I just bought these but they piss me off.

[frogswimming]

They are to go over my dd nappy for under skirts. But the name really pisses me off. Why can't they be called 'under skirt shorts'? There's no need to be judging two year olds on their levels of modesty.

It doesn't seem worth worrying about, imo. If little boys wore skirts, I'd expect that their parents would probably want them to wear something underneath, too. "Modesty" maybe sounds a bit old-fashioned, but they are usually worn to protect the child's privacy. Would "privacy" be any better?

Agree with PP that wanting her to wear something over her nappy may be more of an "issue" than the word "modesty". When I was a girl, we wore shorts under our skirts, but we were well out of nappies by that age. (Judging by old photos, when we were of an age to still be wearing nappies, we'd often run around the house in nothing but the nappy, but that's besides the point.)

@TheCraicDealer

I like the idea that they're called something else to differentiate them from normal knickers. I'm not sure if "modesty" is the best word though- 'cartwheel-proof shorts' would have been better.

There's plenty of little girls who love tumbling or climbing stuff as well as wearing skirts or dresses, especially in the summer. If this product lets them do that without feeling uncomfortable I'm very happy NEXT are listening and catering to them.

Yes.

My daughters (aged 4-9) prefer to wear dresses and skirts. They'll put shorts on underneath when going to the park or wherever so they don't get slide burn in sensitive areas, or have to deal with uncomfortable wood chips.

They have plenty of leggings/trousers/shorts but choose dresses and skirts.

Skorts are my favourites, though. So sensible!

Most toddler dresses come with knickers in the same fabric don’t they?
If that bothered, put her in trousers or leggings.

Forgot to say that we were wearing shorts under skirts in the 80s.

I never did but I’m 50. Never crossed my mind. Bliss.

@Twinkie01

How many pieces of material do girls need between their vulvas and the outside world to feel comfortable these days?

You wouldn't feel comfortable flashing your knickers at all and sundry, so why would you expect girls to feel any different?

If boys shorts are not called modesty shorts then why are girls big pants. I agree with you OP. I think we should get away from the idea that girls and women should be more modest than boys and men. That way leads into the argument that someone decides what makes a female person modest or not and whether someone who doesn't conform to that particular norm deserves their opprobrium and even to be sexually assaulted or even physically attacked.

training bras always makes me smile, what are they training exactly ?

Maybe they should just bring back the sort of very generously cut navy school knickers we had in the Very Olden Days. I can guarantee that a glimpse of those wouldn’t get even the grubbiest old perve’s pulse racing.
IIRC some of them even had a pocket for your handkerchief.

Splicedbananas, I couldn't agree more.

@frogswimming

I know, but I don't like the inference. There must be a better name. I mean 'big knickers' would be better for older girls without the judgement.

Knickers are still underwear . There's nothing wrong with the word modest and like it or not girls should not be flashing their underwear all over the place . I agree it's a wide age gap to have 2 - 16 years .

@warmandtoasty2day

training bras always makes me smile, what are they training exactly ?

I thought maybe it was akin to saddle pads etc. on a horse to get them used to the feeling of pressure there before you actually need to put a saddle on. Getting used to the feeling of having fairly tight clothing across your chest- training to accept a bra which will be needed at a later date.

I'd be happy to be wrong on that, because it's always given me the ick.

I used big knickers of Dd's nappies and also found some called Nappy covers, just cottony pants, some even matched her sundresses.
I did used to put her in shorts when she started school, but she didn't have uniforms.

'Modesty' is such a mimsy, limiting sort of word. Here's one of its definitions which I think is why it sits wrong with the OP re girls knickers:

the qualityty^, in women, of dressingng^ or behavingng^ in a way that is intendeded^ to avoidid^ attractingng^ sexualal^ interestst^

Girls shouldn't be be considered the objects of sexual interest in the first place. They shouldn't need to don stout navy defences against either boys or perverted adults.

Sorry, I didn't realise the bit I c&pd would have weird markup in it.

stout navy defences

Sorry, I'm not making light of your post or the point (it's a good and serious one). But that phrase really made me laugh.

@SpeakingFranglais

I agree, big knickers or under shorts or whatever, but without any reference to modesty, the implication being that girls that don't wear these are immodest and therefore worthy of unwanted attention.

I just don’t read this into it, I see plenty of things available on the market, I don’t feel I need to buy them, wear them or that there is some subliminal message in them.

@ErrolTheDragon

'Modesty' is such a mimsy, limiting sort of word. Here's one of its definitions which I think is why it sits wrong with the OP re girls knickers:

the qualityty^, in women, of dressingng^ or behavingng^ in a way that is intendeded^ to avoidid^ attractingng^ sexualal^ interestst^

Girls shouldn't be be considered the objects of sexual interest in the first place. They shouldn't need to don stout navy defences against either boys or perverted adults.

This is all very well in la la land meanwhile in the real world......

I thought modesty knickers were the paper ones they gave me to wear when I had a sigmoidoscopy - with a handy slit at the back!

“ Labia hanging out while crossed legged on the school assembly hall floor was just everyday life- we weren't ashamed of it and the boys weren't even interested!”

Oh come on. You can’t normalise children showing their genitals to all and sundry while going about normal school activities. That’s just incredibly inappropriate, and I’d say exactly the same thing about a boy having their penis or testicles out. How uncomfortable for the staff apart from anything else. Pants showing is one thing, but the pants should be covering the appropriate area.

@Hoppythehippo

“ Labia hanging out while crossed legged on the school assembly hall floor was just everyday life- we weren't ashamed of it and the boys weren't even interested!”

Oh come on. You can’t normalise children showing their genitals to all and sundry while going about normal school activities. That’s just incredibly inappropriate, and I’d say exactly the same thing about a boy having their penis or testicles out. How uncomfortable for the staff apart from anything else. Pants showing is one thing, but the pants should be covering the appropriate area.

Quite. If my 4 year-old son sat in class in a way that showed his penis or testicles I’d teach him to cover them up. Expecting a girl to do the same is perfectly normal, even in relaxed, secular society.

@BehindMyEyes So why can't little girl's flash their pants? Why was it ok in the past but not now? Is there anything wrong with little boys seeing little girl's knickers? And is there really a perverted adult in the playground waiting for a flash of a 5 year old vulva? Isn't telling little girls that they need to protect their modesty signalling that they should expect to to perved over, and signalling to boys that girl's have to protect themselves from boys rather than just expecting boys to treat girls with respect no matter how they choose to dress- if a girl want to show her knickers that's up to her and she shouldn't expect boys to treat her differently from girls who are more modest.

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER

Maybe they should just bring back the sort of very generously cut navy school knickers we had in the Very Olden Days. I can guarantee that a glimpse of those wouldn’t get even the grubbiest old perve’s pulse racing. IIRC some of them even had a pocket for your handkerchief.

We had bottle green ones when I first started at school. I still remember when it changed and we started wearing non-school knickers during the week!

(And I'm not talking about gym knickers, we still had those at secondary school. I remember our French exchanges watching in absolute horror as we changed for PE. )

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER substantial school navy knickers with hanky pocket and elastic you replaced when it perished. That's brought back memories.

This is all very well in la la land meanwhile in the real world......

That's so fucking depressing; people are happy to live in a society that tacitly says young girls are considered the objects of sexual interest and that they need to take steps to deflect attention.