Kyle Rittenhouse not guilty?

[weegiemum]

How? He shot 2 people dead in front of witnesses, but apparently it was "self defence"?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/nov/19/kyle-rittenhouse-verdict-kenosha-shooting?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

In the footage of that night there are loads of people on both sides openly carrying guns. Saying that Grosskreutz was carrying a gun for self-protection while Rittenhouse was carrying one because he was looking to kill people is just partisan supposition. IIRC, some of Grosskreutz's previous criminal charges relate to being drunk while in possession of a firearm. Grosskreutz had been attending protests as a paramedic, but Rittenhouse, who was involved with EMT and fire-fighting cadet groups, was offering first-aid and attempting to put out fires that night. Everyone involved in this case was stupid to be there.

I think the verdict was right in that it was self defence.
But America has such a gun problem and this situation with a teenager (or anyone) tottering around with a gun in a town should never be normal or allowed to happen

I don’t understand how you can shoot at people and then someone hits you with a skateboard to get you to stop and you kill them out of ‘self defence’.
How can that possibly be self defence?
How was his life in danger by being hit with a skateboard?

Do you people even know who the Proud Boys are?

Do you? The chair of the PB's is of African Cuban heritage which would be odd for a white supremacist organisation. They are certainly an deeply unpleasant hard right organisation but despite the label others would like to put on them they reject white supremacy. I am aware Enrique Tarrio has just served time for burning a BLM flag but given his own skin colour and the Marxist ideology of the BLM movement it seems more plausible it was an act of aggression founded in ideological differences rather than racism.

The "MSM" have not denied that Grosskeutz was armed.

Irrefragable proof - it's even in the Guardian

The "manipulated' drone footage also needs to be looked into (I've sen claims they know who films that too) and I believe there is going to be a defamation case against Joe Biden for calling KR a white supremacist. I cannot quite believe the lies MSM has told about this case.
Watching prosecutor Kraus attempt to explain that away a couple of days ago was painful. Someone turned up in court and air dropped it to an officer who then air dropped it to me....
m.youtube.com/watch?v=X6AHpMC2a7E

Do you people even know who the Proud Boys are? They're neo-Nazis. If you're hanging out with them having a good time, flashing white power signs, you are a white supremacist.

I don't know if he is a white supremacist, and if he is that would be grim, but it doesn't mean he has no right to a fair trial. If he had sought out and shot black people it would be relevant, but they were white.

It really doesn't matter if Rittenhouse is a Trump supporter or a white supremacist. The laws around self-defence don't only apply to nice people.

@PurbeckStone

It really doesn't matter if Rittenhouse is a Trump supporter or a white supremacist. The laws around self-defence don't only apply to nice people.

Indeed.

The day he pleaded not guilty, he posed for photos at a bar making the "OK" hand gesture which has been co-opted as a white power symbol.

Just because it's been co-opted doesn't mean it's being used in a white power context.

Honestly, it is by no means normal to hear there is a protest and violence and grab an AR-15 and go check it out, not if you're an 18 year old man who has no earthly reason to be there

But there would have been lots of people there who didn't need to be there & plenty would have been armed. I think the whole idea is crazy.
I also think it's crazy to try & tackle someone you perceive to be an active shooter. Call the police, hide but try & take them down? crazy!

I know people think the US is like the OK Corral or something but honestly this is NOT normal.

I'm sorry I don't think the attitude to guns is normal in many states.

BelleHathor

He was using his own computer too, there are some interesting stills of evidence his laptop was loaded with video manipulation soft wear.

@J3oo good summary. It was a fraught mess of a situation that got badly out of hand but as stupid as allowing people in heated situations to blunder around openly armed is, the law allows it there.

@FOJN

Do you people even know who the Proud Boys are?

Do you? The chair of the PB's is of African Cuban heritage which would be odd for a white supremacist organisation. They are certainly an deeply unpleasant hard right organisation but despite the label others would like to put on them they reject white supremacy. I am aware Enrique Tarrio has just served time for burning a BLM flag but given his own skin colour and the Marxist ideology of the BLM movement it seems more plausible it was an act of aggression founded in ideological differences rather than racism.

Don't be naive

Tarrio has a very erratic history with the Proud Boys, a deeply factionalised movement.

If you look at the entire history of the movement and all of their activities and rhetoric, that is more important than one man. It's like saying the Brexiters weren't anti-EU because Farage's kids have German passports.

Amazing that even while (allegedly) drunk and armed , Grosskreautz managed not to kill anyone. He attended dozens of protests and didn’t shoot anyone. Rittenshouse managed one counter protest, shot three people and killed two of them.

@Weegiemum. Please watch Kyle Rittenhouse the truth 11 minutes on YouTube. I have absolutely no sympathy for the 2 he shot dead and the one he severely injured. It’s time America stands up against those who loot, trash and burn down our communities.
I am along with millions of others are so happy with the just verdict, the case was just as important to the American public as KR himself.

Didn't manage not to assault his own grandmother though.

Okay that has no bearing on the trial but neither does a hell of a lot of the stuff people are claiming about Rittenhouse.

Anyway I look forward to seeing what you all think when the men who lynched Ahmaud Arbery are also found not guilty. Because that is likely to happen as well.

I don’t understand how you can shoot at people and then someone hits you with a skateboard to get you to stop and you kill them out of ‘self defence’.
How can that possibly be self defence?
How was his life in danger by being hit with a skateboard?

You're on the floor, people are trying to stop you, how do you know they will pin you down until the police arrive but not hit you? how do you know they don't have a gun? that's the problem with carrying guns.

To be honest the bigger issue in my opinion isn't actually the verdict, but more the fact tonnes of Americans don't receive a fair trial. Its right and just that the verdict was based on the evidence given rather than twitter hype; but if it was a young black man who had shot 2 white men would they have been afforded the same? Maybe, hopefully, but there are a load of cases in recent US history that say the odds are not always that certain.

To be clear, not saying he shouldn't have had one, but that everyone should.

It might be crazy to chase after an active shooter, but remember the NRA has said things like 'the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun', and there have been people who have heroically stopped spree shooters in the past by tackling them to the ground. The reality is, if another protestor had managed to kill Kyle because they thought he was on a killing spree and was an active threat they would have succeeded on self defence as well.It's such a mess. Once everyone is armed, and the shooting starts, everyone becomes an active threat and it becomes automatically justifiable to shoot them.

@PurbeckStone

It really doesn't matter if Rittenhouse is a Trump supporter or a white supremacist. The laws around self-defence don't only apply to nice people.

Sure.

I've pointed it out because some posters expressed concern that there had been no evidence to suggest that Rittenhouse had white supremacist leanings.

And other (the same?) posters expressed concern that sometimes people didn't get full information from their chosen media.

Well, that's true. In this respect, those those posters didn't get full information.

@MaxNormal

Didn't manage not to assault his own grandmother though.

Okay that has no bearing on the trial but neither does a hell of a lot of the stuff people are claiming about Rittenhouse.

Well yes and while we are here has anyone mentioned the background of the first man KR shot? Who told Kyle and his group that he’d kill any of them he found any of them alone that evening, who was running round screaming the N word - actual footage of this I believe, and had multiple convictions for child rape?

You're on the floor, people are trying to stop you, how do you know they will pin you down until the police arrive but not hit you? how do you know they don't have a gun? that's the problem with carrying guns.

Yes people are trying to stop you from shooting people.
He had a massive gun he could have easily just pointed it at them and threatened to shoot them.