Star Hobson verdict in

[Lougle]

Savannah Brockhill Guilty of murder. Frankie Smith Guilty of causing or allowing death.

SS certainly need to be looking at how readily they dismiss the concerns of relatives and friends as "malicious". They are all too ready to use this as a knee jerk reason justify no action.

@ToughTittyWhompus

I’m not making excuses. I’m saying that the jury felt there wasn’t enough evidence against her for murder or manslaughter and there was plenty against SB.

Does FS deserve the full 10 years? Absolutely.

She deserves far more than a pathetic 10 years. She knew exactly what she was putting that baby through and she did it anyway.

I’ve just read this in The Guardian;

‘He [David Fawcett] described Brockhill as “pure evil” and accused her of having “brainwashed” Smith. “We were just a quiet, lovely family and she ascended from the bowels of hell and just completely devastated and wrecked our family,” he said.’

I can’t imagine how devastated he must be.

A question for those who have knowledge about learning difficulties. What would an IQ of 70 in an adult actually mean?
Would the person be functionally illiterate and innumerate?
Would they be able to understand the concept of money?
Would they be capable of holding down a job, however basic?

@PlanetNormal

There isn’t a stock answer for any of those questions. People have made intelligent posts about how learning difficulties affect people which have largely been ignored by the ‘string em up’ brigade.

If a woman with an IQ of 70 (which indicates severe learning and social difficulties) becomes a mother, then why the fuck aren't social services heavily involved in providing support for her and the child from the very beginning, and took it far more seriously when multiple reports of abuse were made regarding said child?

Where the FUCK were social services this entire time? It's their bloody job!

And also how readily they believe the parents. I'm horrified that they just appear to have believed SB's account on the last visit - despite evidence of serious injury they didn't get star checked over.
It's not as if an abusive parent is going to tell the truth is it ? "Oh yeah i threw her down the stairs and jumped on her head"

SWs need to stop believing so readily and start being more judgemental

Social services are clearly not fit for purpose and probably hid behind covid restrictions too.
Too many children are dying from abuse and neglect.

@PlanetNormal

A question for those who have knowledge about learning difficulties. What would an IQ of 70 in an adult actually mean? Would the person be functionally illiterate and innumerate? Would they be able to understand the concept of money? Would they be capable of holding down a job, however basic?

I think it would be different for everyone. DD1 (16) recently had tests and scored 70 in some areas. She won't be independent. Her current level of interest is Justin's House/Paw Patrol - very low.

That bruising on her face is fucking horrific 😩😭
The right sentences I believe, but after seeing that image I hope her mum gets a stiff sentence.

I imagine part of th reason Frankie was abusing Star in SB's absence was in an attempt to win her favour and because SB was training her to do so. FS was easily manipulated into following SBs wishes regardless of whether Sb was there or not. And because SB had alienated her from her family there was nobody to help her realise it was wrong.

I don't remember there being any suggestion of abuse before Sb came on the scene

Having said that, it's DD1's inability to recognise 'risky' situations and her impulsivity that will hamper her the most. She can't be relied upon to make a sensible decision, and even if she makes the sensible decision 4 times, it's the 5th time that is the problem.

Where the FUCK were social services this entire time? It's their bloody job!

Bradford children's services has been found to be failing across the board during a recent investigation, that includes SW and children's homes that were well below standard.

Yes I would string this pair up.

I have never been an advocate if the death penalty but for Tustin and Hughes and FS and SB I would make an exception . I really think prison is too good and not punishment enough. Another poster said SB is running the wing in her prison, so she’s not afraid of the system is she.

My grandson came to live with me when he was 9 months old because he wasn't in a safe environment BUT I can't tell you how I had to fight to get him to safety, social services visited several times and closed the case several times but I knew he was in danger

Thankfully my gs had me and I didn't give up but (and this is my point) it takes a LOT for a family member to raise concerns we MUST be listened to this can't keep happening

In all the most recent shocking tragedies family have called on ss for help but they weren't believed or taken seriously, do you think we want to report our own children for neglect or abuse???

Something needs to happen, today looking at my 2 year old who's fit and healthy I'm relieved (every day I'm relieved he's here) I'm angry, but I'm also heart broken I can't fight for them all but people tried

Ghoulette, that is exactly my question.

This and what happened to Arthur Labinjo-Hughes, makes me wonder how deluded many of us are about the capabilities of social services.

While it's not uncommon to see mn debating just how many pieces of fruit is reasonable for a child to have in one day, it appears social services are busy accepting blatantly bogus excuses for children being severely abused. No parent would have accepted that sort of bruising (seen in both cases) on their own child without raising merry hell. Most of us assume SS to be more stringent than your average parent but it seems instead of pushing people up to good standards of parenting they are lowering their own bar.

I despair at how these children were failed. Of all the 'lessons to be learnt' why can we not stop people killing their children when we are given warning after warning in advance. It is galling.

SWs need to stop believing so readily and start being more judgemental

They are judgemental though - about the wrong things. About messy houses and laundry that isn’t put away. They need to reassess priorities.

Another problem is that during the pandemic I should imagine that people working in the community wanted to avoid face to face visits.

I think FS will get a fairly low Culpability B or C sentence - B 8 years max; C 4 years max

SB I hope gets 25+

Another poster said SB is running the wing in her prison, so she’s not afraid of the system is she.

Prisoners on remand are treated differently until they are found guilty.

@Cait73 you sound like a wonderful Grandmother. Your grandson will really appreciate how you fought for him when he's older.

@Itsnotover

Social services seem to feel that if a house is clean and tidy and the child is well dressed, abuse cannot be happening.

It happened in Arthur’s case and it also happened in Star’s case.

I'm inclined to agree with this. I can't recall the case but I remember a very emotional SW saying something like (and I'm obviously paraphrasing enormously): "We see filthy, smelly kids; kids with decaying teeth; kids who bring one slice of bread and marg in lunchbox - we weren't preoccupied by (Child X) because he was at school on time, in clean uniform, fairly apparently well-nourished." That's the problem.

Once again the grandparents warn social services and they don't take it seriously so the child dies. It is tragic.

Seeing her pictures of Tustin's pretty cell and the fact she's being protected from other prisoners is an absolute joke. It shows how flawed 'justice' is in this country. No doubt these 2 scum bags will get the same treatment.

Prison shouldn't be homely, it should be stark and shite and make them wish they were dead every damn day.

@AndARiverBeneathYourFeet

“ SS don't care as long as the kid is clothed and has a roof over their head.”

This is a generalisation and not true in all cases. Their priority is to keep a child with its mother. I know of a mother with similar iQ problems who has has two children taken into adoption because she was not caring for them and had a violent partner.Luckily no violence to the children though. I also know of another case where a young mother was told very clearly to get rid of her partner or her children would be taken into care. Luckily she listened eventually and they did follow up calls as well.