one to one teaching

• Selective intake so academic level of teaching can be at a higher level

And, as others have said, perhaps a more conducive environment to learning and doing well?

But even people who can afford private and who (on here) have stated their dc would be 100 times happier in private refuse to pay because its against their principles.

We all need to look beyond our own experiences and do invidually what's best for our dc

Private schools sometimes fall short when it comes to special needs - they don't equip themselves for these children while a state school provides for them.
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Depends. Some highly selective schools probably won't but there are some excellent private schools catering specifically for children with special needs.

Omg!

Whoever wrote the above line about sen is wild off the mark.

State schools do not smoothly and successfully provide sen provision at all.

Agreed… if only eh?

*Having worked in both these are the differences:

Smaller class sizes make a massive difference.
Fewer behaviour issues and calmer learning environment in general.
The teachers aren't better but they are less stressed so can actually get on with their job and enjoy it.
The teachers teach their specialist subject (usually anyway).
More money per student so better resources and facilities.
Better extra curricular opportunities and trips.
Better careers guidance and support with UCAS.*

I think this is a fair summary - on average of course as there will be exceptions

I am afraid I don't want to say what I was interviewing them for because it was quite niche and potentially outing. I will say that the interviewees were university students/recent graduates, and I probably interviewed around 80 per year for several years. We would look at their educational background, work experience and extracurricular stuff quite carefully, and I'd say that probably around half of them had been privately educated.

Again, I can't share the specific questions without it being a bit obvious what I'm talking about, but we were typically asking questions around their insights into the potential barriers that people might face when accessing certain opportunities/ services. Sorry if that's a bit cryptic but it's as much as I'm willing to share!

Not all private schools are selective.

Sometimes, what requires SEN intervention in a busy comp can be dealt with in the normal classes in a small, quiet indie.

Teachers are generally equally good or bad depending on how well suited they are to their school. ...just because an academic with a PhD would struggle in a crappy comp, doesn't make them better or worse than one who would ace that challenge but struggle to fit into the ethos of a more traditional place. Just like the kids, horses for courses.

Re bullying..Indies can and do kick kids out much more easily than state. The threat and reality of that can help the problem, plus the smaller sites, classes and more activities at lunchtime mean there are fewer opportunities for it than in a 1000+ school. I'd never ever claim it doesn't happen, it does and only a fool would say otherwise.

Our choice for our DC's school (they have been registered but not started yet) was mainly because it was in the middle of my commute to work and still only 20 min from home. I have to leave early in the morning and DH would struggle to do school drop off so we needed a school with amazing wraparound care, including breakfast club. From Y3 onwards pupils can stay at school until 6.30 and if they do they will receive a full evening meal. The school is mainly a day school but also has boarding facilities, so when the DC are much older they can stay over with their friends during the weekend and have a sleepover.

So wraparound care was the main factor but they also have

• small class sizes
• amazing facilities for science, art, music and sport etc
• A woodland right next to EY buildings with full forest school facilities
• beautiful countryside location, huge playground and bright and airy classrooms
• teachers who seemed happy and relaxed, walking around with (portable) tea mugs. I saw a Y1 teacher wearing a white silk blouse, I used to teach Y1 and I wouldn't be brave enough to do that!

So I am a teacher myself, and I don't believe that the quality of teaching or calibre of teachers are necessarily better. What you do have is a group of children whose parents are probably quite well-educated. Children who probably live quite comfortable lives in safe homes and are well- supported. You probably won't have many, if any, pupils with SEN or challenging behaviours.

In an average classroom a teacher has to put a lot of effort into behaviour management, but in a class of 15 middle class children teachers can probably just focus on teaching and giving pupils individual support.

Oh and DC's future school has a farm, swimming pool and adventure playground.

Being 100% honest about it... private school is against my principles, but I would have thrown those principles under the bus without much hesitation if I had genuinely believed that dd would have been happier and/or got a better education in the private sector. I'm not proud of it, but there you go.

With this in mind, we looked at all of the local options for dd, including the "requires improvement" comp that nobody wanted to touch with a bargepole and several private options. We genuinely tried to keep an open mind, and picked the school than we felt would suit dd best. Some of the private schools had beautiful buildings and very good facilities, but apart from that, I didn't feel that they were offering a better standard of education. I couldn't see the value added, and reflecting back on it now, I think we made the right decision for us at the time.

I wouldn't judge any parent for doing likewise. If we're lucky enough to have a choice at all, then I am sure that we are all making what we believe to be the best choices for our dc. And while private education certainly wasn't the best option for my dc, I'm perfectly prepared to accept that it might be the best option for other children.

The main thing is small class sizes

The extras can be available at state schools as well, and if not can be topped up. I went to top state school and we had from your list...

Weekly swimming - we had this throughout year 7, and a club/team you could opt into

Learning an orchestra instrument (extra cost) - This was limited to the flute and then maybe the violin and opt in also had opt in singling classes and choirs

Debating - we did this in History and English, and had a debate club and team

Language (Spanish, French, German & afterschool Latin, Mandarin & Russian) - French from year 7, then German or Spanish as well for years 8-9, then you picked one for GCSE. Also one of the forms for year 7 was French Immersion. Latin and Mandarin were available for those in top language sets, as were student exchange programs to France, Germany and China. We also learned some Hebrew in RE.

Yoga - We did this in PE, in fact I taught it to other pupils as part of my Community Sports Leader Award

Hockey & Lacrosse - We did both of these as well as fencing, kayaking, gymnastics, athletics, cricket, netball, trampolining

Lots of sporting & drama opportunities - comparatively maybe lacking but we had drama club and productions, we had teams that competed for most sports and girls being coached at the school and competing internationally

Excellent field trips out of school - yes but they were expensive inc. hiking the great lakes of Canada

Ski trip from Y7 onwards.. - also had these but very expensive

as i explained above in my own example.

People just assume that private means selective or means they weed out SEN. Not in the slightest in my own direct experience.

See the anti private school side on this thread seem to have it boiled down to the following reasons:
They want their dc to meet some poor people because that will make them understand what it’s like to be poor. I don’t buy this at all. Children of these posters have educated, articulate, employed parents who no doubt have given them every opportunity to do fantastically well. Their dc will almost certainly gravitate towards similar dc at school, ace their grades in the top set and go off to uni. They will not understand what it’s really like to be born into poverty and all that entails anymore than my dc. Observing a different social group to your own doesn’t mean you understand it. I worked at a school where there was a huge range of socioeconomic backgrounds - think children in £2m townhouses ‘alongside’ children in care and in gangs. They did not, in any way mix, or speak to each other. They had no understanding of each others context at all. The wealthy kids generally stayed in the top set, out of trouble and the more challenging children completely ignored them. They simply didnt cross paths.

They don’t value small class sizes anyway (bizarre, as they really are better.)

They want their dc to feel privileged in comparison to their peers, which is apparently a good thing if you go to a state school because it’s checking your privilege but a bad thing if you go to a private school as it’s entitled.

I do understand that private schools are a bubble of privilege and don’t offer a true view of a very difficult world. I get that. And I do think it’s bit grim to have a whole bunch of people running the country who have all been to Eton. But I think it’s naive to think that by sending your very middle class, privileged children to a fantastic state comp you are somehow ensuring they grow up understanding the limitations of poverty and hardship.

Amen.