Still can't quite believe the ambulance service said 'we can't help you' :-O

[mineofuselessinformation]

DC2 (young adult) woke me at 6.30 this morning in severe abdominal pain. I ran through the usual things: painkillers, constipation etc.
By 7.30 it had escalated (pain score 8), so I called 111. They advised that DC needed to have help: they would call back within the hour or send a non-urgent ambulance. Advised if pain worsened to call 999. Happy with that although not good to see DC so unwell.
30 mins later pain had increased - DC slapping themselves on the leg to try to distract from the pain and in clear distress, so called 999. Ran through symptoms with them, told them 111 had advised to call.
Their response after asking questions: 'we can't help you'.
Luckily 111 called back five minutes later so I told them what had happened. They sent an ambulance which attended. Advised to take DC straight to A&E as symptoms weren't giving a clear picture as to what was wrong, clearly needed to be seen, but not at death's door just yet. (I don't have an issue with this but did tell them I was concerned at driving quite a distance with someone so unwell in the car in my own.)
We duly attended and the upshot was that DC has what used to be called a 'grumbling appendix'. We were told symptoms may well recur and to attend A&E if they do. (By this point the pain had settled a lot due to codeine.)

I've never experienced this before - the 999 call handler had no way of knowing nothing serious was wrong with DC, yet still gave me a flat no - and I was told to ring by 111. (And DC could have had a ruptured appendix, given their pain and symptoms.)
I don't know why I'm posting except to get it off my chest, but I am wondering if the call handler needs to have a bit more training?

If your DC did have appendicitis, surely the best option would have been for you to take them to A&E as quickly as possible rather than wait around for an ambulance?

I wouldn’t have rung 999 in this scenario, and wouldn’t expect to be seen by a paramedic. I’d have just driven him to A&E myself

You've mentioned you have a car but didn't want to drive and therefore waited longer for an ambulance. I believe ambulances should be for the most in need and I think you need to review your choices. You could have taken an ambulance away from someone who didn't have the option of a car and they would have suffered waiting longer for one. I believe if you have a vehicle use it and save the ambulances for other people in need.

He had a pain. You had a car. You should have driven him and not rung for an ambulance.
People treat the ambulance service like taxis and expect one to be available because they think they warrant one. We do not have enough ambulances and if someone is able to be driven there and assessed as well enough to be driven there- by car or taxi- that is what should happen.
It costs a fortune to send out an ambulance and should be reserved for the seriously ill so they are available for them.

Lulu you said it well - I agree

I honestly don't think an ambulance is warranted in this situation. You have your own transport and should have used it. I don't mean to sound harsh and I hope your DC is OK

@mineofuselessinformation
The exact same thing happened to me - back i. September.
Different symptoms in my DCs case but with severe breathing difficulties (turns out she had pneumonia and 4 separate infections in her lungs). It was during the petrol crisis and I couldn’t get a taxi.
I was beside myself.
It had NOTHING to do with covid or staff sickness (and I’ve just got the response to my complaint),

It’s definitely not the fucking pandemic.

Why didn't you just take him to A&E. It doesn't really require an emergency ambulance and I'm surprised 111 said he needed an emergency ambulance. 999 is really for life threatening situations, and if you could have driven or got a taxi, that would have been far more sensible.

Were all fu#ked really aren't we

@Hercisback

Surely you'd have just driven to A&E yourself anyway?

Ambulances are for people who can't get themselves to hospital.

This!

Ambulances are for people who either need urgent treatment at the scene or cannot get themselves to hospital. It’s an ambulance not a taxi, surely if you were that worried you’d have taken him to a&e?

I find it pretty bloody shocking you'd want to divert resource away from an elderly person or someone in need of CPR etc etc when you’re perfectly capable of driving your son to hospital.

I wouldn't expect them to send an ambulance out for appendicitis, except in unusual situations. If you didn't have a car, then I'd have called a taxi or a friend.

I think the pain scores are pretty useless really. I've been sent to A&E by the GP with dd2 with pain score "at least 9" (trapped wind), whereas when ds had appendicitis his score varied between 2 and 4. Thing is dd2's scoreline starts at about 6, ds' nothing would get higher than a 5. (yes, I drove both times)

I've been given over a 2 hour wait with a semi-conscious stroke patient a few years ago simply because there were no ambulances available. We took them in the car as they clearly needed to be seen. Not something that I want to repeat.

There simply aren’t enough ambulances and too many people calling for them. The London Ambulance Service released Octobers stats and the number who called who didn’t need an ambulance was astounding. Until people realise what an emergency is, understand it’s not a taxi service and we get more crews and vehicles it’s at a standpoint.

This is about October’s ambulance response times. Things are much worse now.

inews.co.uk/nhs/nhs-ambulance-waiting-times-life-threatening-1295429

’Ambulances also took a record average of 53 minutes and 54 seconds last month to respond to Category 2 calls, such as burns, epilepsy and strokes – up from 45 minutes and 30 seconds in September.’

I’m sorry that your DC was in such pain and it must have been very frightening for you. If you live 30 minutes from A&E and can drive, you are the quickest way to get your DC there. The only way an ambulance would be a quicker option would be if they are bleeding out, seizing uncontrollably or having a heart attack.

I'm an A&E doctor/urgent care GP. There is a huge problem with the ambulance service being over-stretched at the moment. Even in normal times, though, I wouldn't expect a young man with possible appendicitis to need an ambulance. A rupture was very unlikely, given the short course of the symptoms.

It is not possible to dispatch an ambulance to every patient where there is a remote possibility of a serious problem - if we did this, people with life-threatening emergencies would have to wait longer and far more people would die unnecessarily.

I think the call handler's advice was correct.

It’s awful and not what we want from our health service but we all know how bad the situation is right now so we do need to accept that ambulances are simply not available.

FWIW, I took DS to A&E myself by car when he had suspected appendicitis.

I would always drive to hospital rather than calling an ambulance, unless it was.physically impossible to move e.g. broken leg. By the way, DH took me to A&E in the car with a ruptured appendix, so it is doable!

According to my first responder friend the ambulance service is on its knees.

@Blue4YOU, the thought of a taxi didn't even cross my mind. (The cost would have been huge, but something I would have done if I'd thought about it... Although we are quite rural and taxis aren't easy to get hold of here.)
I hope your DC is well now.

For others, did you not read that I was panicking and was scared something would happen on the way? If we had been closer to the hospital I would have felt more confident in driving with no help for DC. The roads I used had either nowhere to easily stop (rural) or a dual carriageway, where I would have had no clue how to describe exactly where we were. I don't think that makes me a terrible person, just a human in a horrible situation, responsible for someone who was clearly very unwell.

I don’t think they where wrong to say they couldn’t help you. Better than waiting hours for an ambulance you didn’t need.

I had to phone an ambulance for someone unconscious this morning. I was told they will be as quick as possible and on blues BUT they where busy so their may be a wait. Thankfully the ambulance arrived within 10 minutes. They where then an hour on the scene and another hour transporting. They both went an hour and a half over their night shift.

This is where I feel like I’m in a parallel world. If ds had potential appendicitis I would drive him to A &E. it’s about 45 minutes drive but surely that’s what most people would do?

Ambulances are not a taxi service. They are primarily for people whose symptoms are so acute that they need treatment or stabilising whilst travelling on route to the hospital and therefore where travelling in another vehicle without the paramedics wouldn’t be possible or would severely reduce chances of survival.

Less critically they will be used for people who are unable to travel by another means due to the nature of their injury (Eg: had a fall and can’t physically get up), sometimes these people will have a long wait because although they need to be seen at A&E they’re not at risk of death if they have to wait.

The lowest priority would be for people who need to go to A&E and could feasibly travel by another means of transport but don’t have access to one. They should be at the bottom of the list and if there’s another means of transport available shouldn’t use an ambulance and potentially take one away from someone critical.

Your DD’s pain was not immediately life threatening to the point she needed medical treatment en route, was not so severe she needed a stretcher/ couldn’t sit in a car and she had another means of transport available (your vehicle) and so it was right that she didn’t qualify for an ambulance.

As for not knowing where you are. Download the what three words app gives a way to track your precise location

I would have driven him even though it’s 30 minutes. I drove myself to A&E with appendicitis 😬 (really shouldn’t have, gp sent me and I thought I just had wind).

Do keep a close eye on him and take him straight in if the pain returns, you could always go in a taxi?

@MissLucyEyelesbarrow, I appreciate your response, but as a layperson I didn't know the likelihood of a rupture, but do know how dangerous it can be, so I wasn't able to make that judgement, and no-one guided me on it.

To be honest with the severe shortage of ambulances and staff in the call centres I would just have driven to the hospital. I think people need to realise that ambulances are not what they used to be and if people are not in a life or death situation they should make their own way to hospital when they can to try and free up the service for emergencies.