Are patients not washed any more in hospital?

[Shortkiwi]

I am a nurse of over 40yrs plus. My 93 yr old father has been in hospital for a week. We have visited every day and had to wash and shave him in the afternoon or evening because it hasn’t been done. When I asked if he could be showered one evening, for the next day, I think they showered him but without using soap or shampoo, basically hosed him down from what he reported. His hair was definitely not washed. His teeth have not been cleaned without us doing them. Shaving is definitely not on the agenda. When I was a young nurse it was a given that patients were bathed each day, either in the bathroom or in bed. Teeth/dentures were cleaned and male patients shaved. We were admonished if these things weren’t done. Dad’s ward was very quiet today with several nurses chatting at the nurses station. They were very happy to get us any personal items we didn’t have. I just think if it wasn’t for us he wouldn’t be clean. He actually said, through his dementia, how much better he felt today after we showered him and washed his hair and said it would last him for a while! Which it won’t of course!
We had a list, in the old days, in terms of total patient care, in which we had to tick off items of personal hygiene for every patient in both our theory and practice. I’m sad for those that might not have relatives to attend to personal hygiene these days. It has never been discussed that we would do it, it’s just not been done. Basically, we have had to take the initiative. Years ago there were charts and care plans at the end of the bed, now it’s all computerised. I can excuse the 3 days of hell in A&E but not these last 4 days on the ward. My Dad is not mobile unless he has a lot of help and he is confused.

Is it true that everyone is living 20 years longer though really? Nearly everyone seems to have cancer these days at some point. I don't remember the levels of serious disease being present in the past. People were much healthier.

I am leaving this post here and leaving the thread. I have osteogenesis imperfecta (brittle bones that fracture very easily) and as a result spent my childhood in A+E and paediatric /orthopaedic wards due to getting complex fractures all my life. When I was 19 I was on an orthopaedic ward and the care I received was great. My buzzer was answered, I always got lunch and when I was immobile I was supported by staff to turn and move around and I always had morphine on time. 15 years later and I have been admitted to that same ward 15-20 times. There are 3 members of staff (2nurses and one HCA) who have been there for the past 15 years. One of the nurses 15 years ago was spectacular and saved me from depression, the others were good too but she was special and gave everything to her patients. Now when I see her, it seems as if she doesn't care. The buzzers go unanswered, sometimes lunch is missing, when I am mobilised it is always done in a more rough and quick way. Does this nurse not care? No... She is the same woman. I see her running up and down the ward without a break, I see she is trying to look after a dementia patient who just fell and cracked his head and answer 7 buzzers at the same time whilst useless paperwork that they never had to do before piles up. She gave me a brief smile on my last admission and a wave and I really felt for her. She knew she wasn't giving good care to the patient's but what could she do, it was beyond her. So thank you to all the HCP's for going on but truthfully you can't. The public either back you striking (which most do) or go on to pay privately which is worse for them but inevitable if things aren't sorted now. It's not nurses and doctors responsibility to hold up a breaking structure. Let it fall, leave your profession and let people pay thousands a year. It is already being suggested by MP'S now for the first time. People will look back at the NHS and think, why didn't we do more to support it when we had the chance.

To all those who are talking about where money will come from. Well if you tax those earning more than £500 million 1.5% there is enough money to fund the whole public sector in line with inflation. Including police, teachers, HCPs, firefighters ect ect....

That's not true, if you had cancer it was a death sentence previously with only palliative care. Pneumonia used to be called old man's friend, now we assess people for dysphagia which is pretty common in Dementias, so they have modified textured diets , then antibiotics if they develop pneumonia. Healthcare used to be a lot more hands off especially towards the end now we can keep the very elderly alive for 10-20 years with terminal illnesses but low quality of life.

Illnesses used to be much shorter because you would die quicker that doesn't happen anymore.

Update, he was washed today but they seem to have forgotten he has teeth! He can brush them but needs them to pass him his brush/ paste/ bowl to spit in.
I’m going to print this and politely give it to the ward matron/ sister
mouthcarematters.hee.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/6/2020/01/MCM-GUIDE-2019-Final.pdf

Halfasleep , rather than print off a 106 page document which no one will read, I would write a polite note about teeth brushing and stick it near his bedside.

Fair point!
Can I ask the hospital staff on here how much you are taught about oral care?
It shouldn’t be thought of along with having a wash but is essential healthcare so more along the lines of any other essential twice daily tasks- taking temperature?

Can I ask the hospital staff on here how much you are taught about oral care?

As an HCA? Taught nothing. It's a personal care task. Wash, shave, teeth, hair.

Going to print P79 and p83 and give to them to put in his notes.
I will do the risk assessment on P79 too, as his dentist.

As a student nurse I was taught a minimal amount.

As an ICU nurse when I was new a lot, and we carry it out very regularly.

I have attached a nice 106 page document for you to have a read of. It’s well written and will help your patients so much.
In short oral care is health care not personal care. Give teeth a priority over washing if you only have time for one.
And for pity’s sake don’t lose dentures!

They looked after him beautifully in HDU. On the ward it’s a different story.
Thankfully he has the most amazing consultant who looks at his obs on his phone even when not on duty and rings up and gets stuff done.

Halfasleep oral care across the NHS is really poor. I totally agree with that and patients on my ward come in with dreadful teeth and leave even worse. It’s the lack of dentistry as well. As a student I was taught that poor oral health lead to more chest infections. On that ward we had to give everyone mouthwash. Ive not seen that replicated elsewhere. As for NBm patients mouth care is essential as they could loose use of their tastebuds. They should be moistening the mouth every time they go in. Check he has a cup with a little sponge thing by his bedside.

Yes he does. Yesterday though his water was empty and cup dirty. Not sure how that happened when he’s not allowed to drink!
I got him fresh cup, water and sponges when I did his teeth. I also use clinell wipes to clean down his table and all his stuff- phone etc- every day when I go.

He’s in Bupa but this surgery was so major it can only be done in the NHS in a major cancer centre. The surgery, surgeon aftercare and HDU care has been outstanding.

I need major surgery, this is making me cringe

I had major surgery 12 years ago and was left to sit in my vomit and mess. My mother and husband had to help me to the bathroom to get washed. Two nurses stood puzzled because they didn’t have a clue how to work the shower. 3 days it took before my vomit stained bed was changed and that was after my husband had to ask them where the bed linen was kept as he was going to do it himself. When my baby boy was in special care he vomited all over himself and was left screaming while the staff all sat around the nurses station reading magazines. I was met with an eye roll when I asked if someone could change his bed and the nurse flung down her magazine and went to put a clean sheet over the dirty sheet and wasn’t pleased at all when I said she could hold my son while I changed his bed properly, she asked what was wrong with it and I replied would you sleep in your own vomit. Again this was years ago and nothing to do with cutbacks and staff shortages, just sheer laziness.

@Lbnc2021 I am sorry you had that experience.
Now everyone has their bed linen changed every day as a matter of course. It is part of the ward routine.

It was covered in blood and sick and they had been asked when it was going to get changed by myself several times.

Nurse sat in the corner doing paper work for over an hour (needs to be done!) Night shift came on, paper work hadn't been done. Apparently she was famous for her lack of movement.

I just got on and helped my DM. But what if she hadn't had me able to visit? My siblings were beside themselves that they couldn't visit. They kept thanking me for what I was doing. I was just glad I could. Not all the patients in the same bay as my DM had people who could regularly visit and undertake personal care. Also, visiting with a bunch of grapes and having a chat is one thing, but personal care is another- it's not something a next door neighbour who pops by to visit would expect to do. I think most visitors would expect hospital staff to do it.

@LynetteScavo I think my 86 year old mother would rather die slowly and painfully than wish her nearest and dearest to wash her privates or clean up her poo. And so would I.

Absolutely.

And what if the patient is 92 years old and not good at advocating for herself ? I’m really not saying that it’s the same across the board, but my mum was neglected while in hospital and a ruptured tumour was missed because no one was attending to her personal hygiene properly, or they would have seen it. And how do you explain her being dressed in someone else’s dirty, sweaty clothes when I got to the discharge lounge to collect her ? Or that despite them being fully aware of her dementia resulting in her needing help to eat, there were repeated instances of trays of food being left untouched on her table, because it was left out of her reach, and with no obvious help available for her to eat it ? Or that on quite a few occasions there were at least half a dozen nurses sitting on computers at the nurses’ station but I was pressing my mums’ buzzer for twenty minutes as she needed to go to the toilet - told someone would be there ‘in a minute’. No one came and she wasn’t attended to until I went to the nurses station and demanded someone help her - by then it was too late and mum had wet the bed. She was mortified. I understand that patient records are updated online and that student nurses train online, but what’s more important - obviously not the actual patient care.

I’m one of them - can’t do much as I’m disabled myself, but when I asked for a bowl of water and cloth plus a clean nightie for mum it was refused as it was afternoon visiting and they said her needs would be attended to now I had brought it to their attention. They weren’t.

I am a 71 year old woman who has Ataxia (mobility and balance issues ) I recently had a 5 night unexpected stay at a hospital. Not once was I offered, asked to wash. I have not washed out cleaned my teeth for 5 days
last night the house keeping staff got irate when I asked for a fresh liner in my commode, I discharged myself