Learning native languages should be compulsory in the U.K

[RainCloud]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jul/25/why-i-quit-gaelic-language-forefathers-vocabulary?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

I saw this article earlier and it made me sad that the number Scottish Gaelic speakers are declining. I think it should be compulsory for us all to learn Scottish Gaelic and Welsh at school, all over the U.K. I'm not saying that we should all be fluent but we should learn the basics. It might inspire more people to become fluent and stop the languages dying out.

A friend of mine has her dc in a Scottish speaking school, full immersion. They're a very middle class family & I gather the school has the same demographic. I'm interested to see how her dc progress, so far they're thriving.

Students in the UK struggle with speaking, reading and writing English correctly, as demonstrated fairly frequently on this forum, and many other forms of social media. There is no point to the vast majority of students to learn Gaelic or Welsh if they are never going to use it. I now live, and teach, in wales, where Welsh is compulsory. Their levels of literacy in English are not good ...

My children’s ancestors fought at Flodden so that this sort of thing wouldn’t ever happen…

My dd learns French and Spanish in school has been for past 2 years and still hasn't a clue lol we go to Spain every year so I thought she would benefit from Spanish NOPE hasn't a care or interest

So what would you like schools to STOP doing to enable this?

Oh no habet!

Fābula non jam dēsiit.

I know where you are coming from op, but I don't think school necessarily the place. There is so much already to cram in. Apps like Domingo have conservation languages such as Scottish Galic, which everyone with Internet access has access to. My dc's school have promoted Duolingo for use at home, and I think its down to parents to encourage its use for fun. My 2 dc can now do the basics like exchange pleasantries and order a bottle of wine for me in Scottish Galic, French, Spanish, Norwegian, Italian, Chjnese and German between them 🤪.

This. It would be unreasonable to expect the whole country to learn more than hello, goodbye, please, thank you, unless it's an area where that language is used, such as Welsh in Wales. I think people should leave school having an understanding of the languages spoken in the UK - far too many think only English is spoken anywhere.

Spanish would be more useful in life I would think.
What would be the point of learning a language that nobody speaks anywhere else in the world? Or even barely in the uk! I would have thought a language like Spanish, French Polish, Arabic would serve you better in life!

While it's good for people in the relevant regions to learn native languages, we can't all learn all of them. So perhaps there should be more focus on the culture and history rather than the medium. After all, how would this work in England? I had to do some Chaucer in Middle English for my O level - it really didn't enhance my appreciation of the culture of the time versus a modern English translation (probably the reverse, in fact). We'd have to learn Latin, Norman French too...

Where did Latin die out? What is today's Italian based on? In Britain, surely Latin is alive and well and mixed in with the languages of other folk who came to live here after the Romans went away.
Oh, companions, I will be pleased to see you next week and eat bread with you.

we live in Scotland my DH is a highland Scot his maternal grandmother spoke Gaelic but not his parents, I think all his great grandparents would have spoken gaelic so his linguistic heritage is gaelic but lowland scots and Robert Burns is not, Gaelic is a west of Scotland language it was not really spoken in orkney, Shetland Aberdeen or the lowlands, and not in Edinburgh for a few hundred years, it was more common and still is in Glasgow due to the influx of Glasgow |Highlanders in past 150 years but 87,000 out of a population of 5.5 million is 1.7% this doesn't mean the 1.7% are fluent but that they speak some gaelic the number who can read and write in gaelic is much less. We think it should be supported in areas where it is still spoken but there is no point in kids from Peterhead, Hawick, Helensburgh and Musselborough learning gaelic, it is just another "fluff" policy wasting money instead of addressing the essentials like housing jobs the economy, basic education and the health service and justice system, if there is spare time in cirriculum I would rather DD was taught budgeting, how to debate and differ on issues without falling out with people, preventive health care nutrition and keeping fit

How do you see that working in Northern Ireland (which is, at this point, part of the uk.)?

Several PP have said it but OP hasn’t answered…do you not realise the political strife this idea is causing in Northern Ireland?
(I am not particularly pro or anti Irish language act but I do recognise that a language died because of being suppressed and people are allowed to be upset about it)

I live in a relatively anglicised part of South Wales. I'm a first language Welsh speaker (my family are Welsh speakers). In person I hear "I wish I could speak Welsh" frequently. On social media I read "what's the point? It's useless outside of Wales. Everybody speaks English anyway" etc. frequently. I did French and German in comprehensive, German at GCSE. Do you know how often I've used either of those MFLs? I could probably count on my fingers. And when I have had the chance it's been on two weeks maximum family holidays (I've also learnt the polite basics in other languages for holidays too).

The cognitive benefits of acquiring another language far outweigh the negatives (of only being able to speak said language in one geographic area). I don't think all UK children should have to do a GCSE in a native language, but I do think an awareness of the basics (greetings, thanks etc.) needs to be brought to their attention. I also think the Westminster government need to promote the diversity of Britishness. I feel that Britishness is Englishness because it doesn't recognise or promote Cymraeg, Gaelic, Cornish etc. languages and cultures.

I have often heard that us Welsh speakers are insular and need to broaden our horizons. But in my experience, it's the other way round in Wales.

What would you like schools to drop, @RainCloud in order to do this?

I never knew that. Never heard of ''Scots''. Only ever knew about the gaelic that is similar to Irish.

Hearing CODAs are native sign language users and no reason in principle that they couldn't teach BSL. I did an ESL course and it's very much accepted in spoken language research/pedagogy that non-native speakers can be just as competent when it comes to teaching languages as native speakers.

But obviously there is a huge political dimension to hearing people teaching BSL. The only hearing person I know who attempted it was through one of those daft sign and sing classes and she was among the least proficient BSL users I know. It's always the ones who shouldn't...

@RainCloud I'm a Gaelic learner, but am Scottish living in Scotland and exposed to Gaelic somewhat regularly through my job so there is some merit to people like me learning. Can't see what the obvious benefits would be to someone living in England, who has no exposure to the language in an everyday context. Surely they'd be better off learning BSL, another indigenous language to the British isles? That would potentially have immediate practical benefits and provide a possible career path for them in the future.

Houbare confusing Latin with languages which have Latin roots. Latin as a language is dead, it is no-one’s native tongue.

As the old rhyme put it;

Latin is a language, as dead as dead can be.
First it killed the Romans, and now it’s killing me.

In just the same way middle-English is dead and so is proto indo-European.

In Scotland and Wales - yes I can see the argument OP - but in England? No thanks!

Gaelic is not native to much of Scotland.

Don't see why we should be forced to learn it either.

Gaelic was widely spoken across medieval Scotland. There is clear evidence of Gaelic speakers near Dunfermline around 1300. The Book of Deer - dating from the 10th century - was written in Aberdeenshire. A bit of knowledge of Gaelic will show how widespread it was - recorded in the place-names.

There is a common perception that Gaelic is/was only spoken in the Highlands and the islands in the west. That's incorrect (medieval historian here). The only local authority where it wasn't much spoken is the Scottish Borders, particularly towards the east. In the Middle Ages it was widely spoken and it took a long time to be replaced. In Highland Perthshire it was the main language until the first world war.

Please tell me when you think Gaelic was ever spoken in Orkney and Shetland? Neither were even part of Scotland until the 15th century and the people spoke Old Norse and then Norn until it died out in the 18th century and was replaced with Scots although there are still Norn words used in the dialects today.

Daft idea.

Why should a Geordie child, for example, spend time making sure the Welsh language doesn’t die out? That time could be much more productively used learning a key business language, a widely-spoken language or sign language. 🤷🏼‍♀️

Yes, oops missed Orkney and Shetland. Completely agree that Gaelic wasn't spoken there. Pictish, then Norse and eventually Norn...😀