Spelling the word ‘God’ with a gender star. R4 ‘Sunday’ programme.

[EdmontinaDancesWithOphelia]

On the ‘Sunday’ programme at 7.30am

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0011bws

There’s talk of putting a after the word ‘God’, indicating a gender-free entity - to counter binary, heteronormative rhetoric and understanding.

I hate these pointless proclamations. Do something meaningful and worthwhile about things you feel strongly about, whatever, it's your hobby. But targeting characters in books?

When it comes to gender equality, you'd think Catholics would start with more immediate concerns.

The whole thing is built on gender inequality.

Ooh edgy, you

There's nothing edgy about not believing in a christian male deity. Unless you think more people are edgy than aren't.

Ermm...

"Our Father who art in Heaven...." Is this wrong now? What is it?
"Our non-birthing parent who art in Heaven...."

@Esspee

Personally I would prefer the word "god" to always be written in inverted commas, withe a rolling your eyes emoji to follow.

🤣🤣🤣

I wish people would stop appropriating Christianity - if you don't believe what's in the bible, develop your own sodding religion instead of twisting ours!

Well in fairness, it is a catholic youth group suggesting this. So they’d presumably disagree they are twisting a religion that isn’t “theirs”

You can not believe but spewing your non-belief at those who do and calling their deity fiction is just trying to be edgy.

I don't believe either but I don't understand those who don't but want to shove their unbelief down other people's throats and disrespect them.

All the "Ooh I don't believe in your god/fairy/fictional daddy, etc. Amn't I the cleverest of them all? I come into these threads solely to feel smug and superior while I make fun of your belief" posts can just do one. We get it, you're cool and the most intelligent.

Dear high-ranking-person and non-birthing parent of personkind,
Forgive our foolish ways!

@Esspee

Personally I would prefer the word "god" to always be written in inverted commas, withe a rolling your eyes emoji to follow.

I wish people would stop appropriating Christianity - if you don't believe what's in the bible, develop your own sodding religion instead of twisting ours!

Maybe christian churches should stop trying to convert people to Christianity, if you don't want people 'appropriating' your religion.

But you should be aware that your Bible is a translation, and my understanding of the original text is that God wasn't classed male. I've also been told (by a christian and a Bible scholar) that the bible that people know has been changed over time to give men more power within the religion. So the word that you think it's the truth may not be quite as it should be.

You can not believe but spewing your non-belief at those who do and calling their deity fiction is just trying to be edgy

Lol. I have had Christianity spewed at me my entire life. Are they also being edgy? I make one light-hearted comment once, and I'm the bad guy 🤣

I don't believe either but I don't understand those who don't but want to shove their unbelief down other people's throats and disrespect them.

How about the many people that shove their belief down others throats? Are they also being disrespectful?

I don't agree with anyone shoving their belief or unbelief down anyone's throats.

For some reason, I see more of those who don't believe who do that but I suppose it's because I don't hang around religious spaces.

@SmellyLikeABlew

I don't agree with anyone shoving their belief or unbelief down anyone's throats.

For some reason, I see more of those who don't believe who do that but I suppose it's because I don't hang around religious spaces.

I don't hang around religious spaces either.

The most recent example for me is in a whatsapp group for an open university course I'm doing.

Every time someone says they are struggling they pipe up with bible verses. When they did well, they credited their god for their success. Like God would be helping them write an essay while refusing to help terminally ill children. If that's not a conceit I don't know what is.

I haven't said anything to them (as yet) because I'm not the arsehole you seem to think I am. But I am tempted to randomly post a quote from the Koran or something at some point.

@Esspee

Personally I would prefer the word "god" to always be written in inverted commas, withe a rolling your eyes emoji to follow.

Here’s a few rolling eyes for you - not for God, just you. 🙄🙄🙄🙄

FFS German is an entirely gendered language. Now using stars, which is everywhere btw is an attempt to slowly redress that. It's a slow process.

Secondly the English language bible is a bloody translation. People know that right? God has no gender. Scribes translated it and used he as it was the best (and obviously culturally appropriate) thing to do.

Jewish people and many Muslims when talking of God, use G*d because it is considered disrespectful to say, write God. Stars have been used forever.

Genesis 5 days this
When God created mankind, he made them in the likeness of God.(C) 2 He created them(D) male and female(E) and blessed them. And he named them “Mankind”[a] when they were created.

I am a fairly traditional Christian, often advised on MN of being a " fundie " !! but I would argue that God was gender neutral and is often described in very feminine terms such as gathering his little ones under his wings as a mother hen would etc.

And I am GC so no axe to grind here.

I also think there's a difference between Christians who try to talk to you about God but leave you alone and change the subject when you're not interested AND Christians who preach fire, brimstone and damnation at you, trying to pressure you to become a Christian.

Just as I see the difference between those who don't believe and talk about it when it arises AND those who go into religious spaces or threads just to make fun of religious people and their beliefs.

The latter groups are being disrespectful.

I don't see anyone being disrespectful here. I made one light-hearted comment (on a thread created by someone that is NOT religious) before making the serious points I wanted to make. So if you are aiming that at me, you are aiming in the wrong direction.

FFS German is an entirely gendered language. Now using stars, which is everywhere btw is an attempt to slowly redress that. It's a slow process.

I don’t understand how a star helps that much with a gendered language, because presumably it isn’t pronounced? So only changes written language? Surely something you could vocalise would be a more useful addition? Unless you do say “God star”.

I wish people would stop appropriating Christianity - if you don't believe what's in the bible, develop your own sodding religion instead of twisting ours!

As a Jew, I don’t know whether to laugh or cry at this.

It's a biblical convention (yup, shiny patriarchal one) to write God as He. But the Bible equally makes clear that God created humankind in his/their image.
I think there's a discussion to be had around the very male centric way a celestial being of unknown and indeterminate sex or gender is described in the Bible but I think a gold star trivialises an important issue.
Plus whilst religion may be a declining influence in Western culture framing God as He is hugely significant in historically supporting the male dominance.

@FluffyBooBoo I get it but they aren't doing you any harm, nor are they making terminally ill children sicker. What's it to you if they choose to believe G-d helped them? Will it change what's happening elsewhere if they didn't say that?

They aren't shoving their belief down your throat there unless they're insisting you give God credit for your own success.

Mind you, I would leave the group if I were you because I wouldn't want to keep seeing it.

G-d has no gender anyway. The English translation of the Bible isn’t definitive, it was translated and altered by men.

@FluffyBooBoo

I don't see anyone being disrespectful here. I made one light-hearted comment (on a thread created by someone that is NOT religious) before making the serious points I wanted to make. So if you are aiming that at me, you are aiming in the wrong direction.

No it wasn't aimed at you, I wasn't saying you were doing it. Just adding to my post in answer to yours. I was giving examples of what I'll consider disrespectful.

@SickAndTiredAgain

FFS German is an entirely gendered language. Now using stars, which is everywhere btw is an attempt to slowly redress that. It's a slow process.

I don’t understand how a star helps that much with a gendered language, because presumably it isn’t pronounced? So only changes written language? Surely something you could vocalise would be a more useful addition? Unless you do say “God star”.

In fact, since German already has a neutral gender, why not just use that. Das Gott rather than the masculine Der Gott.