Wayne Couzens has entered a guilty plea to Sarah Everard's murder

[RickiTarr]

Thank goodness for that.

At least it spares the family a full trial.

I hope the sentence is a whole life tariff.

Regarding the Eastern European Gang lie, the part about him using prostitutes and in debt was true? If so, there are so many red flags flying around him it's beyond comprehension.

It seems likely who chose to embroider the truth about his use of prostitutes to arrive at his bullshit story, doesn’t it? Given the apparently escalating perversion and criminality.

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g I agree about police numbers being short. I also remember who reduced them in London- Mr Boris Johnson when Mayor.

@RickiTarr I know HK did a follow up called Eve Was Shamed and also her book Misjustice covers similar. I think she puts in references and further reading towards the end of the books. Invisible Women by Caroline CriadoPerez covers it a little. I was going to look at whether the Centre for Women’s Justice had anything on their website to suggest like research, white papers or similar.

In that Times article it say the average number of women killed per week in England and Wales by a partner or former partner is 7, I just can't put it into words how horrific that is. If any other demographic was being murdered at the rate of 7 per week the noise about it would be deafening, it would likely destroy the Government that was in power.

I'm just so sick of young girls being leered at on their way to school, being assaulted and raped in school, women and girls being assaulted on public transport, in their places of work, being assaulted, raped and murdered just for being female and NOTHING being done about it, it's become so commonplace it is practically accepted. Disgusting, abhorrent, repulsive.

@RickiTarr

Regarding the Eastern European Gang lie, the part about him using prostitutes and in debt was true? If so, there are so many red flags flying around him it's beyond comprehension.

It seems likely who chose to embroider the truth about his use of prostitutes to arrive at his bullshit story, doesn’t it? Given the apparently escalating perversion and criminality.

People like this tend to use as much truth as they can in their lies. It makes it easier for them to provided details. (He provided specific details about the gang and the vehicle he transferred her into- suggesting he has been part of or very close to such an act in the past) Lie about what you know.

Sorry- He provided specific details about the gang and the vehicle he said he transferred her into

Regarding the WhatsApp messages, it was reported at the time, and it is mentioned in the Sky report. There are other misconduct investigations going on but it seems these 12 relate to the WhatsApp. It was a joke meme about a police officer killing someone. It was beyond the pale. The office who sent it is guilty of gross misconduct.

People like this tend to use as much truth as they can in their lies. It makes it easier for them to provided details. (He provided specific details about the gang and the vehicle he transferred her into- suggesting he has been part of or very close to such an act in the past) Lie about what you know.

Yes, I thought start with a truth then embroider it, but that is a truly devastating thought about the transfer to the van that he knew enough about or had been involved in such activities.

He has to be given a whole life sentence.

Something that occurred to me reading the report in The Times was that he was either immensely stupid or immensely arrogant or both. I suppose mental illness or drug use might also have the same effect. Maybe there were elements of all of those things. I'm thinking of the fact that he utterly failed to cover up his tracks. He hired the car in his own name with genuine contact details. He was caught on CCTV left, right and centre from moments before he abducted Sarah. He left DNA in the hire car. He transferred her body to his own car so there was presumably forensic evidence there too. He attempted to dispose of her body on land he owned with his wife. He was seen by witnesses in the woods near this land. He bought rubble bags and so forth, again caught on CCTV or using his own credit card, so there was a trail.

He really wasn't paying attention during basic training if he didn't realise how easily he was going to be traced. Makes me wonder if there are other more intelligent criminals out there covering their traces.

Here are the details. Vile.
metro.co.uk/2021/03/17/sarah-everard-officer-sent-meme-of-guide-to-abduction-and-murder-14257085/

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g as a pp mentions he has probably done this before and I wonder if he got over confident. Grim to think about.

I can’t remember where I read or heard it but apparently serial murderers get more sloppy with experience. First planned murder is usually planned very carefully with a lot of care taken to cover tracks/leave no DNA/witnesses etc. But as time goes on they get more confident and also more desperate for their thrill and become careless.

@RickiTarr

Just reported on the BBC news that 12 serving police officers have been served with notices of gross professional misconduct in relation to Wayne Couzens. Not clear whether it's to do with the Sarah Everard case or other matters prior to it.

Wow. This could blow up. What on Earth have they done?!

I think also to do with looking up details of the case on the computer system when they had no need to?

@MotionActivatedDog

I can’t remember where I read or heard it but apparently serial murderers get more sloppy with experience. First planned murder is usually planned very carefully with a lot of care taken to cover tracks/leave no DNA/witnesses etc. But as time goes on they get more confident and also more desperate for their thrill and become careless.

Yes. That seemed to happen with Peter Sutcliffe.

People like this tend to use as much truth as they can in their lies. It makes it easier for them to provided details.

I agree.
Especially admitting to something shameful or embarrassing like using prostitutes to make believe people they must be telling the truth to admit that.

@toocold54

People like this tend to use as much truth as they can in their lies. It makes it easier for them to provided details.

I agree.
Especially admitting to something shameful or embarrassing like using prostitutes to make believe people they must be telling the truth to admit that.

Exactly!

It reminds me of the cheating husbands who when confronted admit to just enough to satisfy their wife they have confessed but without giving away the worst elements of their cheating eg; “yes I had a lap dance, I’m sorry, I’m so ashamed. I’ll do whatever you want me to do” when the truth is he paid a prostitute before raping her.

I’m going to go against the grain here and say that a guilty plea is an act of complete cowardice.

The evidence is so stacked against him that he knew there was no way he was going to be found not guilty, and what else was a trial a going to reveal?

I fully expect that in a couple of weeks time he will be claiming diminished responsibility on the basis of mental health and will be asking to be transferred to a psychiatric secure unit.

As a police officer he knows the score. He knows that he will get a hard time of it in prison, possibly even that he won’t make it out alive.

It will be either that, or he will be found dead in his cell prior to sentencing. Either way I don’t believe for a second he’s just going to sit back and accept his punishment now.

Closing ranks is still what happens when the police/a police officer does something wrong. There is no culture of learning lessons or wanting to change as far as I can see. Look at how whistleblowers are treated

Same in the NHS. We need a fundamental review of our public services to ensure that any wrongdoing triggers a sensible investigation with a view to making sure things can't happen again. Not a witch-hunt - just ensuring that concerns are dealt with properly and not just brushed under the carpet or bullying the whistle-blower/finding a pretext to sack them.

RIP Sarah. It is a really terrible case, and the police's behaviour at the vigil was appalling too.

I'm just so sick of young girls being leered at on their way to school, being assaulted and raped in school, women and girls being assaulted on public transport, in their places of work, being assaulted, raped and murdered just for being female and NOTHING being done about it, it's become so commonplace it is practically accepted. Disgusting, abhorrent, repulsive

This, a million times.

Cowardice and calculated for all the reasons you state @AlternativePerspective.

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g

Something that occurred to me reading the report in The Times was that he was either immensely stupid or immensely arrogant or both. I suppose mental illness or drug use might also have the same effect. Maybe there were elements of all of those things. I'm thinking of the fact that he utterly failed to cover up his tracks. He hired the car in his own name with genuine contact details. He was caught on CCTV left, right and centre from moments before he abducted Sarah. He left DNA in the hire car. He transferred her body to his own car so there was presumably forensic evidence there too. He attempted to dispose of her body on land he owned with his wife. He was seen by witnesses in the woods near this land. He bought rubble bags and so forth, again caught on CCTV or using his own credit card, so there was a trail.

He really wasn't paying attention during basic training if he didn't realise how easily he was going to be traced. Makes me wonder if there are other more intelligent criminals out there covering their traces.

He started his Police career with the Civil Nuclear Police. They are known as “Gate Openers” by regulars. I’m guessing that maybe their training is not as in depth for law, forensics wise. I believe he transferred to the Met where transferee training would be a few days only. He could have possibly avoided doing any Investigation for most of his career. Might explain his stupidity but it’s just as likely to be pure arrogance and hatred for women.

[quote Rainbowshine]@RickiTarr I know HK did a follow up called Eve Was Shamed and also her book Misjustice covers similar. I think she puts in references and further reading towards the end of the books. Invisible Women by Caroline CriadoPerez covers it a little. I was going to look at whether the Centre for Women’s Justice had anything on their website to suggest like research, white papers or similar.[/quote]
Thanks. I’ll start there.

I think the lack of information suggests there's a lot more to come out about this creature.

Nobody goes from law-abiding policeman to flasher, to murderer in a week. There's almost guaranteed to be things he is responsible for that we don't know yet.

Thanks, @Finfintytint, I didn't know that. It did strike me he was a very late entrant to the police force. Worrying that somebody as inadequately trained/screened as that was routinely carrying a firearm.

They don’t take this shit seriously enough at all.

Nope, they really don’t. A few years ago I was in a relationship with an extremely abusive man. He controlled, bullied and was physically violent towards me over the course of our relationship. When I ended things he started stalking me. By stalking I mean he knew my route to work (I couldn’t go any other way) so he would follow me in his car, beep his horn at me and shout things which I ignored even though it was pretty much every day and ridiculously embarrassing. He would turn up at my house sometimes and just sit outside in his car to unnerve me. He’d also post letters through my door, find other people’s phones to contact me on since his number was blocked or use phone boxes. This all went on for about 6/7 months after the relationship ended. Police were not interested at all as no real crime had been committed in their eyes I.e he hadn’t assaulted me physically or sexually so they weren’t interested. They told me to keep a log, keep the letters and call logs etc but that was it. He then assaulted me on my way to work one morning, he jumped me and knocked me over to the floor then grabbed me bear hug style and pulled me along the road chatting to me about absolute bollocks. I couldn’t break free from him because he was 6ft 2 and built like a brick shithouse. He lead me to his car and I was terrified he was going to force me in but thankfully he let me go and I ran. I called the police when I got home and they sent someone out to take a statement.

They questioned him and he admitted to it but they wouldn’t press charges because they didn’t deem the assault serious enough. I thankfully never heard from him again but I’m still angry at the police’s inefficiency all these years later.

Whenever stories like this hit the news I’m sadly just completely unsurprised. It’s almost expected that most women will be assaulted, abused, harassed, groped, raped or sadly killed. Poor Sarah and her family too, just grateful they have been spared the pain of a trial. I hope he spends the rest of his life in there.