Ukraine Invasion: Part 27

[MagicFox]

27th thread, thanks for the continued company and analysis all

Woohoo - go Ukraine! Thank you US of A. Been waiting for hopeful news of Ukraine picking up on the battlefield, so this is timely.

And go die Putin

Woohoo - go Ukraine! Thank you US of A.

You're most welcome, certainly. We'd much rather have all that kit being put to good use than sitting in storage.

In other good news, Ukraine has sunk a Russian naval tugboat that was attempting to resupply Snake Island with American Harpoon antiship missiles.

The Ukrainian Navy shot down the Russian tugboat Vasily Bekh with Harpoon missiles. The tugboat was heading to the island “Snake”

The Russian hold on Snake Island is doomed. Ukraine can starve them out of food, fuel and more troops by sinking any vessel that approaches or cut them to mince with HIMARS once those are deployed. It's a very small island and only 35 km off the coast.

Surely given them a roof over their head somewhere while they sort something out is better than them sleeping on the streets? Especially elderly and kids? No? is the street safe?

Homeless doesn’t mean sleeping on the streets.
From the ShelterUK website:
’When are you homeless?
The definition of homelessness means not having a home. You are homeless if you have nowhere to stay and are living on the streets, but you can be homeless even if you have a roof over your head.
You count as homeless if you are:
staying with friends or family
staying in a hostel, night shelter or B&B
squatting (because you have no legal right to stay)
at risk of violence or abuse in your home
living in poor conditions that affect your health
living apart from your family because you do not have a place to live together’

Councils might well be putting Ukrainians into temporary B&B accommodation (not ‘commandeering’, we’re not at war) but it should be in the local area, not one big hotel for everyone.

one near us has broken down and the woman is desperate for a home ... today. 2 kids and pregnant. I wish I could do soemthing but we're already doubling up bedrooms and the kids are feeling the strain. Hopefully they will find somewhere.

I think its a bit more complicated than that....

I will explain a little as best I can.

I've been talking to a family who were from the area liberated from the Russians earlier in the war. Their building is badly damaged and needs urgent repairs as it has no roof. The Ukrainian government has promised money but none has come. If they don't start to repair it soon, when winter arrives the entire building will need complete demolition.

So she went to western Ukraine. Whilst she was there she didn't have a good experience. She described people as angry and hostile. Largely because they are under so much pressure to support those who are displaced and have nothing. There is no accommodation and prices are shooting up. This is making life hard even for those with homes and jobs and haven't been displaced.

This is why she decided to come to the uk. Her placement is working out as far as i know. Her hosts are a family well respected in the community and DH knows reasonably well. I think they will be ok.

But thats not the case for everyone. And thinking about her story as a background for others who might have a tough time in the uk is worthwhile.

The family that has had their arrangement breakdown has found a community thats welcoming and they now know people in. Psychologically to then be forcably removed from that and be isolated and the kids be out of school again because they can't get to it, is cruel and damaging. They have been put into a local hotel.

A month or so ago the government removed the requirement of councils to find suitable accommodation within six weeks for refugees. This means if you get stuck in a hotel there is no legal requirement to get you out again on authorities. Thats fine... Except hotels (unlike b and bs) dont have kitchen facilities, so what do you eat? You can't cook. You often can't store food as most basic rooms have no fridge. You can't afford to feed yourself because your universal credit hasn't come through yet. And even the food bank probably is going to be lacking in food items you can just eat without heat. Remember they won't even have plates.

The onus is then on the refugees and charities to find alternative accommodation. Which, at this point, is getting increasingly difficult because those who are proactive have matches by now. Yet the government has a whole list of people it could contact as possible hosts but is just sitting on it. Remember they may not speak English. Being in temporary accommodation also makes it much more difficult to get a job too.

For starters, hotels are inappropriate accommodation. Many b and bs and hostels have been found to be inadequate and actively dangerous (the Manchester evening news did a big expose on this about 18 months or so ago) because of who else is housed in these buildings. Its not safe for women and children. They are often in the same place as ex-convicts and drug addicts for example.

If you want reduce this to 'having a roof' then you are ignorant. They deserve dignity, respect, safety, stability, a suitable way to access food and supporting psychologically. Just dumping them somewhere and saying 'oo job done' kind of misses the point...

I haven't posted on these threads for a while but I have been reading them so I just wanted to thank you all for continuing providing information 🌻

Good news. Do you recall the captured and missing medic Taira who had managed to save her body cam footage of rescues and get it out? She has been released.

www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/06/17/7353167/

@Ijsbear It must be particularly dreadful to be homeless twice - away from your country and now homeless in a new one. I hope the family you know can be helped this weekend.

I think understanding that humanitarian efforts do not end at the border is an important lesson.

We do not treat refugees well in this country. (This goes for the treatment of refugees fairly universally tbh). They are the 'unwanted' who need to feel like they belong.

@RedToothBrush · Today 09:41 Your description of the some of miserable realities of being a refugee here in many cases needs listening to. It is not something we think about enough, or at all.

Well clearly I worded my post extremely badly therefore I’m an ignorant yaodnwho doesn’t give a shit and o should just shut the duck up so fine, I’ll shut the duck up and quietly cry while wishing I could do more to help and that ducking Russia would duck off!

what e actually need is people to stop being entitled selfish bastards and hating on immigrants and refugees and poor people and yeh gov to stop spending billions lining their friends pockets while everyone else suffers but let’s not worry about that. Let’s pick on people for not wording things brilliantly and instead of not understanding that maybe they didn’t mean something quite like it sounded criticise them. So helpful.

The conversation wasn't about miswording. The suggestion was why can't we just put them all in a hotel. I was respond to that question. Its important to do that, as others will take the attitude of they should just be grateful for that. Spelling out actual reality rather than what people presume to be a solution is necessary. If you want to take that personally, crack on. Its not about your feelings though.

Key Takeaways

Russian forces continued to launch unsuccessful ground assaults against Severodonetsk and its southeastern outskirts on June 17.

Russian forces continued efforts to sever Ukrainian lines of communication to Lysychansk, both from the north toward Slovyansk and in the south near Bakhmut.

Ukrainian forces are likely conducting a counteroffensive northwest of Izyum intended to draw Russian forces away from offensive operations toward Slovyansk and disrupt Russian supply lines and are making minor gains.

Ukrainian forces and aviation continued to strike Russian logistics and fortifications in occupied settlements along the Southern Axis, with localized fighting ongoing.

Russian forces continued to regroup and transfer personnel within Zaporizhia Oblast to maintain defensive positions along the frontline.

Russian President Putin reaffirmed his commitment to “completing” the Russian operation in Ukraine but acknowledged that unspecified new Russian tactics (which are likely simply explanations for poor Russian performance) will take time.

Unconfirmed Ukrainian sources reported that the Kremlin fired the commander of the Russian Airborne Forces, Colonel-General Andrey Serdyukov, due to poor performance. (ahahahaha)

Further info on this:

Andrey Serdyukov, who apparently led the operation to seize Crimea in 2014, subsequently led the Russian military group in Syria. And in January of this year, he headed the CSTO contingent brought into Kazakhstan to suppress protests. Serdyukov was accused of low efficiency and heavy losses among the Russian airborne units, especially during operations in the first weeks after a large-scale invasion of Kyiv.

“Further layoffs and possible internal purges of high-ranking Russian officers are likely to further exacerbate the weak capabilities of the Russian command, as well as the management and credibility of Russian officers,” the ISW said.

[This is a big fish, removing him is surprising as he's had a successful track record so far. Be interesting to see who he is replaced with, but this guy had a lot of experience and I can't help thinking that the replacement had better have both fire and smarts, or he won't do as well. Let's hope he has neither].

+++

The Kyiv Independent, [18/06/2022]

⚡️Official: About 10-15 Mariupol residents describe cholera symptoms daily.

⚡️Lithuania suspends transit of some goods to Russia’s Kaliningrad (this is the Russian ' Hong Kong ' - it's a powerhouse of manufacturing and shipping. It's located between main Russia and the Baltic coast with a couple of countries in between it and Russia main, so Lithuania suspending transit of some goods is really quite inconvenient).

⚡️Reuters: Sale of 4 US Gray Eagle drones to Ukraine on hold. concerns the sophisticated surveillance equipment could fall into Russia’s hands.

⚡️UK intelligence: Russia renews attempts to advance south of Izium, Kharkiv Oblast.

⚡️Official: Ukraine may resume talks with Russia in August.

⚡️Ukraine publishes its EU candidate status questionnaire.
The Ukrainian government published the EU questionnaire and Ukrainian responses to it on June 17. The European Commission recommended giving candidate status to Ukraine on June 17, and the European Council is set to decide on Ukraine’s application on June 23.

+++

ukraineNOW

🫂 89% of Europeans sympathize with Ukrainians, and 88% support providing refuge for victims of war in Ukraine. At the same time, 65% of Ukrainians who have gone abroad are eager to return home at the earliest opportunity.

❌ CERN is suspending all cooperation with Russia and Belarus, the organization said in a statement [Russia really is becoming a pariah for the West (not the East!) People use that word easily but there are so many important organisations severing links]

📌 Russia's war against Ukraine will be one of the topics of the G7 summit — Christiane Hoffmann, the First Deputy Spokesperson of the German Federal Government [I saw a statement that Zelensky will be invited too!]

🚚 Scania, a Swedish company, is opening a new station in Brovary, a town in the Kyiv region — Embassy of Sweden in Ukraine

💥 Ukrainian defenders shot down an extremely rare enemy drone "Merlin-BP" — Ukrainian Air Force. This UAV was publicly demonstrated by the Russians only in September last year and has not even been adopted yet. [The Russians have been trying out new weopons and tech in Ukraine]

🤝 Slovenia has handed weapons over to Ukraine and offers training — Slovenian Minister of Defense Marjan Šarec. Slovenia has supplied Ukraine with Kalashnikov rifles, helmets, bulletproof vests, and 35 infantry fighting vehicles.
Regarding new arms supplies, Šarec said that Slovenia has exhausted its arsenal of what it can provide at the moment. [This will happen more in the coming months]

❌ Norway has banned oil imports from Russia by sea — Norway Today

‼️The Russian Federation withdrew several units from Ukraine due to the crushing blows of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, more than 30 pieces of equipment by the invaders were destroyed per day on June 17

🇺🇳“We are facing hell on earth if we don’t stop this damned war,” said David Beasley, director of the World Food Program

‼️Belarus prepares for war with Ukraine
Military expert Oleg Zhdanov is convinced that Belarus continues to delay the invasion of Ukraine, but it is already clear that it is preparing for war.
“Lukashenko, perhaps, on the one hand, continues to delay the moment when it is necessary to give the order to invade, but at the same time Belarus is really preparing for war,” the military expert noted. [It seems to be clear that Lukashenko really doesn't want to, but Putin might be forcing him]

⚡️The President of Kazakhstan refused the Russian Order of Alexander Nevsky
Kassym-Jomart Tokayev is not going to accept either domestic or foreign awards while he is president, political analyst Yerbol Yedilov said. [brave, brave man]

mobile.twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1538112375035146241

mobile.twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1537875838112260099 farmers sowing crops

Spelling it out was fine until you said I was ignorant. That’s the bit I took personally. There was no need for that to be added.

yes My thinking was oversimplified and literally (as was probably clear) about getting them away from
sleeping on the pavements. Fine I’ve learnt don’t let my emotions spill out and make silly over simplistic posts that allow me to be attracted by other posters on the thread. When I posted that initially I was in tears thinking about kids and elderly people who have fled the war being kept sleeping on the streets.

first I was met with acorn and derision by a other poster and then you called me ignorant.

So yeah crack on thinking your words don’t affect people and tough shot to the people if they do because it’s not about emotions!

I had a lot of respect for you and your posts, I think I’ve just lost a lot of that with your “it’s not about emotions”.

sometimes taking emotions into consideration is actually a good thing and makes us think twice before we attack people. Sorry you disagree!

Ps: I actually did appreciate the explanation, there’s lots of little nuances that no I hadn’t thought of. Shame the rudeness added detracted from the message and therefore the usefulness of the post you took the time to make

Ignorance is not a fault. All it means is that someone doesn't know something.

My sainted Pa used to point out that ignorance can be fixed; it is stupidity that is incurable.

mobile.twitter.com/sumlenny/status/1538139609988743168 advances towards Kherson. Good news if true

@Onceuponatimeinalandfaraway · Today 12:00
yes My thinking was oversimplified and literally (as was probably clear) about getting them away from
sleeping on the pavements

Please don’t be upset, I am sure anyone reading knew what you meant and might have been thinking exactly the same especially given the emergency and how upsetting the news about the refugees and breakdowns in hosting has been.
I would have by and large before other posters coming on and explaining why it is so problematic as a solution, so I am grateful for their explanations.

But I agree it’s not something to put people on here down about, or that people’s feelings on here don’t matter. This thread has luckily been respectful even after all this time, and this has been a blessing. People shouldn’t need to feel too wary to voice an idea so please stay around.

For what it is worth I took RedToothBrush’s remark about people who think of the hotel solution as being “ignorant”, to mean ignorant in the most literal sense of the word: simply lacking in the required knowledge. I did not take it to mean anything more pejorative, or even that this pertained to your post in particular - but rather to anyone thinking of the hotel solution, as indeed the government often has too.

@Onceuponatimeinalandfaraway hey, I hope you are feeling too bruised. I would have thought of the hotel solution if a person were homeless and things broke down with the host family, so that makes me ignorant. That said, I don't believe anyone on this thread is ignorant because the truly stupid would not bother to educate themselves. I learnt about the dangers in reality of women and children living in a hotel, definition of homelessness and what Ukrainian refugees need to integrate and despair at the farcical hoops they have to go through despite trauma and language and cultural barriers.

If you are feeling emotional, that makes at least two of us. I too want to quietly cry at feelings of helplessness. We all want the same things ... yesterday

Being "ignorant" - in the true sense of the word - is fine, provided you are willing to be educated and learn new things ....as most of us on this thread are

Being deliberately ignorant and refusing to be be educated or learn new things is the problem

In practical matters:

olexander scherba🇺🇦
@olex_scherba
·
3m
Journalist Roman Tsymbaliuk: on June 17, headquarters of 🇷🇺 20th army near #Kharkiv hit by Ukrainian artillery. Over 40 dead military, including senior officers. No survivors.

(in very personal matters, I had my first ever manicure from N. one of our guests today. I run more to motorbikes and whiskey but this was just ... lovely. She went subtle too, or I'd have run!)

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime @ScrollingLeaves @blueshoes thank you.

@RedToothBrush sorry I’m being over sensitive.