Wayne Couzens admits raping and kidnapping Sarah Everard *title edited by MNHQ at OP's request*

[MyGhastIsFlabbered]

Sorry, couldn't find the news topic. This has just made me so angry today. What is it with make entitlement? They think they can just do what they want with us women?

@Hallyup6

Absolutely agree with *@June2021*. Don't tar all men with the same brush. The majority are perfectly respectful individuals. Women are just as capable of committing sick crimes if they're that way inclined. It's nothing to do with him being a man and everything to do with his warped mentality.

Erm, I don’t think so

@Letsgetreadytocrumble

Surely he can't go for diminished responsibility for psychological reasons if he was (presumably) deemed mentally well enough to pass police training?

Mental health isn't automatically a stable condition.

@covetingthepreciousthings

Can someone with more legal knowledge tell me, if he pleads guilty to murder or Manslaughter in July at the next plead date - does that mean there won't be a trial at all and it will just be a sentence hearing next?

Yes, if he pleads guilty to murder. If it's manslaughter, it depends on whether the prosecution are prepared to accept that.

@RosieGuacamosie not all rapes are committed by men, the definition was changed so it’s classed as rape if you penetrate with an object or a penis so a woman can be guilty

[quote Littleelffriend]@RosieGuacamosie not all rapes are committed by men, the definition was changed so it’s classed as rape if you penetrate with an object or a penis so a woman can be guilty[/quote]
The definition was not changed. In English law a female can not commit rape, rape can only be committed with a penis, otherwise it is sexual assault.

[quote Littleelffriend]@RosieGuacamosie not all rapes are committed by men, the definition was changed so it’s classed as rape if you penetrate with an object or a penis so a woman can be guilty[/quote]
Rape is penetration with a penis. If an object is used it is assault by penetration

Of course not all men are like that. But most people who are like that are men.

[quote Littleelffriend]@RosieGuacamosie not all rapes are committed by men, the definition was changed so it’s classed as rape if you penetrate with an object or a penis so a woman can be guilty[/quote]
Not true
If a “woman” is charged with rape then they used their penis and were not born a woman

@covetingthepreciousthings

Can someone with more legal knowledge tell me, if he pleads guilty to murder or Manslaughter in July at the next plead date - does that mean there won't be a trial at all and it will just be a sentence hearing next?

If he pleads guilty to all offences, and doesn’t plead not guilty to any offences, there’s no need for a trial.

Pleading guilty early would also allow his sentences to be reduced because he would have spared the government and the victims the expense and distress of a trail. Homicide (both manslaughter and murder) still gets a life sentence however - life being a mix of in prison and probation supervision.

With comparisons to Colin Pitchfork - sentencing guidelines have changed a lot. Sentencing for violent and sexual offences is much harsher than it was thirty years ago. Pitchfork could have been given a whole life order for his offences if sentenced today.

Oh for gods sake just stop it. Women aren't going around raping people day in day out are they? Whatever the fucking dictionary says.

Apologies in Scotland

@covetingthepreciousthings

Can someone with more legal knowledge tell me, if he pleads guilty to murder or Manslaughter in July at the next plead date - does that mean there won't be a trial at all and it will just be a sentence hearing next?

Correct, if he pleads guilty to all charges, there will be no trial.

I know there were rumours at the time flying around that he’d used his police badge to get her in the car but I think they were just rumours.

Of course he did. What woman would willingly get into a stranger’s car at night otherwise?

Who says she got in willingly? He pleaded guilty to kidnap. Maybe I missed it but the details haven’t been released yet as to precisely what happened as it’s obviously still not settled.

Kidnap is detaining someone against their will. So she may have got in willingly if that is the case, the kidnap began when he refused to let her out.

True but I can’t imagine he dragged her in kicking and struggling. I know the spot, it’s a busy main road.

@Littleelffriend Would you care to link to the Scottish legislation?

Woman can indeed be prosecuted for rape. And have been, not even all that recently:-

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk/2001/mar/17/sarahhall

He'd never heard of 'the hole's the goal' or 'you don't look at the mantelpiece while stoking the fire' and was appalled by it. He'd also never heard of 'pigging'.

To be fair, I haven’t heard of those either. It must be a local thing in your area

@LobotomisedIceSkatingFan so what? Just stop and think about what you're saying here. You're being ridiculous

I dunno why but the article made my heart sink

i mean, we all had an idea that the offences which he pleaded guilty to were what transpired, but the confirmation still hurt. I am so sorry this happened to Sarah. The only good thing about this is that her loved ones will be spared the intimate details during the trial I suppose.

He seems to be edging towards a mental health mitigation, considering that he kept harming himself in custody

@WinnieTheW0rm

He also pleaded guilty to a second charge of rape between 2 and 10 March

Can anyone explain what might be behind this?

Sarah went missing on 3rd, so the dates don't make sense.

There were reports of him being arrested for indecent exposure (at a restaurant, possibly a drive through McDonald's) shortly before 3rd, and that incident was referred to IOPC. I don't remember any reports of him being arrested for another rape, and I don't see why the date would not be known. I'm not inviting speculation, just wondering if anyone recalls any reputable reporting that covers this offence.

I thought he wasn't arrested.

I thought he had been reported for exposing himself in Macdonald's in front of customers and staff. His car was parked right outside and they reported including car type and reg.

The police didn't do anything I think. An ex detective was on the news explaining patronisingly that flashing isn't something the police are interested in as it's low level.

I remember as I was so angry at the time I wanted at DH.

These men don't go from 0 to murder in one step. They escalate. That is very very well known. Has been for ages.

A man exposing himself in a place like mcds with multiple people in there, very possibly cameras, car right outside. Is a man who has red flags all over him. It's very brazen.

If only the police would care about the smaller stuff then a lot of repeat offenders and the smaller number of serial rapists and murderers would be off the streets before they got there.

But it's seen as trivial until oh no he's a monster who could have known.

I have a feeling that there were reports against him by female colleagues or something that came out after as well.

This was preventable. As are so many of the terrible crimes committed against women and girls by dangerous men.

It makes me so angry.

The current charge rate for reported rapes is 1.5%. Most rapes are not reported. And that's charged, not gone to court.

Why don't we matter? I know it sounds strong but the stats are awful and I'm sick and tired of 'lessons learned'. That cock smugly saying oh indecent exposure isn't something we bother with. I mean for fucks sake.

Sorry for rant.

"Hopefully he will kill himself and spare the family (hers and his) the pain of a trial"

@mrscoxaools so you know they'd prefer this? Maybe they'd rather he gets convicted.

This thread is disgusting really

@KaptainKaveman

Ian Huntley said he killed Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman 'accidentally' didn't he? still got convicted of their murder though, thankfully.

It may sound awful and brutal but he will definitely get what's coming to him once he's in prison. I don't look on that as a 'good' thing, but I'm not going to condemn it either.

He had a string of reports to police by girls and young women of sexual assault and rape behind him as well.

But. Not enough to do anything about apparently.

@FlorenceWintle I don’t want to speculate but the offence is:

He pleaded guilty to kidnapping Ms Everard "unlawfully and by force or fraud"

So it’s equally possible he used force or fraud. We don’t know anything else.