Poor, poor woman

[Mookie81]

Complete lack of support and nowhere to turn.
A terrible deed but I feel so sorry for her.
And where the fuck was her ex? Living in Spain while she was driven to despair.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9186243/Olga-Freemans-friends-reveal-agony-trapped-flat-son-loved-dearly.html

@Sunsun21

We can spend money on vanity projects like that bridge/park over the Thames, the environmental nightmare that is HS2, give public funds to an American businesswoman Boris once Bonked, buy boxes of useless cheap PPE but not pay for essential services for our most vulnerable which prevent this kind of tragedy or the long term mental health crisis everyone likes to talk about abs nothing more. We don’t need to pay another Cronie to be Minister for loneliness we need to fund essential services which provide care abs prevent dire isolation for so many families. There is a magic money tree built by our hard work for this very purpose and pillaged by this government . And we need to pay nurses age carers and mental health workers enough to feel valued by our society and not that they are the unappreciated frontline in this pandemic.

Why is there not a clapping emoji.

Absolutely this

I’ve emailed !

namitynamechange yes thank you for adding all those equally abhorrent travesties which go on without the majority of society even being made aware - all we are made aware of are headlines when things go terribly wrong and subsequent demonisation of a vulnerable individual, in this case the mother.

This is worsethananticipated , that is brilliant.

I emailed the MP , and have suggested local community so the same , let’s see how people respond
As someone said up a thread it’s a mark of a civilised society how we care for our most vulnerable
Acess’s got school , respite and care
For parents shouldn’t be this hard and harrowing
There is the budget
And what riles me is it’s bloody children here

Thisisworsethananticipated thank you for doing that. Children, particularly disabled children really are bearing the brunt of this pandemic the worst followed by disabled adults and women. I also think that in this pandemic many people have got a taste of what it is like for many disabled people and their families for whom so much of the life which everyone takes for granted is inaccessible. I hope that it might make us more compassionate and more willing to put our money where our mouth is to support these groups.

Of course I do nor forget all those who have lost their lives to Covid, lost loved ones and all the key workers but I mean in terms of isolation, mental health issues , domestic Violence in all its forms, general strain and neglect.

Sorry to go on but I would like to add that as a mother you come under constant scrutiny by those who do not fully understand your situation or the particular needs of your child. I heard Katie Price talking on woman’s hour ( and she spoke very well) she said that her decision to have Harvey , also an autistic boy with sight issues, attend a residential college where he was thriving on a more full time basis she received many hateful emails. Conversely when a woman has her disabled child at home and fails to cope resulting in tragedy everyone casts stones.

Well it is what you meant when you said......
Unless your experience is identical to Olga Freeman's, up to and including susceptibility to severe depression and psychosis, you are no better qualified than anyone else to say she should have reacted differently.

As you are well aware, @PlanDeRaccordement, that was directed to people who claim that they are able to judge purely on the basis of their own personal experience: I was pointing out that it is irrelevant unless they have the same experience.

No, she was not psychotic. If she had been, she would have been diagnosed with a psychotic disorder by now. She wasn’t.

You do keep giving an incredibly selective account of what is in the news reports, @PlanDeRaccordement. What they say is that "Three separate psychiatric reports concluded that Freeman was suffering from a severe depression and psychosis at the time of the killing.".

So, whether she is psychotic now or not, at the time of the killing, she had psychosis. That is what is relevant.

I think this deviate about psychosis is unhelpful. We should be discussing the circumstances which led to any development of this assumption of psychosis and left a young child so vulnerable to its affect.

I have nothing but sympathy for someone driven to such an act. That poor boy, what a terribly sad situation.

This debate about psychosis is helpful what needs discussing is the circumstances which led to a loving mother developing such a state of mental depletion which led to a young child being vulnerable in her care.

Hopefully a case will review will find that the devil, as they say, is in the detail, in all the times this mother and son were denied, deprived and ignored, differed, or as I commonly experience worn down with convoluted dehumanising systems such as DLA, PiP etc.

deferred not differed.

🧸 for Dylan.

I’m really interested in the opinions and thoughts of people who find themselves supporting very dependent children and those with experience of psychosis. I think it’s pertinent and relevant, and one of the real strengths of MN, where if you listen you can often learn.

It would be good if an enquiry could lead to improved mental health provision and better support of families with a child with SEN. Whether it will or not though..

And the tragedies pile up. When will they change this vile system?

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/jan/28/philippa-days-family-call-for-urgent-changes-to-benefits-system?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

As mentioned above, what’s with the father?!? He’s devastated. Of course he is, like everybody else.
Is he totally guilt free? Where was he? Absolutely appalling that she had to endure that alone and he would have known damn well about the situation but that’s ok because he’s good memories and a tattoo.
Absolutely disgraceful

O and the

@Sunsun21

This debate about psychosis is helpful what needs discussing is the circumstances which led to a loving mother developing such a state of mental depletion which led to a young child being vulnerable in her care.

I think it was the closing of the schools for those with special needs. The U.K. government were wrong to give schools the choice to stay open or close for children that are clearly vulnerable. The article’s all say that Dylan became unmanageable because the routine changed and he had no more piano and swimming. Yes can see no swimming because of Covid, but to take all his school time away and replace with nothing. That is what I think started a very quick decline in Olgas ability to cope even though she still had a carer come in for 12hrs/week for some respite.

@Arobase

No, she was not psychotic. If she had been, she would have been diagnosed with a psychotic disorder by now. She wasn’t.

You do keep giving an incredibly selective account of what is in the news reports, @PlanDeRaccordement. What they say is that "Three separate psychiatric reports concluded that Freeman was suffering from a severe depression and psychosis at the time of the killing.".

So, whether she is psychotic now or not, at the time of the killing, she had psychosis. That is what is relevant.

Not the ones I’ve read. They all say “severe depressive episode with psychotic symptoms” when they are actually quoting the defence solicitor and psychiatrist, Dr David Bird: According to Olga’s defence lawyer Jane Bickerstaff QC, she had been “suffering from a depressive illness with psychotic symptoms”. While prosecutor Gareth Patterson QC said the Crown has accepted the plea after mindful deliberation. “The defendant was recently transferred to hospital under the Mental Health Act. The prosecution received from the defence a psychological report from Dr David Bird. The partial defence of diminished responsibility is available to the defendant on the basis there was a severe depressive episode with psychotic symptoms at the time. That is acceptable to the prosecution after careful consideration and extensive further inquiries by the officers conducting this investigation,” Patterson said.“ meaww.com/ex-wife-of-celebrity-photographer-confessed-suffocating-her-son-after-suffering-mental-breakdown

Dailystar states three times
“Severe depressive episode with psychotic symptoms.”
www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/breaking-olga-freeman-trial-mum-23379085

The Evening Standard:
“The three psychiatrists all agree that the defendant’s responsibility at the time of the act of the killing was diminished and at a low level, for the reason she was suffering from a depressive illness with psychotic symptoms in the lead-up to the offence”, said Jane Bickerstaff QC, representing Freeman.”
www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/olga-freeman-guilty-killing-disabled-son-acton-b900984.html

The Daily Record
“Her lawyer Jane Bickerstaff QC told the court that psychiatrists all agreed her responsibility at the time of the killing was diminished because she was suffering a “depressive illness with psychotic symptoms”.
www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/mum-killed-disabled-son-10-23383327

The BBC:
“Three psychiatric reports said Freeman was suffering from a severe depressive illness with psychotic symptoms at the time of the killing.”
www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-55794997

The Daily Mail
“The prosecution received from the defence a psychological report from Dr David Bird.

'The partial defence of diminished responsibility is available to the defendant on the basis there was a severe depressive episode with psychotic symptoms at the time.”
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9183707/Mother-40-admits-killing-10-year-old-autistic-son-denies-murder.html

It doesn’t surprise me that some journalists think psychotic symptoms=psychosis that’s a common misunderstanding of the public. As can be seen clearly through this thread.

@Arobase
Can’t find any reputable new article that says “a severe depression and psychosis” like you claim...

Metro U.K.:
“Freeman’s lawyer, Jane Bickerstaff QC, told the court that psychiatrists all agreed her responsibility at the time of the killing was diminished because she was suffering a ‘depressive illness with psychotic symptoms’.”
Read more: metro.co.uk/2021/01/25/mum-admits-killing-son-10-who-was-suffocated-with-sponge-13959948/?ito=cbshare

NY Post
“Prosecutor Gareth Patterson told the court that the manslaughter plea was acceptable.

“The partial defense of diminished responsibility is available to the defendant on the basis there was a severe depressive episode with psychotic symptoms at the time,” he said.”
nypost.com/2021/01/25/celeb-photographers-ex-wife-admits-to-killing-disabled-son/

The Telegraph
“..severe depressive episode with psychotic symptoms at the time.”
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/25/mother-admits-killing-disabled-son-10-struggling-care-lockdown/

NY Daily News
“...diminished responsibility is available to the defendant on the basis there was a severe depressive episode with psychotic symptoms at the time.”
www.nydailynews.com/news/world/ny-ex-wife-celebrity-photographer-admits-killing-disabled-son-20210126-xc3vh2tkvrct7lrg652lg4tmei-story.html

Euro Weekly News
“Her lawyer, Jane Bickerstaff QC, told the court that psychiatrists all agreed her responsibility at the time of the killing was diminished because she was suffering a "depressive illness with psychotic symptoms".
www.euroweeklynews.com/2021/01/25/mum-admits-to-suffocating-autistic-son/

Sky News
“Freeman's lawyer, Jane Bickerstaff QC, told the court psychiatrists all agreed her responsibility at the time of the killing was diminished because she was suffering a "depressive illness with psychotic symptoms".
news.sky.com/story/mother-admits-killing-10-year-old-disabled-son-during-lockdown-12198494

Can’t find any reputable new article that says “a severe depression and psychosis” like you claim

It isn't a new article. It is in the very first article linked on this thread.

But, frankly, I agree that this nitpicking over the diagnosis is ridiculous, and looks very like an attempt to mislead about the severity of Olga Freeman's illness - rather like the totally unevidenced attempts upthread to suggest there might have been abuse. The simple fact is that the prosecution accepted that manslaughter was appropriate, not murder, and that their own lawyer's summary of the facts clearly demonstrated that they accepted how awful her circumstances were.

@PlanDeRaccordement

Oh and by the way Olga had 12hrs a week of support and respite.

“Ms Surpickaja had only been able to offer that assistance for around 12 hours per week”

So, it may not have been enough support, but it is not true to say she had no support at all.

This wasn't available every week. When someone is prevented from sleeping, having the occasional 12 hours' respite in small sections leaving 156 hours unsupported is really a drop in the ocean.