who decides whether French nouns are masculine or feminine?

[seethesuninwintertime]

I know people say it's random except for people and animals but it's not is it? Someone somewhere - may Louis the something - must have decided for once and for all that breasts masculine and beards are feminine and made everyone else agree? And that people who switched it over were wrong.
Or does it follow what they were in Latin? In which case who in Rome decided?

i think we should be told.

ew - screw oo- moon, oe- shoe sound the same

Well that depends on your accent. I pronounce screw and moon completely differently.

So that begs the question.... are phonics taught differently in different parts of the country?

Another example I (Welsh) pronounce poor and pour differently. DH (English) pronouncex them almost exactly the same way.

If you watch Emily in Paris you will understand

On the other hand, some Slavic languages can be argued to have added new genders to the classical three

How very modern!

In Devon, everything is he - a farmer would generally say "that heifer there, he's having trouble calving he is..."

In Lancashire everything is she, including a bull. Regional dialects can be weird!

@MrsFin

ew - screw oo- moon, oe- shoe sound the same

Well that depends on your accent. I pronounce screw and moon completely differently.

So that begs the question.... are phonics taught differently in different parts of the country?

Another example I (Welsh) pronounce poor and pour differently. DH (English) pronouncex them almost exactly the same way.

Phonics are definitely different between Glasgow and Shropshire - DD has acquired a Scottish accent when reading but not in general speech so far!

Totally off and on topic, but what gender should "brexit" be ?

www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/eu-hits-back-at-lord-frost-saying-we-cannot-undo-the-brexit-301920/

EU hits back at Lord Frost, saying: ‘We cannot undo the Brexit’

As soon as I saw the Brexit I suspected some translation is going on.

Obviously, as a complete and utter load of bollocks, it's "Le Brexit" and "il Brexit"

Yes it's Le Brexit. Can't explain why.

@AnotherEmma

Yes it's Le Brexit. Can't explain why.

Only a man could have dreamt up such a monumentally shit idea ?

I was taught that if you’re having to guess the gender in french, if it’s the big/fancy version of something it’s masc and the little/plain version is feminine. Its not 100% but if you’re guessing it’s helpful.

So le montagne (mountain, masc), but la colline (hill, fem).

Le fauteuil (armchair) vs la chaise.

And a lot of the silent letters at the end of french words are there because monks (who were doing most of the writing in the early days of standardisation/codification) were paid by the page.

@AnotherEmma

Yes it's Le Brexit. Can't explain why.

I’m almost certainly massively wrong with this but I think any noun adopted untranslated is deemed have masculine gender…so for example le weekend….

@womanity

I was taught that if you’re having to guess the gender in french, if it’s the big/fancy version of something it’s masc and the little/plain version is feminine. Its not 100% but if you’re guessing it’s helpful.

So le montagne (mountain, masc), but la colline (hill, fem).

Le fauteuil (armchair) vs la chaise.

And a lot of the silent letters at the end of french words are there because monks (who were doing most of the writing in the early days of standardisation/codification) were paid by the page.

Er no that rule is not very helpful for Latin-derived languages as has been explained by pp. Montaigne is feminine by the way. And a lot of the letters that are silent these days used to be pronounced hundreds of years ago. Something you can see in English, too (the K in know or knight for example).

I would venture that Brexit and weekend are seen as masculine in French because they end in a consonant. Pizza is la pizza for example.

@AnotherEmma

Yes it's Le Brexit. Can't explain why.

Maybe by accumulation

1. it's a foreign word and usually they are masculine (le weekend le gasoil le steak le popcorn le jet le boeing ).

2. doesn't end in "a" or "e".

Counter example "la box internet"
counter counter example "le box set".

Thank you everyone!
I did know these things but buried deep under a fog of sleep deprivation, that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it

I teach languages and I find the m/f thing helpful. I tell my students it is a spelling rule, to do with spelling not sex. Think of it as two sets of spelling rules, and it helps you to get everything right from there.
English is harder as there is no system to help us get it right, just endless exceptions.

Utérus is also a masculine noun! And la masculinité is feminine.....
It literally has nothing to do with what the thing is like, who it's used by etc it's much more to do with spellings.

Don't look for a logical explanation. French nouns' gender depends on what the word sounds like. After a while, you get a feel for it.

"it gives native English speakers a serious disadvantage leading other language"

If I managed to learn French, with a native language that doesn't even have he/she, so can you

I do wonder if French kids learn to read later (age six) because all the silent letters in verbs are such a headfuck.

@KeflavikAirport

I do wonder if French kids learn to read later (age six) because all the silent letters in verbs are such a headfuck.

I'd say learning to read and write, and possibly speak, in English is a lot harder than in French.

(I speak both languages)

Well, English kids typically learn to read at 4-5 and French ones at 6. I'm wondering why that is.

As in, you can start easy in English with cat sat on the mat type stuff but in French you have to start explaining silent letters from the off because they are in every verb.

Because in France, the children start school later.

It's a European thing - schooling starts later across Europe.

French is a very easy language to learn (and the other Romance languages) as they're so much more regular than English. I can't say silent letters ever bothered me much.

I don't know why the UK starts schooling so young, it doesn't seem to have much effect.

In France l'école maternelle starts at age three and I think attendance is now obligatory…..

I may be mistaken but I’m pretty sure our DC were being taught at reading before the age of 6, though it’s a while back now so I may be mistaken.

My kids are French at school in France. Started at three, learned letters at five, proper reading taught at six. Their UK peers are taught at least a year earlier.