DH doesn't recognise this as racism

[Lira91]

DH and I passed a stall on the way home selling England goodies for the final. DH decided to buy a few things to take in to work for him and his co workers since he'd be at the workplace during the match. He asked if he could get a deal since he was buying quite a few things for about 7 people (CF I know but it's the Asian in us ). The guy running the stall said "you wouldn't see me walking into your restaurant and asking for a discount on a lamb bhuna, would you?" DH agreed brushed it off but I said to the guy that he was being racist for assuming that because we're South Asian (should add that DH has an accent), it means he would work at a restaurant. DH thinks I'm over reacting but it always starts with small things like this and I just get fed up around football season when these kind of "you're not really one of us" comments roll around.

OP, yep, I'd say micro aggression at the very least and probably racism.

BTW, re the CFery, I know some very posh upper class white-as-the-driven-snow people who never pay full price if they can possibly avoid it. One of them even asks for discounts in Harrods. Call me cynical but I wonder if the guy your husband dealt with would have been quicker to do them a deal if they asked in their oxbridge accents.

I think we ALL incorporate such assumptions in our thinking, in our art, our music, our films... which ultimately makes us all racists.*

Kinda agree with this 👏

@malteasergeezer

The comment was racist and so was the OP's dig. The OP then back pedalled saying it was sarcasm.

Therefore the OP appears to be guilty of the thing she's attacked in someone else. Not very intelligent.

Sums it up in a nutshell.

Op’s comment that supports Asian stereotypes isn’t great but it wasn’t saidtothe stall holder, so it’s not like there was a “level” introduced to the conversation of what was acceptable or not.

Nobody said she said it to the stallholder or set the tone.

What he said was wrong. But I also don't like what OP said here. As someone who is mixed race, my fathers family are Indian I feel I am able to point that out.

The only exchange many people have with other races is when the other race is living the stereotype that the "many people" then go on to perpetuate. I bet the stall-holder had only ever spoken to Asian people when ordering food. Not everyone benefits from diverse communities, and it would be helpful to recognise and tolerate their resulting ignorance and assumptions, perhaps.
A plank thrown at a car, however, is .

Oh my I can’t believe some of these comments!

Of course it was racist! Can’t believe the comments on this thread blaming the OP saying they’d have been on her side but for her discount comment - yes let’s police the language of a POC!

Nothing wrong with asking for a discount- my dh often does (and often gets them).

It wasn't the discount.
It was the 'it's the Asian in us'.

That is saying 'Asian's like a discount'.

Compare that with 'Asian's often sell curry'.

They are similar in assumption, and that was people's argument about the irony.

@bumblingbovine49

I'm sorry but it is not possible to be racist if you are making a joke about the stereotypes in your own background. That is self deprecating humour which you can dislike of course but it isn't racist.

I'd call the comment referring to lamb bhuna racial stereotyping or a micro aggression at least and assuming the stall holder was not themselves Asian, it is definitely within the realms of a racist comment, depending on tone etc

Totally agree - the OP comment came over as a mix of self protection and being self deprecating- bit like British people making jokes about queuing.

I honestly think some comments on this thread are an example of how some white people will try everything within their power to try and minimise racism and they don't understand this is what annoys minorities just as much as the racism!

Its not like her husband went to the stall holder and went “I am an asian, I shall ask for a discount hahahaha”. And then he said something back.

I think everyone is focussing on the wrong bit (whatever OP thinks about her own culture is in her own head and now on an anonymous forum). And no it’s not rude haggling at a market stall ffs. The guy started talking about restaurants out of the blue, the only reason he would have done that is because OP and her husband are asian.

Jesus if someone started making jokes to an irish person that they were probably an aloholic or a carribean person that they probably spent a lot of time smoking weed it would clearly be racist.

The exchange went

Husband: Can i have a discount
Stallholder: lamb bhuna

🙄

@Roomonb

Its not like her husband went to the stall holder and went “I am an asian, I shall ask for a discount hahahaha”. And then he said something back.

I think everyone is focussing on the wrong bit (whatever OP thinks about her own culture is in her own head and now on an anonymous forum). And no it’s not rude haggling at a market stall ffs. The guy started talking about restaurants out of the blue, the only reason he would have done that is because OP and her husband are asian.

Jesus if someone started making jokes to an irish person that they were probably an aloholic or a carribean person that they probably spent a lot of time smoking weed it would clearly be racist.

The exchange went

Husband: Can i have a discount
Stallholder: lamb bhuna

🙄

Exactly this. Honestly, some people think unless you're shouting a universal racist word it's not racist and this is part of the PROBLEM and why racism sadly will always be alive

Funny how people keep talking about what annoys poc and not listening to poc voices while telling anyone who doesn't like the ops joke, is wrong....even when the person who doesnt like it IS poc.

That pisses poc off.

I AM a poc, my point is what is inside someones head is in her head. What is said is said.

There is no law against having stuff in your head and yes absolutely we all need to think about the jokes we make about our own cultures. I hear loads of jokes about my culture from people within that culture so I get the context and nuance of those jokes.

But that as an entirely separate issue to the question of whether that exchange was racist or not. Trying to equate whats in OP’s head with what someone actually said is ridiculous tbh. I’m sure I’ve had some judgy thoughts, it only matters to other people if I feel the need to share them.

@Roomonb

I AM a poc, my point is what is inside someones head is in her head. What is said is said.

There is no law against having stuff in your head and yes absolutely we all need to think about the jokes we make about our own cultures. I hear loads of jokes about my culture from people within that culture so I get the context and nuance of those jokes.

But that as an entirely separate issue to the question of whether that exchange was racist or not. Trying to equate whats in OP’s head with what someone actually said is ridiculous tbh. I’m sure I’ve had some judgy thoughts, it only matters to other people if I feel the need to share them.

Yes you may be a poc, but some people only want your point of view to heard and shout down others....who saying saying we should listen to PoC. But they mean only Poc who they agree with. That's not listening to poc and it's really not ok. From anyone.

Op didn't keep it in her head. She posted here. No one can control what she thinks. But she can not post it. If I had posted 'well you probably do own a restaurant or a corner shop.....but I am Indian so its ok for me to say that', I would have got loads of shit for it.

And shockingly, I can think the man was racist AND also dislike what the op said on her post....but also know she didn't say it TO him or set the tone and believe she is in no way responsible for what he said.

And while some jokes, may be self deprecating, I don't feel that one is. internalised racism is not self deprecating.

Its a harmful stereotype and think it's harmful joke, even when made from inside the race itself.

We can disagree and that's fine. But I get annoyed when people decided everyone who thinks a certain way must be white, not understand the issue, or the nuance and then speak over poc who have a different point of view.

I honestly think some comments on this thread are an example of how some white people will try everything within their power to try and minimise racism and they don't understand this is what annoys minorities just as much as the racism!

This ^^

Is what this thread absolutely stinks of and I am very surprised MNHQ have allowed it to continue?? Oh but wait they probably hold a similar viewpoint

Please shut it down MNHQ it is highly offensive and a trigger for many.

@Lira91 did you ask your DH why he didn’t think that was racist?
I’d like to hear his pov and how/why it differs from yours.

I have to say I’m at your DH saying he didn’t think it was racist but many (white?) posters insisting they know best and he has to be wrong.

@Ontheblink

Please shut it down MNHQ it is highly offensive and a trigger for many.

I don't want it shut down. And I'm a POc, this thread serves as an example of what poc have to deal with. All.the.time

@Ontheblink

Please shut it down MNHQ it is highly offensive and a trigger for many.

God forbid we have a discussion 🙄🤡

It’s racial stereotyping, however he is a stall holder likely to be working class and running his own business therefore unlikely he meant it in a derogatory way

how sophisticated and thought through do you expect banter with stall holder to be?

Christ on a crumpet. I hope you're being deeply ironic. Mind you, I can't tell. Us working class folks know nowt and are all knuckle-dragging halfwits spouting casual racism unable to partake in witty repartee with The Toffs.

Racism and nastiness are two very different things.

Racism still exists in the nicest people, with the most honourable of intentions.

I think we tend to associate racism with overtly provocative terms, or slurs, whilst lazy assumptions go under the radar.

It's not a class thing. Racism exists across all classes. Arguably it might manifest itself in different ways, but it's there.

@sammassammas

The irony Is strong with this one

this made me laugh hard lol

It was a racist comment by the stall holder, who by the way, isn't automatically 'stupid' because he's white working class!!

My dad is working class and is not racist.

But OP should also not make derogatory statements about people of her own race.

I’m not saying he’s stupid because he’s working class Tehmina23 , just that he’s unlikely to look down on restaurant workers like some people would.