Are patients not washed any more in hospital?

[Shortkiwi]

I am a nurse of over 40yrs plus. My 93 yr old father has been in hospital for a week. We have visited every day and had to wash and shave him in the afternoon or evening because it hasn’t been done. When I asked if he could be showered one evening, for the next day, I think they showered him but without using soap or shampoo, basically hosed him down from what he reported. His hair was definitely not washed. His teeth have not been cleaned without us doing them. Shaving is definitely not on the agenda. When I was a young nurse it was a given that patients were bathed each day, either in the bathroom or in bed. Teeth/dentures were cleaned and male patients shaved. We were admonished if these things weren’t done. Dad’s ward was very quiet today with several nurses chatting at the nurses station. They were very happy to get us any personal items we didn’t have. I just think if it wasn’t for us he wouldn’t be clean. He actually said, through his dementia, how much better he felt today after we showered him and washed his hair and said it would last him for a while! Which it won’t of course!
We had a list, in the old days, in terms of total patient care, in which we had to tick off items of personal hygiene for every patient in both our theory and practice. I’m sad for those that might not have relatives to attend to personal hygiene these days. It has never been discussed that we would do it, it’s just not been done. Basically, we have had to take the initiative. Years ago there were charts and care plans at the end of the bed, now it’s all computerised. I can excuse the 3 days of hell in A&E but not these last 4 days on the ward. My Dad is not mobile unless he has a lot of help and he is confused.

This is true many have no interest in the rehabilitation part although it would make it quicker to get discharged. When you stop doing things it makes it harder to recover. Far too easy to lie back and let the staff do it, even the most I'll with dementia I will encourage them to wash their bits with assistance of course.

People need to be encouraged to do things themselves.
But sometimes I think people just want to feel looked after and cared for. It is horrible being really ill.

It's not about that. It's part of their rehabilitation to do the things they can do themselves, or they start to go backwards in terms of what they can do, certainly in the elderly patient.

We aren't there to pamper patients like they are in a spa, as nice as that would be. We are there to assist them with what they can't do.

People need to be encouraged to do things themselves.

true.
but plonking a damp flannel on the out of reach tray table of an immobile post op patient is not the way to do it.

And that's not what I meant or how things are done on our ward.

Do you work for the nhs? Are you a nurse or HCA?

As I said that I work on an elderly care rehab ward, where due to the nature of the ward, patients are there for rehab.

This means them doing as much as they can for themselves.

Do you think this means post op immobile patients?????? Ummmm no of course it doesn't!

Nursing isn’t a vocation anymore, there’s no care for patients. They moan they’re busy but seem to have a lot of time to stand around chatting and there’s never any sense of urgency! I feel like they are detached from the re world of working and most would be shocked at what ‘busy’ constitutes.

What is your experience, do you work for the NHS?

Oh dear. Don't you read the news? Hospitals are under-staffed! Nurses don't have time to go to the loo, let alone shower and shave patients! As for you seeing a group of them chatting, really? How long for? Nursing has changed A LOT since your idealistic day. The NHS is broken. Thanks to the Tory government. Tell them, not Mumsnet.

I fainted onto the ward floor on my way to the bathroom after a major operation. I was helped up but had vomited all over my hospital gown. The nurses were going to put me to bed in the filthy wet gown without changing me but Bulgarian nurse insisted on a clean gown. And people slag off foreigners!

So all of us who have seen it with our own eyes and could repeat back the conversations of the nurses relationships, holiday plans and bitching about colleagues are lying then?

Theres a lot of us on this thread saying the same and I’ve met a lot of people in real life who say the same too.

We can’t all be making it up for shits and giggles.

It happens.

So agree with uou , bring ba ck vocational nurses ,bring back proper nurse training on the ward leave the fegrees till after tnhey have wualified

ooops predictive text ...degrees ...they
...qualified !!

Ten years ago I was in hospital for a week, 30 years old but incapable of standing or moving myself around for the first 5 days, and no one washed me. I was so ill I didn't notice and have only just thought about it now.

The training is 50:50 theory and practice. Being a student nurse is hard, you are constantly trying to establish yourself into new teams, for no pay, for 12 hour shifts, with few weeks off a year in comparison to other courses. I had less time off as a student than i do full time employed by the NHS. Students work their arses off, they learn fast. The theory allows for all kinds of directions, the learn health promotion for going into practice or district nursing. They learn the process of research to understand why evidence based practice exists and how research is conducted. They learn about public health, legislations and vaccination programmes. They learn to understand research into to make changes. They learn about local health issues so they understand the demographics they are likely to see once qualified. Its being a degree doesnt take away the practical training. They learn all the essential skills, assessments and procedures, they learn care. Modern nursing isnt what it used to be. The responsibility in nursing now is much greater. Nurses are making decisions on care rather then just following drs orders. Its changed. It needs to be a degree to encompass the amount of knowledge and skill they have.

Theres always going to be bad eggs. We are also going to chat. I have to fill in 15 care plans twice a day. I do so sat down. Sometimes chatting to those around me. But if i dont complete these careplans twice a day im risking my job. So yes on occasions ill be sat at a desk. Ill be also doing referrals, arranging packages of care, waiting for a call back from someone i have bleepd. Reading patients previous admissions. Referring to outside agencies etc. i cant be on the floor 100% of the time as my job requires desk work too.

I really, really don’t understand why the OP hasn’t spoken to the Senior Charge Nurse about this?!

Especially when she’s gone up to request cleaning materials a quick “I see my father hasn’t had his personal car attended to today, when will this be happening?” is surely all it takes?

It was healthcare assistants who came to do this when my daughter was in hospital. I wouldn’t expect a nurse who is a clinical expert to do so. They were carrying out the complicated obs she required and other things. DD was happier for me to do personal care but the HCA showed me how to use the soap in a can / no water stuff as she was bed bound. They brought clean towels round twice a day for me to do so and a ware bag for the disposable wipes. And we all worked on her hair as the shampoo caps were not made for people with long hair.

This happened with my dad too. He had terminal cancer and was in and out of hospital and was never washed. He eventually moved to a hospice and the nurses there were better and cleaning him. I think it’s so demeaning and upsetting for them x

No. They don’t. And it’s not new.

I was bed ridden and pregnant with a broken leg 6 years ago. No offer of any hygiene help at all of any description and I had no family nearby to assist.

I really really don't know how you can not understand that this is now standard practice in many/most hospitals and has been the case for years.

Of course op can go and speak to the senior nurse if she can find one, and she will be told they have to prioritise drug rounds and other more pressing medical issues and if it is bothering or the patient the towels are that way >>>

Or most likely, she will be told they will get around to it as soon as they can, and it will never happen.

Some pp are so far removed from the actual reality. I have been in hospital for days without a pillow (they didn't have one) and a bottom sheet that didn't fit and a blanket that had not been washed and a variety of medical wrappers etc left over from the last patient. You can clearly see some people do not get the dire situation at all. I live in a very affluent area with a well funded new hospital. I hate to think what the situation is like elsewhere.

I am an HCA on an acute admissions unit and I am scared every day I am in work because we are so short staffed that I dread something awful and unnecessary happening. I'll agree there are people who don't seem to bother with teeth (why?! I will never understand that, at the very least brushing your teeth will help you feel better when you're poorly), but on the whole we give the best personal care we can in the circumstances. I'd love to have time to "stand and chat at the nurses station". I can assure you this does not happen where I work, who has the time, with patients being moved on to wards/sent home/new admissions arriving all the time. A whole bay of 7 patients can be completely turned around in one shift, and then some. We don't have baths any more in our hospital, which is a crying shame because bathing patients was one of the things I enjoyed most, great quality time with patients. It is often -- not always, but often - the case that patients seem to be under the impression that I am there to provide all their care for them even if they are capable of doing it themselves. My role is to enable and empower people to do as much for themselves as they can, while of course offering support where they can't. It would help if relatives would bring in clothes for patients rather than just pyjamas - clothes aren't just for the day they leave! It is important to encourage patients to start getting back to normal, and it's not normal to sit around in a horrible gown or nightie all day. I appreciate some (lots, it seems, sadly) have had bad experiences with their relatives, I can't comment on those really, only to say again that this is not my experience as an HCA. Our nursing teams are under such pressure that we don't ever feel we are giving a great service. We are not able to work to the standards we should be able to, and this extends to patient care. Patient care and safety is the biggest reason for our striking, it is not all about pay. Do I enjoy being pulled from pillar to post and patient to patient while completing half a task at a time for each of them, because there is so much going on with acutely unwell patients, moves on and off the unit, and supporting patient needs? No I don't. But sometimes that's how it is, and it's sh*t.

I am a nurse, and I can ensure you that yes patients are washed every morning, unless they refuse, in this instance we are not allowed to force them.

OP, Is your dad on ward 9 at the Royal Free? My husband is there atm and the duty of care is atrocious! Out of around 15 nurses only 2 are wonderful. The rest are lazy and unpleasant. I have complained twice to the ward manager but I will be taking it further as there is no change. If you don't like the job then bloody leave.

So it was dreadful during the Tony Blair era as well?

It was pretty awful under the Tories. I know as I experienced it.

I mean Labour