Star Hobson verdict in

[Lougle]

Savannah Brockhill Guilty of murder. Frankie Smith Guilty of causing or allowing death.

Whiskeyinajar you can ingest drugs to induce cardiac symptoms, it has been known. Especially in people so highly manipulative.

@KittenKong

If they really turned a blind eye because they were lesbians / traveller origins then they should be in court. And who the hell gives potentially abusive family members the heads up when they are going to visit?

Do social workers really believe that gay people can do no wrong? Or is it that they are afraid of being accused of being homophobic? That's what a child died for?

Will any future children be taken away from her though? They messed up so thoroughly here who knows what they might do in the future.

Also going into care is not a great outcome for many children. She should not be allowed to have any more children

You don't need a high IQ to be a caring person. This is a horrific case and I hope SB rots.

@mydogisthebest

Will any future children be taken away from her though? They messed up so thoroughly here who knows what they might do in the future.

Also going into care is not a great outcome for many children. She should not be allowed to have any more children

It is if they are taken into care at birth, and that could well happen, and then either fostered with a family member or adopted.

And so it begins… apologies for the DM link….”FS was spellbound by SB” / low IQ etc etc ….

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10312559/Spellbound-monster-murdered-daughter.html

@prh47bridge yes it wouldn't have a huge effect on the sentences but there is scope to increase Frankie Smith's particularly so it is worth asking. The judge explained her reasoning very clearly I agree, but the AG can look at it again.

[quote Bagelsandbrie]And so it begins… apologies for the DM link….”FS was spellbound by SB” / low IQ etc etc ….

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10312559/Spellbound-monster-murdered-daughter.html[/quote]
I really wouldn't be looking to he DM for robust legal commentary.

@Lockheart I didn’t say I was (looking for robust legal commentary)….! I’m interested in what the mainstream media are saying in the context of the comments here.

I've been so deeply upset about this case. The sentences do deep far too lenient.

What can we do as the general public to try to address the grave systemic issues and errors evident in this case and and the case of Arthur? I could only really think of giving to children's charities or writing to local MPs to ask for reviewing of procedures such as informing people of visits in advance.

Does anyone have any idea how we can do anything to prevent these terrible cases of abuse and child murder. I feel so helpless and upset about it.

@SammyScrounge

I read today that Smith's grandfather killed himself in order to go to Star and look after her.

This is so sad.

So 25 years and 8 respectively.

Not enough

When tested the mother was found to have an IQ of 70, in the bottom 2% of the country. This would indicate she lacked the capacity to understand her actions.

I looked at her and thought this. You can tell by her vacant expression and the fact she let her new partner manipulate her that she's a bit simple. Does not absolve her whatsoever in my opinion, but I honestly just looked and knew. Brockhill was often the instigator I imagine.

@lemmein

She was also the one who shouted to startle Star when she was falling asleep with pure exhaustion - and filmed it, finding herself hilarious.

Don't understand the sympathy tbh - a low IQ doesn't excuse any of the torturous acts she did towards her baby.

This. A low IQ doesn't make you cruel, being a complete bitch makes you cruel. I despise both of them

I don’t think any punishment would be a deterrent- people still commit murder in countries with the death penalty.
However I do believe it’s about time that whole life tariffs are used for the conviction of murder of a child.
Would writing to the Home Secretary achieve this does anyone think?
I don’t want Emma Tustin or Savannah Brockhill to ever be free walk the streets again.
Life imprisonment should be the only sentence these two ‘ humans ‘ receive.

Is it easy to create a yougov petition?
I will write to the Home Secretary however.

Unfortunately this won't be the case. The unborn would be immediately on the child in need register, but then conferences would be had, things that would go in her favour. No longer in a relationship with SB. So if FS was to prove her ability to parent as a single person and the child remain on the child in need register it could remain in her care.

I don't make the rules, but I've sat in enough conference meetings as a third party agency to know how they all speak.

Don't worry I've left meetings pulling this face 😯 because I can't believe how some professionals have dismissed/underplayed things. 🤦🏻‍♀️

I'm a bit of a gobby cow though so I make damn sure in the minutes my opinion is noted and written down, and then my case notes reflect my concerns and who I have raised them too. So heaven forbid a case review was needed my "objections/opinion" was voiced over and over again.

@Gwrach

Unfortunately this won't be the case. The unborn would be immediately on the child in need register, but then conferences would be had, things that would go in her favour. No longer in a relationship with SB. So if FS was to prove her ability to parent as a single person and the child remain on the child in need register it could remain in her care.

I don't make the rules, but I've sat in enough conference meetings as a third party agency to know how they all speak.

Don't worry I've left meetings pulling this face 😯 because I can't believe how some professionals have dismissed/underplayed things. 🤦🏻‍♀️

I'm a bit of a gobby cow though so I make damn sure in the minutes my opinion is noted and written down, and then my case notes reflect my concerns and who I have raised them too. So heaven forbid a case review was needed my "objections/opinion" was voiced over and over again.

I highly doubt this. If she was to get pregnant again, I’d imagine you’d be looking at removal at birth, even if it was followed up with assessments. Certainly would be beyond child in need (there’s no “register”, that’s old terminology).

I'd also think removal at birth appropriate but it isn't always a given.

Problem is her defence has argued a.d muddied the water: before SB there were no concerns regarding her ability to parent, that she was a capable and good parent. So if she were to have another child, with SB no longer being part of the picture would that alter the scores?

I'd hope not, but o wouldn't say anything is a "definite" these days.

@Hearwego

I don’t think any punishment would be a deterrent- people still commit murder in countries with the death penalty. However I do believe it’s about time that whole life tariffs are used for the conviction of murder of a child. Would writing to the Home Secretary achieve this does anyone think? I don’t want Emma Tustin or Savannah Brockhill to ever be free walk the streets again. Life imprisonment should be the only sentence these two ‘ humans ‘ receive.

I agree. Didn’t the government say after Arthur’s story came out that child killers will be given whole life sentences?

In regards to the sentencing, although my feeling was to have some empathy with FS, I certainly think that the Judge is in a position to know better what happened. She must have felt that FS could have saved Star if only she didn’t put herself first. And also she must have felt that she had capacity to make that choice. SB is unlikely to ever get out I’d say.

I had been of the opinion that there was premeditation but the Judge thought not.

FS will still be young when she gets out. I hope that if she ever has another child, ideally that child is removed.

@twilightermummy

I’m absolutely disgusted. FS was abusive whilst alone with her child. Can the prosecution appeal her sentence?

Her parenting was horrible and she was not loving towards her child but sadly a lot of parents do mean things to their children which don’t incur prison sentences. When was the last time you heard of a parent going to prison for shouting at their toddler or making them face the wall?

I think I saw a transcript of a phone call when one of them said something about Star being on the home with ‘the other children’. Were there more children in this nightmare?

The other children were the murderer's nephews.

Yes I remember SB tried to blame another child.
Complete and utter low life’s

@mydogisthebest

Will any future children be taken away from her though? They messed up so thoroughly here who knows what they might do in the future.

Also going into care is not a great outcome for many children. She should not be allowed to have any more children

Completely agree. The 'Mother', the dim, feckless woman will still be 'Of reproductive age' when she is released. Doubtless she will get pregnant immediately. Sterilisation would be the best outcome , to prevent the cycle of abuse continuing again. Social workers-What are they playing at? Giving a mother the ''Heads up'' before a visit is an absurd thing to do.

''Lessons WON'T be learned''

Social workers will continue to be absurdly 'Politically correct' and pit the parent/partner needs first.
''We are afraid of offending you..never mind about the vulnerable child at your mercy''.

Social workers have to put the Child first, even if it means that a dire parent loses the child at birth, so he or she goes to be adopted by a stable, non violent loving family.