Tenants making viewings difficult

[areweonabreak]

We have a flat that we rent out. It was my DH’s flat before we met. It’s been rented out for 10 years now (by only 2 tenants) but we’re now in a position where our own house needs a lot of money spending on it and we want to free up some capital.

we do feel bad for the current tenant, we offered them first refusal to buy the flat (it’s on the market for £90k) but they cannot afford it (even though a mortgage would probably be cheaper than the rent but they’d another thread)

we’ve had a few viewings now but all the feedback is that the tenants have told them that they don’t want to move so they’re put off as they don’t want the hassle.

we live about a 40 minute drive away from the flat so the agents are sorting out all of the viewings. The agents have suggested that it might be easier to sell if it’s empty.

We’re really not sure what to do, they’re on a rolling monthly contract at the moment.

has anyone else been in this position before?

would anyone else recommend selling as a vacant property?

Just to point out….eviction is not the same as giving legal notice. I think some people are using the terms interchangeably.

Giving legal notice requires an S21 which gives the tenant at least 2 months notice from the date of the next rent payment, that the LL wants the property back. If a tenant doesn’t choose to vacate at the end of a fixed term tenancy (and usually they will choose to give notice if their intention to do so) then to end the tenancy, a LL always has to serve notice or the tenancy continues and becomes periodic. None of this is eviction.

Legal eviction is the process when a tenant who has been served notice has not vacated the property. It can take many many months. Tenants might not vacate because they have nowhere else to go. They might not be able to afford increased rents elsewhere. They might be hoping for social housing and been advised by the council that if they vacate willingly, the council won’t need to house them, so they should remain and be legally evicted because then the council will be obliged to house them (although usually just a room in a hostel etc) Occasionally, it is troublesome tenants who have damaged the property or not paid their rent who simply refuse to vacate. The eviction process can go all the way to baliffs. It involves the courts.

Snoodrops gives a good example of the problems of trying to market a tenanted property. Such properties are usually not shown to their best advantage, attract fewer buyers and often result in a lower sale price…if a buyer can be secured. Often buyers are advised against tenanted properties and pull out quickly or pull out when the process takes longer due to tenants not vacating or notice not having been served etc etc.

What should the tenants say if and when they're asked about their feelings and plans? Because it's going to happen, if it hasn't already. Should they lie or just not reply at all?

It's bit obvious it's to stall the price. Otherwise you would say what we dis if asked "oh we wouldn't move because it's good place, but unfortunately we have to"

Not full rate if it’s vacant.

How shortsighted of you to say a mortgage would be cheaper than rent! Maybe they can't get a mortgage, or can't afford to pay for their own repairs, or have a deposit. Are you really that stupid?

I think it's 50% isn't it @Whiteroomjoy? I was just making the point that they'll be losing rent + additional costs if/while it's empty

Giving legal notice requires an S21 which gives the tenant at least 2 months notice from the date of the next rent payment, that the LL wants the property back.

Is that the case even if they're on a rolling contract that's less than 2 months?

Wow, that’s quite the stretch

GoodChat. Yes, if someone is on a rolling or periodic contract, the tenant must give 1 months notice and the LL must give 2 months notice from the point of next rent payment date.

Remmeber too that if a LL hasn’t met their legal responsibilities such as putting the deposit in an approved scheme, issuing documents like Right to Rent and gas cert etc, serving notice and removing a tenant can become much more complicated and take longer.

In what way does the tenant hold all the cards? They can be evicted! Despite wanting to stay. The tenant has zero power. They lose their home at the whim of the landlord.

They don't want to move out and aren't going to go until they have to, that's fair enough. As is saying it to people viewing, they don't have to accommodate the viewings and are doing the landlord a favour.

Their presence in the property is losing the OP the sales so she should evict and sell vacant. It's not a complicated decision. There's a process that must be followed and tenants have the right to go through this and not feel they have to move out voluntarily when it's not what's best for them. Saying they have all the power is nonsense though

Oh ok, that's interesting. Thank you!

Another thread where posters, without a trace of irony, suggest the OP drop the price of their property dramatically just so the existing tenants can afford to buy it. What the fuck. 😆

Like the thread of old (I can’t quite remember it) but someone had a homeless man in her shed of something, and the OP was bashed by several posters for not inviting him in to shower and be fed. 😆

Are they even living in the real world? Or is it a level of holier-than-thou insanity reserved for MN?

I think it’s motivated by jealousy that he OP and her husband own more than one property.

All LLs need to expect to face a phase where they don’t receive rent, due to the property being vacant whilst they are marketing and selling the property. They need to factor that into their calculations about if being a LL is viable for them.

If a LL hasn’t calculated that and suddenly finds they don’t have the cash to pay their mortgage or other costs, that’s honestly not the tenants problem. The tenant shouldn’t and can’t be expected to facilitate viewings, to enable the poorly organised LL to both let the property AND market it at the same time. It’s one or the other.

People suggest the tenant is difficult. They suggest or imply that because the tenant doesn’t win the property and the LL does, the LL should be able to tell the tenant to leave whenever it suits them and should Co-operate in making themselves homeless and the property selling. Why?

Dont people understand that when a LL signs a contract, and gets rent, the tenant receives rights to enjoy the property and legal tights about notice and eviction which must be followed. This is the deal LLs sign up to. The fact that the LL is the owner doesn’t supersede or invalidate those legal rights. And of course that’s as it should be. Otherwise, people are asking tenants to sign a legal contract and pay rents, without receiving shat they’ve paid for and is legally theirs.

Here we go - always jealousy if you disapprove of someone else’s behaviour. MN is nothing if not predictable.

@Boopydoo

I'm sorry you need to move & especially with your sons having autism.

I'm curious to know though why you're saying to 'have respect' for her tenants & evict them?

You say you're in hell, in limbo. Why haven't you asked to be 'made homeless' by being served notice if that's what you need to bump you up on social housing?

You can say no to viewings, you don't have to allow them.

im sorry because it's shit having to find a rental just now. But I don't see why you're 'stuck' there?

@Boopydoo sirry, I hadn't got this far through the thread when I replied to your earlier post.

just say 'no more viewings, while im
paying rent I have the right to quiet enjoyment'.

it's up to you whether you allow viewing or not or if you negotiate your rent diwn to allow viewings.

it's in your interest to not allow viewings if he's not 100% fixed on selling & you might get to stay.

Attitudes like this really aren't helping.

'Greedy Landlords'. It's a bit late now to be careful what you wish for. Private landlords are selling because it's just not worth all the grief now, people complaining about other people owning rental properties.

well, now they're selling & there are fewer rentals...

has council housing suddenly tripled - nope. So how has it helped renters??

''@maddiemookins16mum · Yesterday 19:17
it’s situations like this which give tenants a bad name.''

What?

So, we have a landlord who has not served notice (because she still wants to squeeze out as much rent as she can until the flat receives an offer), who wants the tenants to facilitate regular viewing disrupting their lives in the process & who expects them to ''perform'' for viewers so they look happy and content to be quicked out of their flat.

And you think the tenants are the issue here?

Bonkers.

Indeed, what people need to realise is that a lot of tenants can't actually go anywhere until the legal process of a section 21 then eviction notice has been followed. We are priced out of private rentals and the council won't take responsibility for us being homeless unless the above legal process has taken place. Its not the tenants choosing to live this way, we have no choice, we are told stay put no matter what and wait for the legally required paperwork.

I have been a good tenant since 2006, I have had three landlords and my two previous landlords have fully returned my deposit to me and told me they were sad to see me go as I'd been a brilliant tenant and had not only looked after their property but improved it.
Even though my current landlord has taken the mick a lot, given the time frames he has given me, along with the demands he has made for me to follow to facilitate his wishes to sell without giving me any legal form of notice or time frame, I won't be damaging the property in some pathetic form of protest against him. I really wish people would stop tarring all tenants with the same brush.

@areweonabreak If they’ve been good tenants and have been there years, you could give them some of their rent back towards a deposit as a goodwill gesture? that might help the situation?

I'm not convinced I can believe anything he tells me, its all it might sell, it might not, a landlord might buy it, you might get to stay...

Already been lied to about if it was going on the market or not, so there's zero level of trust in what's being said. Then the property is marketed with no ongoing chain, prospective viewers are told once in the door there is a tenant. People get through the door then are put off because of the tenant, they don't want to be caught up in an eviction process and wait that long to get their house. It's a totally bizarre way of doing things which is causing pointless stress not only to me but to the embarrassed people booking viewings misguidedly. And they are embarrassed and feeling guilty because they apologise profusely on the way out and have said we never would have booked a viewing if they'd known. Given they are mostly local, or have been looking in this area for some time they know the level of the housing crisis happening here right now.

This !

Not mostly. Some of us are squillionaires and think it’s immoral to own multiple properties

it’s not a case of jealousy at all. I think it’s repugnant in this climate and there are way too many landlords who know fuck all about their responsibilities and the law.

Why should the Op.do.that ,she's not a charity ,?