Are patients not washed any more in hospital?

[Shortkiwi]

I am a nurse of over 40yrs plus. My 93 yr old father has been in hospital for a week. We have visited every day and had to wash and shave him in the afternoon or evening because it hasn’t been done. When I asked if he could be showered one evening, for the next day, I think they showered him but without using soap or shampoo, basically hosed him down from what he reported. His hair was definitely not washed. His teeth have not been cleaned without us doing them. Shaving is definitely not on the agenda. When I was a young nurse it was a given that patients were bathed each day, either in the bathroom or in bed. Teeth/dentures were cleaned and male patients shaved. We were admonished if these things weren’t done. Dad’s ward was very quiet today with several nurses chatting at the nurses station. They were very happy to get us any personal items we didn’t have. I just think if it wasn’t for us he wouldn’t be clean. He actually said, through his dementia, how much better he felt today after we showered him and washed his hair and said it would last him for a while! Which it won’t of course!
We had a list, in the old days, in terms of total patient care, in which we had to tick off items of personal hygiene for every patient in both our theory and practice. I’m sad for those that might not have relatives to attend to personal hygiene these days. It has never been discussed that we would do it, it’s just not been done. Basically, we have had to take the initiative. Years ago there were charts and care plans at the end of the bed, now it’s all computerised. I can excuse the 3 days of hell in A&E but not these last 4 days on the ward. My Dad is not mobile unless he has a lot of help and he is confused.

My mum, 92, was admitted to hospital in July 22 after a bowel haemorrhage. She has vascular dementia and cannot feed herself. The dementia has affected the area of her brain controlling appetite and I had informed the ward staff that she mainly exists on Ensure drinks - even offered to bring in a supply from home as they are on prescription. They said they would note it and supply them on the ward. I began to get concerned after several instances where, at visiting times, I found trays of uneaten food on mum’s tray table, which had been placed out of her reach and I knew she would not be able to eat unaided. No sign of the ensure drinks. I repeatedly asked for them to no avail and ended up bringing them in from home, along with little snacks I knew she liked.

I noted that mum had been in the same nightdress for three or four days and I was horrified that she smelled of BO and her hair was matted where she had been lying on it. I asked why she hadn’t been changed and was told that she had been washed and changed as routine, when obviously she hadn’t. The charge nurse advised that care assistants dealt with basic care on a daily basis and that she would make sure my concerns were passed on and that mum was receiving basic care. Mum was discharged after 6 days in hospital, during which time she was investigated for cancer. They couldn’t do anything other than CT scans as she is too frail for invasive testing.

The day she was discharged, the hospital rang me to ask me to collect her, and I presented myself at the ward with some outdoor clothes and her coat. I was advised that she had been sent to the discharge lounge, so went to collect her. On handing over the bag of clothing I was told it was OK, mum had on her dressing gown and slippers, and someone would bring her straight to the car. When I got her home, she had been dressed in someone else’s dirty clothes. There were sweat stains under the armpits of the jumper and the whole outfit reeked of BO. There was no sign of mum’s own night things or her wash bag and towel. But worse than that, when I took her upstairs to get her out of the clothes and shower her, on taking off her top, there was a large and very noticeable lump on her breast. When I rang the ward they knew nothing about it and said I would have to go through my GP to get a referral to the breast care clinic. Mum has a history of breast cancer, treated twice before at the same hospital and even though they were investigating her for cancer they never thought to check these records. And if they were attending to her basic hygiene as they claimed, they would have found the lump - you couldn’t miss it.

On attending the breast care clinic the consultant confirmed that the lump was another return of a previous breast cancer, and delved through all of the CT scans mum had had, as they included a couple of full body scans, and she couldn’t understand why it hadn’t been picked up. She found it easily - it had been missed on two scans although clearly visible.

I have yet to hear from the hospital regarding my complaint, but my own feeling is that hospitals are dangerous places for old and frail people who can’t advocate for themselves. Once you get to advanced old age you are no priority at all if this experience is anything to go by.

I was in hospital earlier this year and despite feeling very unwell and being hold not to exert myself, I walked to the bathroom to shower, wash my hair etc every day, if I hadn’t then it wouldn’t have been done. The patients on my ward who couldn’t get out of bed were never washed. I also spent 2 days in A&E and was not offered anything to eat or drink in that time even though my records must have shown that I am diabetic. My bother in law was in for over 3 weeks recently and was even in a side ward with private shower etc but again no one washed or shaved him. My sister works and could only visit for 2 hours a day and he was only aloud one visitor but after a week she said she had to get him into the bathroom herself to shower and shave him. Also for the first week or so he wasn’t really able to feed himself. Each day when my sister visited he said that he hadn’t had anything to eat. When she enquired the nurses said he had been given food (i.e put on his tray) but he wasn’t eating. No that’s because he needed help, which he wasn’t given. My sister had to take food up to him on her visits and feed him herself in the short time that she was there. There is no basic care anymore and I’m sorry but I don’t think it is all because they are so busy that they don’t have time. When I was in hospital the nurses seemed to do only what was necessary e.g: blood pressures every couple of hours etc. and nothing more. It seems to be the culture these days.

JenniferBooth I’ve never experienced anything like that though as a nurse though so I can’t acknowledge it on a personal level. Has it happened, yes because there was the mid Staffordshire scandal. It’s unfair to blame every nurse for when things go wrong. Nurses you the NHS too just like everybody else.

Please, I beg you to go down the route of medical negligence. You will get a nice large sum for medical negligence and that's what this is.

I said ACKNOWLEDGE
because so far I have read the posts from nurses with something approaching incredulity.
‘how dare we chat’
‘Day clothes’
‘physio sessions’
‘demanding relatives’
lazy patients that don’t help themselves

Jesus Christ

I just wanted someone to care enough to help me get the vomit out of my hair - instead it hung there for days making me feel sub human and so nauseous.

To say I am terrified of ever being admitted ever again to any hospital is an understatement.
I would sooner die at home.

I am not elderly or vulnerable by the way. I had two little children that were horrified at the state I was in. I will never forget their eyes wide open in horror when they saw the state I was in. With crusted blood still all over me. Filthy gown, matted hair. Horror movie stuff no one wants their five year old to see.

But hey mistakes happen…

I think most people do acknowledge theres poor standards of care throughout the NHS and that some nurses dont do the job with any care or compassion and have all but given up.

However. This is not the norm. I have come across staff like that but they are very much the minority in my professional experience. Ive reported both nurses and HCAs throughout my career for falsifying documentation or not completing basic care. But it is very much the minority of staff. The huge majority do care and strive to give patients their absolute best under very difficult circumstances. I feel very protective over my colleagues when they are being dragged publicly and its not what i see or what i do. My patients are my priority every single shift. Without fail.

That's very sad. I trained in the 1980s and like you, every patient every day was washed /assisted properly, their hair brushed and teeth cleaned even remember washing a glass eye once lol. I now work with babies and still important their hygiene is maintained daily (if they can tolerate it) It's just basic nursing care. Don't know what had happened but definitely nursing should still be about the basics obviously with all the added extras on top.

I did put in a formal complaint and it was investigated. I received an apology and an explanation that it was a norovirus that caused an issue with staffing levels.

The worst bit was leaving - all the nurses were at the station chatting away happily as if nothing had happened, and the radio was on playing Christmas music. Some had sparkling things on their uniforms and were chatting about Christmas. I felt utterly broken and quite frankly lucky to still be alive. Like I had been in a war zone.
My husband cut my matted hair out in clumps the following day and for some reason I couldn’t stop crying at that. It felt like the final humiliation.

I'm sorry that happened to you that's unacceptable and you should report to PALS. It's not acceptable to be left like that. I'm a HCP and I've also had poor care , while I was in labour the midwives wouldn't admit me kept telling me to get a bath and I wasn't in labour I told them to shove it I arrived on labour ward 10cm and DD was born 10 mins no pain relief was offered. Later on my notes it said active labour 4 hours so they lied. I don't think all midwives are bad just the ones I had didn't want to listen to me.

I've always ensured my patients are presentable and clean when I have time I do it myself instead of the HCas I love picking out the nicest clothes , combing and shaving. It gives me pride to see patients looking well and feeling good. I left my NHS job to work in a complex private long stay ward. We have 8 patients and 10 members of staff on shift it makes a huge difference to patient care. I go to work knowing I have the time to do my best.
I'm very sad that happened to you and you should complain , no one should be left like that.

My dad was in hospital last year for 2 months. He was washed daily but teeth not cleaned due to him becoming violent if they went near his mouth. He had advanced dementia. In the end he refused to let them feed him or give him drinks and routinely pulled out his drip. He was very hard to look after but they did a great job. They were slammed as well.

I think one of the reason why nursing has to be a degree profession now is so we can indeed learn about the mid Staffordshire enquiry and analyse it.

I am not blaming anyone for my experience, I am just sharing it, because I felt so sad to read that things are no better, and I so hoped I was just very unlucky and my experiences were one offs.
I have also come across wonderful nurses that made the terrible pain, the long months in hospital bearable just by being there with a smile and kindness in their eyes.

Desensitisation is a thing we should look out for, and becoming acclimatised to poor standards of care, patient suffering and shoulder shrugging becomes prevalent and basic care is totally abandoned. Someone needs to call it out.

Things do need to change for all of our sakes.

@headstone. Or nurses could just behave and work decently without having to critically analyse toxicity and dysfunction

Some people do refuse any personal care , if they don't have capacity it can be care planned under best interests and they will have to be restrained if they are really combative to allow to it. Sometimes they won't let you change their pad so you have to restrain to do it. Obviously we don't do it everyday to shower as if someone is large it can take up to 4-5 members of staff, to get someone in the shower. It's distressing and having to do it in front of other patients/relatives will cause upset. We will try persuading them if that doesn't work, we have to restrain and strip wash them , shower once a week/twice a week. If someone has capacity there's nothing you can do apart from encouragement. It's really not nice but has to be done.

The things I experienced, heard and saw in hospital were so horrible, cruel and neglectful.

At least my parents, a surgeon and theatre nurse, were not alive to learn of the degradation and suffering caused these days to patients in their beloved NHS. This was pre covid. I had the misfortune to have appendicitis on a Saturday, how foolish. I wish now it could have been a week dat and perhaps if it had been removed in a more timely manner I would avoided years of tummy troubles which, of course, coincidentally began after the surgery.

I awoke from my general anaesthetic early Sunday morning to hear two young ‘nurses’ in the recovery room discussing were my breasts real or implants. I was their only patient. They sheepishly tried to tell me they were talking about a celebrity in a magazine when I asked why would they would talk about me like that. It was obvious they were embarrassed to have been caught out.

I would have like them to be helping me with my nausea and vomiting after the anaesthetic. Perhaps enquiring about the pain. Not to mention I had been lying/ sitting in my period after being told to take out my tampon before the operation.

In the supposedly flagship hospital of the NHS in West London this was one example of many demeaning, shameful episodes. No nurse ever knew my name. At staff changeover they called me the blonde one, lots of visitors. At night I watched them at the nurses station on their iPads, while elderly ladies cried out in pain, all
our drips ran dry every night, bells were unanswered, people fell out of bed and the noise and suffering was unbearable. When I complained I was told the it was agency staff at night.

I don’t ever want to have an operation or have to be in hospital again.

Please do not leave your loved ones alone in hospital, especially at night. There are occasional staff who can help you and might even care but mostly they view patients as annoying units of work.

Same with my Dad. We (me, my mum and sisters) cleaned his teeth, encouraged to wash hands after toilet, shaved him, cut his hair, his nails etc. Some health care assistants hoses him down or used wipes but he was left ungroomed and it made us sad. Not their fault at all. Understaffed and over worked. Same as you OP we felt ultra sad for those patients who had no visitors and at one point I was feeding another man on ward and helping another out of bed because noone was there. Heartbreaking.

I awoke from my general anaesthetic early Sunday morning to hear two young ‘nurses’ in the recovery room discussing were my breasts real or implants.

😮

I had a stay on a psychiatric ward and one of the other ladies overheard the nurses bitching about her in their office and mimicking her accent. She was in for psychosis and hearing voices so it really upset her.

This post made me cry - my mum has dementia and has been in hospital 3 times in the last 2 hell like years.
we had to argue to be let in to help feed our mum and nurses ignored her bell and calls from me to help me get equipment off of her so we could take her to the toilet - ding lazy cowards - one can only speak from experience and my Nanna was a Nurse and I feel she would turn in her grave seeing the ‘care’ my Mum got on the wards.
nurses congregating around the nurses station laughing and talking when patients were distressed and calling out - disgraceful.
I feel people are being put off joining the Nhs as nurses because of all the whinging the nurses do in the media - yes staffing is at an all time low but who would aspire to become a nurse when all you hear is poor pay, poor conditions etc?
Nurses doing a good job should be paid fairly of course but then again patients should be treated with dignity whatever their state of mind as the vulnerable are being failed big time - just shocking it’s being going downhill for decades 💔

I really don’t know what you have against nurse RosesAndHellebores? The majority do behave decently. Obviously if you want to avoid these situations in the future educating the people who will be working in and running wards is vital.
Nurses can and do get struck off for not meeting professional standards. As you seem to hate nurses so much I suggest you go onto the nmc website and you can actually read about and see an up to date list of tribunals.

I’ve worked with some utter bastards who get their kicks from being cunts to patients. They like the power trip.

Nothing surprises me.

@headstone I only have issues with the rude and incompetent ones I've had to deal with. Sadly they outnumber the excellent ones.

Most seem to think patients are scummy and thick and that's how they deal with them.

I'm very pleased some get struck off. I'm sure it's the tip of the iceberg.

Standards have to improve swiftly and significantly.

lateallthechips did you report them?

That’s unacceptable about your dad’s care. Unfortunately staff nurses have taken on some of the roles of the junior doctors , phlebotomy, ecg, cannulation, IV antibiotics, male catheterisations etc., etc. most of these jobs require to be done immediately therefore pushing back basic nursing care . CSW’s were employed to help out the situation but their roles have grown too and there is not enough of them . May I ask, when you say your father’s ward was quiet , was it a nightingale ward where you could see the whole ward or a 4-6 bedded room. Nursing staff were alway so grateful for any personal care that the family were able to. Is your dad capable of shaving with an electric razor? Washing himself if given a basin , soap and a cloth?How did he manage before admission to hospital? Its a sad fact that basic nursing care is lacking but maybe it’s time to adapt to the European way, the family, if possible attending to personal hygiene .

That's horrific and I am so sorry to read this. I would believe it too.

This reminds of years ago. Maybe around 2005 or 2006. I can't remember exactly when. My brother was in hospital and at the time he was about 15 and he was in the paeds ward. He overheard the nurses talking about him and it wasn't nice. He got up, gathered his things and fled and went home. I remember a nurse phoning my mother in a panic that he was gone.
Rightly so after hearing the nurses chat and mmgiggke about him. Apparently it was funny news one of the nurses was a sister of his school preciple and they were having a great laugh about his academic stuff which was poor by the way. He fled the place never to return.

Nurses deal with people and their bodies and sometimes bodies can let us all down and be embarrassing. God, nobody wants to hear nurses joke and laugh about bodies. The nurses you overheard were quite simply filthy scumbags for joking about you and referring to you in such a demeaning way. Awful behaviour. I am so sorry to read this.

When my mum was in hospital she was so distressed as she hadn't been washed and was bed bound, it was such a stressful time as quickly became put on end of life care within a few hours. I'm ashamed to say I lost my cool and asked why she hadn't been washed that it was a basic human right and she deserved some dignity. Myself and a lovely HCA washed her changed her and made her feel more comfortable.

Nurses are so understaffed but there are those who really aren't bothered unless of course it was someone they loved in the hospital bed very unwell.