AMA Fashion and anthropology. Everything happens for a reason…

[ArseInTheCoOpWindow]

I’ve been asked to start a thread in this.

I wrote a 50,000 word document in this and lectured in it for years. Fashion doesn’t just ‘happen’

It is essentially a social history particularly as regards women. This is mainly from the 1800’s. There is a reason for all those lovely Jane Austen type dresses.

So fire away, or l can drop little gems in here and there.

What is the reason for for the Jane Austen dresses?

What is the thought in current style?

I have to go out now but I will come back with questions, promise. Please do drop some gems in the meantime.

Jane Austen dresses mimic the Greek columns of Ancient Greece. Young wealth men were sent on grand tours and often went to Greece. Eventually this filtered back to the U.K.

They were also often see through. Women although considered submissive to men, were much freerer than in past generations and in future generation.

I came over from the ugly middle-class clothing thread to be supportive, @ArseInTheCoOpWindow.

You get to choose to wear (for a finite period) a particular style of female dress from any period before WWI -- which and why?

I think they were also affected by the ears with France and it was difficult to import heavy fabrics because if this.

Oh, and which historically-set film or TV series has got its costumes most accurate, for you? (Sparked off by watching a vlog someone linked on a thread about the Greta Gerwig-directed Little Women on the absence of bonnets and other clangers.)

I've heard that skirt hemlines go up in a recession, is that right? Is it due to lack of fabric or just trying to be jollier?!

Where does anthropology fit in? Because so far it’s been more fashion history rather than anthropology. For example, I read an article about coming of age day in Japan and all young people who turn 20 between 2 April last year and 1 April this year celebrate a coming of age by putting on their best and most elaborate kimonos. Even the young men are moving away from western fashion and starting to wear traditional kimonos to their coming of age.

Oooh I’d wear one of 2.

Comfort wise it would be ‘aesthetic’ dress which was worn by arty wives of people like the Pre Raphaelites. They didn’t wear corsets and wore these loose hand dyed dresses. This was the first reaction against the female corset, and against the frills and ribbons which were around due to the invention of the sewing machine about 10-20 years earlier.

In terms of loveliness. I’d probably go with Paul Poiret and his lantern skirt which was the first bubble skirt. It was very out there in 1910!

Is it true that bustles in Victorian dress arose from a desire to mimic women like the Hottentot Venus, or is that just a factoid?

Is it true hemlines rise in a boom and fall in a bust?

How did the clothes get so skimpy - to me there seems to have been such a huge change between the 19th and 20th centuries -almost an impossible journey from the volume of the late 19th century to the mini skirt of the 60s.

And could crinolines and corsets ever make a comeback (she says wistfully)? Along with curtseying and bowing and gigantic wigs? .

When will we see a return to people taking pride in their appearance and not dressing like slobs - sportswear adorned by the clearly unfit who have never exercised in their life and are wearing trainers and jogging bottoms to go shopping!

It’s about decoding. That’s where the anthropology fits it. It’s also social history. And it’s not just history of fashion. The anthropology bits are:

Jane Austen dresses were freer and looser because it was a freer society at that point in history.

Aesthetic dress was a reaction against standard Victorian dress. Throwing off corsets was a move towards equality.

Yes the hemline rises in a boom and falls in a recession, it’s not about fabric it’s about the fact that long dresses are more sober than short ones.

The Chinese thing sounds interesting. It sounds like they are slowly rejecting Western values having been exposed to them for years. It’s also a desire to connect with the osst and tradition. If people are seeking tradition they are seeking safety.

I don’t know about the bustle thing, but bustles were to emphasis their female shape. Women were still inferior to men and were held down literally by all their corsets and underwear.

Corset pop in and out of fashion, but only for fun. Wearing restrictions garments and huge wigs would not fit in with the informal freer society of today.

Yes, sportswear is here to stay unfortunately. Again a reflection of the loose and green society we live jn.

Clothes have changed so drastically as society had become so much less informal, and there is gender equality. The main reason is the rising freedom of women. All through the 20th century women gained more and more freedom which exploded in the 60’s with the invention of the pill. Short skirts equal sexual freedom.

What’s the average time span of a fashion cycle? Can an anthropologist say much about current fashions or do you need the benefit of hindsight?

Ooh, fascinating idea for a thread.

Can you recommend me a book to read on this? I adore fashion and find anthropology fascinating.

Fashion cycles last about 20 or 30 years. The 90’s look has been around for quite a while, which would fit with this.

Trends as such last about 7 years. Mega trends
(skinny jeans) can last up to 20 years or more.

You really need the benefit of hindsight to make the connections. I said in the other thread that the baggy oversized thing amongst teens was due to increasing equality and the trans movement. Long skirts have been around for quite a while too which is an economic thing.

Waistlines have been moving too. Again this is about freedom and equality. When the waistline sits on the waist it is much more sexually alluring than dropped or high waists

This website is good.

fashion-era.com/1970s.htm

Has the pandemic had an effect on fashion? I’ve heard various views on the trend for loose clothing - and you’ve just explained that it’s to do with increasing freedom and the trans movement - but is it also that a year of WFH and eating biscuits has given rise to a need for more forgiving clothes?

So do you think we’re still in the 90s fashion cycle? Because that would imply we’re about to enter a new cycle with a totally different look becoming prevalent.

Also, you’ve spoken about shapes and lengths - what about colours? Are there anthropological reasons why certain colours might be fashionable? Eg sludgy palettes, blacks and whites, geometric prints, ditsy prints all being predominant at different times?

Definitely. Booms of Leisurewear have been reported. But it’s not just the pandemic. You can now buy loungewear which wasn’t even a thing about 15 years ago. It’s all part of the increasing freedom and loseness in society. People going shopping in PJ’s was quite important. It broke the taboo of going out in nightwear. Again it’s part of the whole freedom thing.

There will be a backlash of some sort. Probably a return to more formal stuff.

When do you think I will start to wear something other than my sweaty Betty leggings and a comfy T-shirt? As in "the pandemic phase" 😂

I ant see myself ever going back to structured clothing and heels personally.

Dare I ask what you make of those butt lift ruched yoga pants things? I spent my teens and early twenties doing my best to avoid hungry bum syndrome. Now I’m seeing arse cracks everywhere. Assume this is linked with the rise of Instagram and Kim Kardashian (and OnlyFans?!)