If you're a South African living in England....(or you know some)

[TiredButDancing]

.... do you regularly get told you're terribly blunt/tell it like it is/ call a spade a spade a spade etc? And usually when you think you've made a fairly benign comment?

I thought it was just me because I am quite chatty and open and I always just thought that was me, not because I'm South African. But was chatting yesterday with a client who I consider to be the epitome of polite, measured responses and who also happens to be a South African and she said that in a meeting recently where she raised something she considered relatively minor but that needed a solution, the senior person in the room said, "Trust the South African in the room to come out with it."

I no longer comment in most school WhatsApp groups etc except when it's essential and they are looking for specific information from me (eg, "yes, DS will attend that event") because I slowly came to realise that there was a higher chance of me accidentally offending someone. I've also just declined to be the parent co-ordinator for a group the DC attend because while I'd actually be very happy to help out, I find the way the things the other mums say and do on the chat frankly baffling, and assume, based on experience, they'll feel the same about me.

Anyone else?

I'm mostly super happy living here and we have such a great life and lots of friends etc. But even after more than 20 years I still seem to be blindsided by cultural differences.

I know as many blunt South Africans as I do English but people focus on the tangible differences as a cause for those that are blunt rather than people just being different. If that makes sense...

Hmm the DH of the SA couple I know is blunt, his wife the total opposite. But Dancing Queen is right they've got nothing on my Israeli friend! (Going to a restaurant with them is quite traumatic from a "not making a fuss because we're English" point of view 🤣🤣

I know several SAs. Lovely people but yes all are blunt, first few conversations I was like WTF, but now I know it's just them. I actually sometimes wish I could communicate like that 😂

Interesting! I know 3 South Africans through work:

1 is very friendly, warm and outgoing
2 is quiet, serious
3 is humorous and direct

They're on the blunt side but just in a genuine, straightforward way - not aggressive at all. In fact the thing I'd say they have in common is being very easygoing and likeable. Best accent ever too of course!

I know so many Saffies, both here and in NZ. Yep, you fellas are blunt. But that doesn't equate to mean, or harsh. I have known mean or harsh saffies, but that was them as individuals, not as a nationality!

I worked with a South African guy for many years and he was blunter than a spoon. I quite liked it but it didn’t go down great with everyone. Like you say, he didn’t think he was being in any way blunt. He was brilliant in Union meetings, mind.

@TiredButDancing I love the South African accent it's one of my favourites!

I am pure scouse and I used to work with a couple of ladies from South Africa and they both used to struggle to understand me when we first met.

Yes I would say it.
don’t think it’s blunt just honest and straight to the point.
Australians I find to be like that too..my husband hah.

I think the problem is certain English (middle class?) people, not you. I'm Scottish and have been told I can come across as aggressive/rude. But I find many English people flounce around a subject. So many words, so much flowery language. Just get to the point!

And yes, I have a south African friend they are just normal as in to the point!

I have known and worked with many South Africans and would say I found them generally - not blunt but refreshingly forthright.

It was easier to have discussions without people taking things personally - a difference in opinion could be robustly discussed with less risk of offence.

I miss them!

Am British but not English.

I have had quite a lot of SA work colleagues over the years (old firm used to recruit heavily from there). I'd definitely say they were blunt but when in person and they could see your face you could always tell if they hadn't intended things to come across like that. By email I had to train myself not to feel aggrieved but did manage it ! Same as I did with my Austrian colleague (though her bluntness was such that some emails had to be reviewed and edited before they could leave the company domain!).

Yes very direct. Like others I've also had a few shocking moments whereby white SAs have openly come out with the most horrific vile racist comments, said directly and openly without a second thought. Not saying all white SA's think this way obviously, but I was very shocked.

I don't know enough South Africans, but I definitely find Dutch people to be extremely blunt, followed by Germans who aren't quite as bad.

My next door neighbour is South African, he's a rude, arrogant, self entitled fucker who thinks the sun shines out his arse and that everyone else is thick as shit. But I think that's more to do with his personality then being South African! (Can you tell we don't get on 😂). There are a few SA mums at the school and they are lovely!

Oh yes, I've had that too, but that's not bluntness, that's racism.

I wouldn't say blunt, but I'd say direct and open. But that might be because I spent half my life in SA so I'm used to it.

I have met a lot of (white) SA people though work, mostly lovely friendly people who I enjoyed working with.

I don’t think they are “blunt”, so much as English people, especially southerners (and I say that as one) are crap at getting to the point, and will often underplay things rather than say things as they are.

e.g. When I’ve just been whirled back into the office after a quick walk outside in gale-force weather, looking like I’ve been dragged through a hedge backwards. A colleague might ask me if it was windy out… my answer might be “yes, it’s a bit brisk”!

or the ubiquitous answer to everything “not too bad”!

Yes have worked with many SA colleagues and they are all very direct and to the point

I used to work for a South African man who moved to Britain when he was over 50 and he shrugged when a (black) colleague left her (white) husband due to years of domestic abuse and said her husband was obviously just trying to teach her her proper place in the world and she should at least be grateful that he married her and "elevated" her. His was an extreme attitude from a part of the world and a generation where racial tension and intolerance was high. I also have some South African friends and I would say that generally they're very polite but their delivery of their opinions can be incredibly blunt and clunky compared to a more delicate British tact. That's never offended me, it's a faster way to the point without needing to read between the lines. You're in no doubt as to what they mean or how they feel.

Actually, the rudest person I know, whose opinion gets forced onto you (even when you didn't ask for it) with the subtlety of a house brick to the face, is from London and he'd probably offend every person on this planet incredibly easily. And think he was absolutely justified in doing so.

White South Africans descend from Dutch hence the similarities.

My ex boss was South Africans and that's why he's my ex boss. He was a twat. I have South African family and they don't behave or act like twats. Twats are all races creeds and colours.

I agree actually OP. I have a SA client atm and she is just horribly blunt. Although another one thinking of it who is just lovely, so who knows really!

and perhaps oddly the difficult SA is a black SA and the nice one is white. So maybe folk are just folk after all!

It's always best not to make generalisations about entire groups of people. I'm a Saffer, have obviously known loads of Saffers in my time and they are blunt/not blunt/ somewhere inbetween.

I will say though, we tend to be small talkers so we ease into what we really want - in common with many non-Western nations. Whereas some UK, Western Europeans and Americans cut straight to the chase and won't show the slightest bit of interest in you. My ex-colleague (East African) and I used to moan about how rude we found it. So there you go, we find you blunt sometimes too!