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Original poster

New employee is a fake, where to go from here?

956 replies

londonnotlangdon · 28/04/2022 06:56

It's a large organisation and I just had to send off her paperwork, passport, things like that

She was given the job after her second interview last week.

However, she has emailed me these documents (fine), and her birth certificate says born in September 2002?

That makes her 19?

This is a problem because, for example, her CV says she was an Executive Assistant to a Director in 2018? When she would've been in school?!

I've asked HR, who haven't replied properly, I've asked them to call. But someone replied to my email of concern with 'so you don't want this new me ever of staff? Why not?'

What can actually be done about this?

OP posts:
Octomore · 28/04/2022 18:14

As I start by asking them to talk me through their cv and ask them questions there and then eg fob missing - what is it please.

Please tell me this is a joke. This would be as discriminatory as asking a youngish woman at interview if she has plans to get pregnant soon.

Iamnotamermaid · 28/04/2022 18:16

Can you call the school(s) she attended and ask them to confirm her attendance and dates?

HaveringWavering · 28/04/2022 18:25

Been in it for years, never had one sexual message. Just loads of recruitment consultants.

I’m surprised that so many people think that CVs have date of birth on them as standard these days. TBH putting that in really marks someone out as behind the times. cf heading it up ”Curriculum Vitae” in bold across the top!

Pegasaurus · 28/04/2022 18:26

Haven't rtft, just OPs updates so obviously problem solved. But I can't believe the number of posters tying themselves in knots to explain the discrepancy and even worse those who don't see a problem.
The woman is clearly a liar. I used to recruit and CVs were checked carefully and evidence qualifications requested - lots of people were then found to not have the qualifications they claimed - they were never appointed because we didn't want dishonest people working for us.
In the instance I would have rung the candidate and asked her to explain and if (when) she couldn't, the job offer would be withdrawn, easy. Nothing to do with ageism, everything to do with integrity.

Artsuggestions2022 · 28/04/2022 18:29

Octomore · 28/04/2022 18:14

As I start by asking them to talk me through their cv and ask them questions there and then eg fob missing - what is it please.

Please tell me this is a joke. This would be as discriminatory as asking a youngish woman at interview if she has plans to get pregnant soon.

Wtf.

no it’s not a joke we start and have at every place we have worked up with the form and letter of application. We would ask - can we just check your mobile number. And let them know how we will inform them of our decision.

are you seriously telling me that asking for someone’s dob is discrimination !!

we ask tell us about your role and career to date? Ask any questions check any dates that don’t make sense eg 2021 instead of 2011

The suggestion that you would ask anyone about their children is irrelevant (!)

iamsoreadyforbednow · 28/04/2022 18:31

Based on all your posts, I’d say she was pretty genuine for the job but withdraw due to your intimidation and probably your demeanour towards her.

I certainly wouldn’t want to work with someone like you.. I had a manager who questioned every single detail of my life as if I make everything up, or was severely judgmental of all of my decisions.. like why and how I brought my first home at 18.. and that I wasn’t ready for children because I was ‘only’ 20. She had a way of being extremely belittling and it makes for a shit workplace.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 28/04/2022 18:31

She's emailed in just before afternoon saying she would like to withdraw her application and acceptance of the role due to unforeseen circumstances

Sounds like a bullet didged, OP

pickuportripup · 28/04/2022 18:32

iamsoreadyforbednow · 28/04/2022 18:31

Based on all your posts, I’d say she was pretty genuine for the job but withdraw due to your intimidation and probably your demeanour towards her.

I certainly wouldn’t want to work with someone like you.. I had a manager who questioned every single detail of my life as if I make everything up, or was severely judgmental of all of my decisions.. like why and how I brought my first home at 18.. and that I wasn’t ready for children because I was ‘only’ 20. She had a way of being extremely belittling and it makes for a shit workplace.

So how do you explain someone having a high flying job at 13 then?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 28/04/2022 18:32

Dodged, even ...

MRex · 28/04/2022 18:38

iamsoreadyforbednow · 28/04/2022 18:31

Based on all your posts, I’d say she was pretty genuine for the job but withdraw due to your intimidation and probably your demeanour towards her.

I certainly wouldn’t want to work with someone like you.. I had a manager who questioned every single detail of my life as if I make everything up, or was severely judgmental of all of my decisions.. like why and how I brought my first home at 18.. and that I wasn’t ready for children because I was ‘only’ 20. She had a way of being extremely belittling and it makes for a shit workplace.

It's perfectly normal in the hiring process to check that details someone has given have checked out; there are legal requirements to check ID and in some roles to do DBS checks. Some engineering firms mandate drug and alcohol checks for all employees out of fairness and because many sites may have dangerius machinery moving. In this case, basic checks identified the woman as having been fraudulent, and it is legally fraud whether the lying was the CV, passport or both.

If your boss similarly was asking for basics like proof of your identity then it's worth knowing they were simply following the law.

TheHatinaCat · 28/04/2022 18:38

@Puzzledandpissedoff

Didged..... dodged....... It's all the same.

VaddaABeetch · 28/04/2022 18:46

There are people on Mumsnet saying their 13 year olds still believe in Santa. Others saying that you can have a senior role at 13?

40 years ago I worked PT in a supermarket at 13. At the time 16 was the minimum working age. I was a mature 13 but I certainly wouldn’t have been up for a senior role

DogInATent · 28/04/2022 18:47

are you seriously telling me that asking for someone’s dob is discrimination !!
It hasn't been normal/acceptable to ask someone's DOB or age within a recruitment scenario for over a decade.

Is a sizeable proportion of Mumsnet genuinely still living in the 1980s?

youvegottenminuteslynn · 28/04/2022 18:50

iamsoreadyforbednow · 28/04/2022 18:31

Based on all your posts, I’d say she was pretty genuine for the job but withdraw due to your intimidation and probably your demeanour towards her.

I certainly wouldn’t want to work with someone like you.. I had a manager who questioned every single detail of my life as if I make everything up, or was severely judgmental of all of my decisions.. like why and how I brought my first home at 18.. and that I wasn’t ready for children because I was ‘only’ 20. She had a way of being extremely belittling and it makes for a shit workplace.

You think the applicant genuinely had a full time admin position at a large company at the age of 13? Or 14? Or 15? Really?

Octomore · 28/04/2022 18:50

are you seriously telling me that asking for someone’s dob is discrimination !!

As part of an interview/selection process? It's no illegal in itself, but applicants would have a strong case to argue that the company is discriminating based on age. Would you ask them for their ethnicity and sexuality on their CV?

No reputable company asks for date of birth on a job application form/CV these days. And they sure as hell wouldn't sit there at interview and say "Oh, I see you've not provided your DoB, what it is please?" unless there was a very good reason why age was a necessary qualification (e.g. bartender job).

Identity checks are obviously standard, but only after the offer has been made. Not as part of the recruitment process.

Octomore · 28/04/2022 18:53

DogInATent · 28/04/2022 18:47

are you seriously telling me that asking for someone’s dob is discrimination !!
It hasn't been normal/acceptable to ask someone's DOB or age within a recruitment scenario for over a decade.

Is a sizeable proportion of Mumsnet genuinely still living in the 1980s?

Exactly!!

I sometimes think these posts must be made by people who haven't been in the workforce for a very long time.

Either that or there genuinely are dinosaurs out there who think it would be ok to ask someone's DoB in an interview...

youvegottenminuteslynn · 28/04/2022 18:53

@Artsuggestions2022

It's very frowned upon now to ask an applicant's DOB. I understand you may still do it but it's worth thinking about stopping as it's quite an outdated thing to do and unusual in most companies now, it has been for at least the last ten years IME.

Xenia · 28/04/2022 18:56

I thought by law you had to check right to work in the UK and see some ID such as passport and driving licence. Once you have the passport and the full name you can easily check back to the year of birth if born in the UK. I can do it in seconds for most people.If you don't go through these processes you can lose your job and get into loads of trouble later because you hired a fraudster or person who was lying. You certainly don't need to ask for DoB as you will see it often on the ID anyway and can look it up in many cases pretty easily.

However if someone is using entirely fake ID you may need to dig deeper.

Octomore · 28/04/2022 18:57

Xenia · 28/04/2022 18:56

I thought by law you had to check right to work in the UK and see some ID such as passport and driving licence. Once you have the passport and the full name you can easily check back to the year of birth if born in the UK. I can do it in seconds for most people.If you don't go through these processes you can lose your job and get into loads of trouble later because you hired a fraudster or person who was lying. You certainly don't need to ask for DoB as you will see it often on the ID anyway and can look it up in many cases pretty easily.

However if someone is using entirely fake ID you may need to dig deeper.

Yes, but this usually happens after the interview, and after a provisional offer has been made.

PenelopeLively · 28/04/2022 19:01

@iamsoreadyforbednow this is nothing like this situation.

Xenia · 28/04/2022 19:03

It may depend on the job in that case as for some roles you need to check people out properly before you make them offers particularly if a lot of people are liars or have fake ID. Best to weed that out before you waste time interviewing them.

Onwards22 · 28/04/2022 19:05

I’m so shocked that they’re more concerned about being accused of age discrimination rather than her lying about her experience and qualifications.
Surely it’s an instant dismissal.

I work with very vulnerable children, over 50% of which have been SA and it makes me shudder thinking how many people work in these areas and have completely lied on their CV.

It sounds like it was mentioned to her which is why she pulled out.
I was going to suggest phoning the companies directly and saying she’d given the number for a reference.

Prometheus · 28/04/2022 19:06

My guess is that she has the same name as her mum or aunt and the experience on the CV and references relate to them and she is ‘borrowing’ them for herself.

DogInATent · 28/04/2022 19:13

I’m so shocked that they’re more concerned about being accused of age discrimination rather than her lying about her experience and qualifications.
Surely it’s an instant dismissal.
I'm shocked you think you can dismiss someone you haven't employed.

Unless you're calling for the OP to be dismissed? - seems a bit harsh. Yes, she's been Mumsnetting on work time, and she's shared details of a work situation on a public notice board, and shown a lack of awareness of employment protocols. But surely some leniency for a first offence?

PenelopeLively · 28/04/2022 19:14

@Onwards22 exactly, in some jobs this is a safeguarding issue. Heck it’s even a safety issue for you team to take a fraudster on. I’m having counselling because of a woman that was taken on with no references and proceeded to abuse me and her history was known to others in the dept!!!