The invasion is a Week Old...Part 7

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Unbelievable. Thread 6 is almost full, to be found here : www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4495271-The-Invasion-is-ongoing-Part-6?pg=1

Still a fascinating and thoughtful set of documentation of our evolving thoughts, fears, questions, analyses and updates. And still a credit to the eyes, ears and knowledge of those on here.

Pinched from one poster on thread 6 whose name I can't recall:

Latest claims from both sides about casualties
Ukraine's army regularly puts out updates on the damage it says it's inflicting on Russian forces, which continue to press on key cities, particularly in the south.

We should stress that the BBC can't verify this information, but the latest update from the General Staff of the Armed Forces says that approximately 9,000 Russian personnel have been killed or wounded.

It also says Ukrainian forces have destroyed:

217 tanks
90 artillery systems
31 helicopters
30 planes or other aircraft
For its part, Russia yesterday for the first time gave a specific number for casualties it had suffered in Ukraine, saying 498 Russian soldiers had died and nearly 1,600 had been wounded.

It said it had killed 2,870 Ukrainian soldiers and "nationalists".

I have to say that I am flabberghasted by the ineptitude of the Russians. I was in utero (birth - 6 months) at the time of the Cuba Missile Crisis and remember my mother saying she was in tears because her unborn baby (me) was going to die. Still here, rather grey, wrinkles.

All my life, during the time of the old Soviet warhorses, I was never that scared. Although the paranoia around their borders was truly awful for a number of countries, I didn't think they would go anywhere near a nuclear war. What I did think is that they had a massive, phenomenally well equipped and trained army with endless armaments.

It seems not, really. The curtain has been torn down exposing Putin of Oz but that does not provide any comfort as to future developments.

More at
www.france24.com/en/europe/20220303-live-ukraine-updates-more-than-30-killed-in-chernihiv-after-russia-strikes-residential-area

Think 'family annihilation', by a man, who is done with life and wants to punish / hurt / take everything with him rather than let it live without him.

Like Trump wanted to take down America if he couldn't have it....

...same thing.

If he was done with life what's with the neurosis about catching covid?

He has no plans on dying (not by his own hand anyway) he wants to be the man who rebuilds USSR and that's not going to happen quickly, especially based on what we have seen this past week.

I wouldn't put Trump and Putin in the same league (they are both types of arses but it's a broad spectrum). In fact in this particular instance wasn't it Trump that warned Germany that it would be very unwise to rely on Russia for their gas?

WTF??? This is worse than a disaster movie !!

@CPL593H

I feel like Putin is toying with us. I’ve just watching shots fired at the nuclear site but truthfully, if they wanted to set it off they could have. I think he is enjoying this power over keeping everyone in the world in a state of fear and bewilderment.

Don’t panic yet, nuclear power stations can be shut down. It takes a while to cool properly, but the people operating the plant will have been aware that this could happen and may have begun the process.

Of course, that might be the plan. They’ve shut down water supplies to a city so shutting down a huge power plant to cut electricity would be par for the course.

10 times bigger/worse than Chernobyl if it goes up

@RedToothBrush

Is this to test the Ukrainian response before sending in the more elite army?

There is no more elite army.

The VDV got mauled (see thread by @kamilkazani today - its late and i need sleep shortly so wont post). They are the paras. They parachuted in. Which in modern warfare is dumb as shit as you are sitting targets as you come down (they used them cos they thought it would be a cake walk).

Very few serving Russians have seen active service. The number Ive seen is roughly 2000 - 3000 in Syria.

The maintaince was the big issue - which suggests poor knowledge, technique and corruption.

Training is historically dire anyway - what they lack in skill theyve made up for in sheer numbers.

Competent commanders doing do well. Cos in an authoritarian regime they are a threat to their superiors.

If they are conscripting doctors suddenly thats a good sign that wasn't the original plan.

If they are conscripting. And rumour is all under 50s - as in ALL foreigners included - that doesn't suggest elite. Remember thats conscription for a special operation thats definitely not a war.

Who are these mythical elite. Which rock has Putin hidden under to go 'aha at the last min'

Hanlons Razor applies.

Here's the link RTB was referring to in the post above:

twitter.com/kamilkazani/status/1499377671855292423?s=21

[quote Bellalastrasse]@CPL593H

I feel like Putin is toying with us. I’ve just watching shots fired at the nuclear site but truthfully, if they wanted to set it off they could have. I think he is enjoying this power over keeping everyone in the world in a state of fear and bewilderment.[/quote]
He really is an absolute bastard and my main hope is one of his (ever changing, that has its own issues surely) bodyguards does him in.

Sorry for stating the bleedin' obvious.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=VNCKH430Xfg

Live cam, Victory Sq, Kviv

Warning - you can hear shooting

@FacebookPhotos

Of course, that might be the plan. They’ve shut down water supplies to a city so shutting down a huge power plant to cut electricity would be par for the course.

So does that site supply energy normally to city services? I agree with you that the Ukrainian scientists would have come up with a contingency plan plus international experts will all be monitoring these nuclear sites

@BreadInCaptivity.

Thank you for posting that link. I searched it couldn't find it.

It looks like firing is taking place in the car park rather than near the reactor (for now, anyway). Obviously it's too close for comfort, but I don't think they're firing directly at the critical elements, judging by a plan of the plant someone posted on Twitter - obviously I know not everything on Twitter is to be taken as gospel and I appreciate it's not going to be that precise, but ultimately, what do they stand to gain by causing a nuclear meltdown? Russia would be among the worst affected. Putin might be suicidal (I don't personally think he is) and willing to take us all down in a radioactive blaze, but he's not the one doing the firing. Presumably the soldiers attacking the plant aren't all super keen on the idea of being obliterated. After Chernobyl and Fukushima I'd also be surprised if there weren't passive safety measures in place. I appreciate that no one will have planned for a war happening directly around it, but surely a nuclear power plant must have to have extensive safety systems to mitigate risk in the event of something as relatively commonplace as a fire?

[quote Bellalastrasse]@CPL593H

I feel like Putin is toying with us. I’ve just watching shots fired at the nuclear site but truthfully, if they wanted to set it off they could have. I think he is enjoying this power over keeping everyone in the world in a state of fear and bewilderment.[/quote]
I'm thinking this too, he has played the nuclear card (again). It's like he is playing psychological mind games with us all (he saw it worked quite well earlier in the week) and he is determined to try and pull NATO into this.

[quote Bellalastrasse]The Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant in Ukraine, the largest of its kind in Europe.

Live stream

m.youtube.com/watch?v=fYUT36YGOh8[/quote]
I’m watching the live stream on yt, there’s a fire by the nuclear reactor, wtaf. The russians ( I think) turned the fire truck away.

sorry this is from the torygraph (Daily Telegraph) , no share tokens
link www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2022/03/03/ukraine-russia-latest-news-putin-war-nato-live-updates/

Russian forces have opened fire in the Ukrainian town of Energodar next to Europe's largest nuclear power plant after entering in tanks, a Ukrainian official has said.

Earlier on Thursday, Russian troops were trying to break through a barricade erected by local residents and defence forces outside the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant in southeastern Ukraine, Ukrainian interior ministry adviser Anton Herashchenko said.

Another adviser, Vadym Denysenko, said the situation was alarming with Russians entering Energodar town where the plant's workers live.

Russia has already captured the defunct Chernobyl plant, around 60 miles north of Ukraine's capital Kyiv.

On
12:55am
Fire breaks out at Europe’s largest nuclear power plant, says city mayor
A fire has broken out at Europe’s largest nuclear power plant in the city of Enerhodar in Ukraine after an attack by Russian troops, said the city’s mayor.

The fire erupted at the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant after continues enemy shelling, said Dmytro Orlov.

“As a result of continuous enemy shelling of buildings and units of the largest nuclear power plant in Europe, the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is on fire.”

In a clip posted online Mr Orlov urged Russia to immediately cease its fire on the plant. Earlier, Ukrainian authorities reported Russian troops were stepping up efforts to seize the plant and had entered the town with tanks.

Reuters could not immediately verify the information, including the potential seriousness of any fire.

Please ignore my link @ 1.06 I don’t think it is legit

[quote Bellalastrasse]@FacebookPhotos

Of course, that might be the plan. They’ve shut down water supplies to a city so shutting down a huge power plant to cut electricity would be par for the course.

So does that site supply energy normally to city services? I agree with you that the Ukrainian scientists would have come up with a contingency plan plus international experts will all be monitoring these nuclear sites[/quote]
Yes, this plant provides power to over 20% of Ukraine.

More
Higher levels of radiation have been detected near the site of the Zaporizhzhia nuclear plant after it was reportedly set on fire by Russian shelling, according to the AP.

"A government official tells The Associated Press elevated levels of radiation are being detected near the site of the Zaporizhzhia nuclear plant, which provides about 25% of the country’s power generation."

Sorry, just off to bed but caught the latest in DPs paper: Have been following threads with interest, many thanks to contributors

Here is where I saw the fire, you have to go back a bit in the video as they moved the camera view now

Does anyone have any insights into the layout of the Zaporizhzhia plant in relation to the fire/similar?

Analysis on Putin's motivation:

twitter.com/kamilkazani/status/1496711906412933121?s=21

Looks as though the fire is reducing, no?

@Lanascz

Does anyone have any insights into the layout of the Zaporizhzhia plant in relation to the fire/similar?

The first pic shows the view from the camera. The second shows the position on of the camera.

It seems it’s a building on fire rather than an actual reactor. So far.