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Ukraine Invasion: Part 22

1000 replies

MagicFox · 23/04/2022 10:06

Here we are again

OP posts:
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34
TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 21:46

Not just the SAS, I'm sure Delta and other SF are working behind the scenes. I mean, Ukraine (David) is kicking Goliath. It's down to their training the past years with NATO and current support imo

Of course Russia has the mass and they will win some battles on that alone but if you're tactically shit and relying on bullshit to win, you will lose the war.

Ijsbear · 23/04/2022 21:47

@katem98 tbh I'm glad if I can help a bit.

Tiddy I've wondered about the Ghurkas too! when I was young they were spoken of with awe and I heard one story from someone who was stationed in an area they passed through like ghosts bringing death to the enemy. Are they still as respected today?

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 21:51

Yes they are Lj.

"I'd rather die, than to be a coward". The UK couldn't beat them so took them under their wing instead. They are fearless in combat but the nicest, gentlest people in life.

Ijsbear · 23/04/2022 21:52

Ukraine needs them then before the bloody Russians get ém

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 21:53

www.gwt.org.uk/about-the-gurkhas/gurkhas/

RedToothBrush · 23/04/2022 21:55

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 21:46

Not just the SAS, I'm sure Delta and other SF are working behind the scenes. I mean, Ukraine (David) is kicking Goliath. It's down to their training the past years with NATO and current support imo

Of course Russia has the mass and they will win some battles on that alone but if you're tactically shit and relying on bullshit to win, you will lose the war.

There is all sorts of whispers about who is there officially, unofficially or who was ex SF and signed up independently as a volunteer of some description. There are a LOT of people with specialist training and skills just wandering around Ukraine having got lost and taken a left instead of a right turn...

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 21:56

Red. I hear some of them were on holiday and sightseeing, visiting art galleries and museums.

Halo
EsmaCannonball · 23/04/2022 22:00

To put the SAS thing in perspective, in the last 24 hours Russia has also claimed that Polish Nazis are funding Ukrainian biolabs, that a false-flag massacre is being planned for Luhansk, and that a false-flag chemical attack will occur in Odesa. They are throwing a lot of stuff out there.

ScrollingLeaves · 23/04/2022 22:00

& Igotjelly · 23/04/2022 20:45
www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4536302-struggling-with-ukrainian-guest

Not a post about a thread but just saw this. It’s exactly what we were talking about on this thread a couple of weeks ago.

I have just been reading this. People should know that is not only visas that are being delayed. Once here, though the government said refugees would be entitled to universal credit, it turns out it takes 6-8 weeks to get it.

So hosts need to be aware they need to be rich enough to pay for everything a refugee needs upfront themselves.

RedToothBrush · 23/04/2022 22:01

Julia Davis AT JuliaDavisNews
Russia descends even deeper into medieval barbarism, as a pundit argues on state TV that the exits at Azovstal should be sealed off with concrete. Host prefers the idea of capturing Ukrainians and showing them at public markets, allowing anyone to do "whatever they want" to them.

RedToothBrush · 23/04/2022 22:02

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 21:56

Red. I hear some of them were on holiday and sightseeing, visiting art galleries and museums.

Halo

Not cathedrals?

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 22:02

Red 😂

Igotjelly · 23/04/2022 22:03

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 21:56

Red. I hear some of them were on holiday and sightseeing, visiting art galleries and museums.

Halo

Is there a cathedral that perhaps they were visiting? I hear Salisbury has a nice one

Igotjelly · 23/04/2022 22:03

RedToothBrush · 23/04/2022 22:02

Not cathedrals?

Cross post 😂

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 22:07

In all seriousness, Putin got away with blatant chemical warfare in the UK. Now he's doing this because we've let him.

On that basis alone, I'm glad we are leading the way as Ukraine's allies. I want to see him and his shitty army gone. For good.

RedToothBrush · 23/04/2022 22:16

ScrollingLeaves · 23/04/2022 22:00

& Igotjelly · 23/04/2022 20:45
www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4536302-struggling-with-ukrainian-guest

Not a post about a thread but just saw this. It’s exactly what we were talking about on this thread a couple of weeks ago.

I have just been reading this. People should know that is not only visas that are being delayed. Once here, though the government said refugees would be entitled to universal credit, it turns out it takes 6-8 weeks to get it.

So hosts need to be aware they need to be rich enough to pay for everything a refugee needs upfront themselves.

Our council is doing £200 upfront in cash. Available immediately after an email but you have to collect in person.

Then thats it. Many will have no money left by the time they get to the UK. Or if they do, its really not going to go far given the difference in the cost of living (there's going to be a few shocks there).

What I'm seeing is a really fragmented picture where hosts have to work out where to find things and how to find them.

There is a fairly large number of ukrainians who have been matched with a family in my relatively small community. Most are more middle class and often are from Western Ukraine rather than the worst hit areas from what I'm hearing. There is some organisation and coordination going on, but this isn't happening in most of the rest of the council, leaving many hosts and guests pretty isolated.

If you haven't had the conversation about how you can support those staying with you financially for a considerable time, you probably shouldn't be hosting at all as you've not thought it through properly. Its a huge responsibility and it was clear from the off that the government wanted to wash hands of responsibility.

Onceuponatimeinalandfaraway · 23/04/2022 22:17

DuncinToffee · 23/04/2022 21:00

A bit more on the Russian book censorship

Kevin Rothrock
The publisher that supplies most of Russia’s classroom textbooks is purging the next editions of its history & lit textbooks of virtually all mentions of Ukraine and Kyiv. This is the same publisher now supplying books to schools in occupied territories.
They even removed the author's name from the cover of one textbook because it's clearly a Ukrainian surname. The goal appears to be the erasure of Ukrainian identity from the consciousness of Russia's youth (and the youths of conquered lands).
zona.media/translate/2022/04/23/kyiv_erased

This is exactly what that lengthy article i shared and then a couple pages later scrollingleaves shared again on the last thread said. It was very chilling to read

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 22:28

Re: refugees. My friend in France who owns a chateau welcome a Ukrainian family in. They lasted 4 days.

They are suffering from illness, ptsd, extreme anxiety and just want to go home. Desperate to go home.

We need to help them get home.

loveyouradvice · 23/04/2022 22:29

How how how have Italy France and Germany sold arms to Russia last month? Is this really true? So shocking... almost unbelievable...

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 22:31

Up until April 14th I believe so yeah self serving arseholes

DuncinToffee · 23/04/2022 22:34

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ukraine-spent-seven-years-begging-three-pms-for-weapons-and-no-one-listened-58t5m9kkq?

Ukraine spent seven years begging three PMs for weapons — and no one listened
Cameron, May and Johnson all thought they could contain Putin. How wrong they were

EmeraldShamrock1 · 23/04/2022 22:37

I have just been reading this. People should know that is not only visas that are being delayed. Once here, though the government said refugees would be entitled to universal credit, it turns out it takes 6-8 weeks to get it.

Narrowing the gaps further for those whom really wanted to help by hosting.

Or a deterrent to stop Ukrainian refugees coming at all.

Ireland has stepped up, the people and government are being very supportive.

We dropped some essentials off at one of the hub hotels, it's horrific the people were very gracious.

DuncinToffee · 23/04/2022 22:42

Nolan Peterson AT nolanwpeterson

A couple days ago I met Naseem. He supported Ukrainian troops after Russian forces attacked his village east of Kyiv. Naseem also buried dead Russian soldiers in bomb craters & worked out a deal to trade the Russians 4 of their bodies for 2 living Ukrainian POWs.

RedToothBrush · 23/04/2022 23:01

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 22:28

Re: refugees. My friend in France who owns a chateau welcome a Ukrainian family in. They lasted 4 days.

They are suffering from illness, ptsd, extreme anxiety and just want to go home. Desperate to go home.

We need to help them get home.

Lots of Ukrainian refugees have gone home now already. Partly because the Russian left the north and around Kyiv but also because living in Poland or wherever is not fun.

I lived in hostels whilst travelling. I soon learnt to avoid rooms with more than 8 beds. I did a 30 bed mixed dorm for one night. It was dreadful. And actually quite scary (lone female traveller). I paid more and switched to a small room the next day. Living in hostels is stressful. Particularly at first when you don't know anyone. I found it got easier after you made a few friends but it also was very difficult at times. You have to be able to tolerate the dickhead that comes in at 2am and switches on the light for example. Then there's stuff like sharing with someone you know is talking about you but in another language with their friend. That can be uncomfortable... Refugee halls both within Ukraine abd outside Ukraine must be just awful to live in for any amount of time.

Strangely the experience taught me a lot. Not least that the guy who drove me nutty and I couldn't stand for the first couple of weeks was a really decent bloke who I completely misjudged at first. 7 months later we were good friends. None of the people I stayed with for months were ever people Id ever normally hang out with. You have to just really go with it. Somedays the lack of privacy and the feeling of being in a crowd but utterly utterly alone was overwhelming.

Crucially theres a massive difference between wanting to do it and being forced against your will to do it after having experienced trauma and everyone else around you being traumatised. And there being young kids in the mix. I just can't imagine it.

With regards to the UK situation, I think the other worrying thing for me is that the visas are three years. Then what? You can't apply for indefinite leave to remain as a refugee until after 5 years.

If you want to stay then you've got to change visa. Including any costs to do this.

How is someone who has come here, got a min wage job and struggling financially supposed to do that?

Equally how do they afford to return to Ukraine? And to go to what exactly when they return home? Even if the Ukrainian government win the war tomorrow they are going to have housing problems and problems with unexploded ordnance.

Again if you are hosting and are thinking about this and considering this in terms of what information and advice you give to your guest (and what support you are prepared to give) you are maybe going to run into issues.

I think a lot of the people I've seen volunteer to host are v middle class but also have had pretty sheltered lives. I don't see a lot of the thought going on that should be. Lots of virtue signally but not really consideration. Most haven't been to Eastern Europe and few have travelled independently and have little idea about culture differences beyond package holidays. The idealism is kinda frightening tbh.

I have no doubt for some it will be a really positive life changing experience. For others, a nightmare. One that I don't think you can vet for nor match properly on interests etc. Its either going to work or its not. You have to be exceptionally patient and laid back. Not sure many people really are.

TiddyTidTwo · 23/04/2022 23:06

twitter.com/euromaidanpr/status/1517987427859804165?s=21&t=AqtUPdNI70QwIjS9dvW2Fw

My daughter is a Keira too. Spelt different.

This is my 2000th red line and we still sit back.

Take the fucker out, take all the fuckers out.

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