New employee is a fake, where to go from here?

[londonnotlangdon]

It's a large organisation and I just had to send off her paperwork, passport, things like that

She was given the job after her second interview last week.

However, she has emailed me these documents (fine), and her birth certificate says born in September 2002?

That makes her 19?

This is a problem because, for example, her CV says she was an Executive Assistant to a Director in 2018? When she would've been in school?!

I've asked HR, who haven't replied properly, I've asked them to call. But someone replied to my email of concern with 'so you don't want this new me ever of staff? Why not?'

What can actually be done about this?

Check on the companies the references came from - do they exist on the Companies House register.

That’ll just prove the company existed not that she worked there. I imagine the reason she’s chose those companies is because they no longer exist so cant follow up on the references.

Possibly a dud suggestion, but HMRC know where everyone works and has worked. You probably won’t be able to get this info due to GDPR but she should be able to provide a P60 or P45 from everywhere she’s worked shouldn’t she?

I started Saturday work at 13 and my full time employment starts when I was 17. I had to leave education because I was homeless and I needed a job to survive. I'm in my early 30's. Luckily a large well known firm took me on, on good pay because I was professional and I worked really hard there.

My highest qualification is GCSE and I'm now a line manager.

But 13/14 starting full time is far too young I agree. Either something has happened to her meaning she had to enter employment really early or she's over exaggerated.

Honestly, I'd just confirm the documents are genuine and see how she goes in probation period. She's passed two interview stages so she must have something about her.

I think 2013

Sorry if this has already been said as I haven't RTFT but on her birth certificate are you sure you're looking at her dob and not the date which it's been signed? Could be one that's been issued after birth? Also did you get references from professional email addresses ie not Gmail outlook etc

I used to work for a major household name. Their HR checks were very basic.

One man landed a high earning job with a false CV and false references. He was in fact a con man and siphoned off considerable sums of money. I knew something didn't stack up, as did another colleague. We raised concerns. We were told we were jealous because he was being sent on more travel than us.

After I'd left the company he was found out and is now in prison. All you can do is clearly raise your concerns to your line manager and/or HR and suggest that they check original documents rather than copies.

It sounds like she’s lied about her past experience. Could she be using her younger sisters credentials? Could she have stolen someone’s identity?

I'm and auditor. It sounds dodgy as hell!

It doesn't add up. She might have used 2 companies that are non existent any longer because, simply, you won't be able to check if she worked there! And a reference email from her ex boss- colleague should be declined as it is not an official employment reference.

I would call her in again asking to bring in additional ID. When she comes in, go through the time line with her and HR, request additional ID, confirmation of GCSE, all originals, do what you can to check it all externally.

The reference she provided from the last employment sounds odd too. Can you try to find the person who signed it, I mean find them on linked in or company's website for example and try to find their email address? Does that person even exist? If you can't find them online, I would phone the company, try to get to the correct department to speak directly to the person to verify the reference as it came through from unusual email address. Someone in there also would be able to confirm whether they use @londonmail.lo emails. It is unlikely the company would have a few email domains, unlikely but not impossible.
I wouldn't rely on contact details she provides, I would want to find the person myself. If this is fabricated, when you ask her to get the person to speak to you directly, she might ask one of her friends to call you and you wouldn't even know.

If you still get a gut feeling that something is off, I would withdraw the offer based on her inability to provide satisfactory references/ pass pre-employment checks.

I would go digging.

It isn't impossible that she worked at 13, but not for large companies. What were the dates on her GCSE certificates, as that should highlight the issue further? Too much coincidence in companies going under, the reference email discrepancy and her not explaining how she worked there as a teenager. It's also odd that you say she looks 27/28; I would think from that it's a fake ID and a fake CV. It's up to your HR really; you can withdraw the offer due to the CV not matching up and just flag internally to never hire, but they also ought to report to Action Fraud to look into the passport issue as it seems likely it isn't hers.

You said she emailed her documents to you. Have you actually seen the originals? I'd be very suspicious - she's got two organisations that no longer exist as places of previous employment and she has the gift of the gab. Sounds like a fraudster to me. She's lying about something.

I'm invested now! I need to know whats happening, i lied once, said i was something special like promotions manager to blockbusters, i was actually just the head leaflet distributer for them

I work in information security and we’re taught to check emails and be wary all the time

her references don’t match the email domains the companies they’re supposed to be representing

it’s probably her behind the dodgy email.

your gut is telling you something is off

the evidence is showing you something isn’t right

tell HR everything you’ve found, get the original documents sent in

the fact that’s she’s also shown extra id when she didn’t need to could also be significant

con artists are extremely convincing

One of the companies I worked at had a finance assistant who had supplied her own reference. She was fired on the spot when it came to light.

You need to call her in and go through her cv line by line, matching up to her age and schooling. She could easily have faked her work experience if the companies are defunct. How much have you verified the person who gave her the reference?

People do lie and make these things up. I had someone who applied for a role who went on to tell me all sorts, when I had managed their manager and I'd had to pull her back from making a collossal error and she told me all about how well she had done. She hadn't done well at all.

I don't think it is, you have to be in education or training or work , don't you? And even if I am wrong about the work, you can work and do training.

Maybe she's inflated a few job titles, but it may all be above board in terms of the experience. I guess the only thing is to double check the dates and say you were surprised she was so young?

As an example, you might have a Saturday job in a library which actual job title was Saturday counter assistant. It would be easy enough to inflate that to Borrower adviser.

ohh why not ask for proof of a gcse? that would have the year on it meaning she wouldnt have worked before that

Yes, indeed. Googling the referee, they may be on linked in

Just to pikc up on the GCSEs.

ds is born in december 2002 and his GCSEs are grade 1-9, not A-E.
But I cannot remember if he was the first or second year to have this.
If he was the first, then she could have been born jan-Aug 2002 and have A-E grades.

It all sounds like a carefully constructed fake.

@steppemum no she was born in September 2002

Convenient that the two companies just happened to go under so there's no way to check.

I'd invite her back in and say there's a couple of things you need to clarify then I'd ask her about her job at 13. How did she get it. How many hours did she work. And the next one. She was however old. How did that affect her in the workplace? Really lots of questions.

As for HR I'd reply asking them for the company policy on candidates who secure a job offer under false pretences and that since you have alerted them to this possibility you want an assurance from them that you won't be held accountable.

That should kick them out of their don't care attitude.

You don't have to go digging, the information you have is enough to warrant an offer withdrawal. You don't need more ID, or another interview, or to find the referee and ask them outside of the email address supplied.

You absolutely have to follow this up. If it was me I'd just call her and say you're a bit confused about the dates on her documents as they suggest she was working while at school - is this correct?

My bet is that she has got experience but has some shady background, maybe been sacked for something quite serious so is using someone else's ID and has bodged an employment history to demonstrate the kind of work she's actually done before. I feel like it'd be very unlikely for a 19yo to look and behave so much older in a work environment, it just doesn't add up.

If she was educated inWales she would have received lettered GCSE grades and been able to leave at 16.

it doesn't explain the 2015 employment or the suspect references though.

This sounds dodgy to me but apprenticeships count as training and are offered by large companies, and so it is possible I suppose, that she was an apprentice who was appointed Vice President of photocopying or something.

Well HR are in at 9, someone answered at 8.30. I don't officially start until 9

I have someone calling me back for 9ish so I'll know more then

I just don't want someone who's a clear con artist in the company

But I have to say, her whole act has been very very convincing!

She reminds me a bit of Mark Acklom

Not read the full thread but just on the right to work check point: in fact until 30 September it’s permitted to only see scans of the documents, not the originals. It’s a COVID concession.

That wouldn’t stop you asking for the originals if you wanted them.. although I think it sounds like the CV has been faked rather than the ID documents.