Why do americans fear anything that's slightly left wing, let alone socialist ?

[Schonerlebnis]

Admit it's a bit of a blanket statement but there seems to be this widespread fear of any kind of left wing policy. I'm on a non political facebook group (cooking related so as ordinary as you can get) which has many US members and was surprised by how many called obama care socialist
Even the Democrats are accused of being left leaning (correct me if I'm wrong but that's not even remotely accurate !) and I'm not sure that they even have unions anymore ? On a recent US election thread someone mentioned that people feared that changes to the benefits system to support the vulnerable would lead to a rise in taxes and so make them poorer..... Can any one explain why a country that claims to look after the persecuted and vulnerable has such odd views ?

Its top tier for those who can pay, I expect, ivykaty

User how was Ww1 a capitalist war? Fought between capitalist countries, sure, but how was it intrinsically a capitalist war?

@hopingforonlychild - one thing I would certainly agree with is that if you have decent insurance, US healthcare is vastly superior in quality. I like having the peace of mind of the NHS but it is pretty basic healthcare and a million miles away from the treatment I got in the US.

@ivykaty44 US healthcare is top notch. I had one dd in the US and one in the UK and the difference is vast. I think overall health outcomes are better than the UK but obviously there are issues in the US with unequal access to healthcare and general impact of poverty, etc.

[quote hopingforonlychild]@ivykaty44 at the same time, the NHS provides a basic standard of healthcare. Its a great thing to have, to have the security of knowing that whatever your current situation in life, you would be eligible for healthcare. at the same time, the nhs doesn't always serve everyone's needs perfectly. My DH is going for an elective operation tomorrow covered by private insurance with a private surgeon as the NHS is quite tricky to access during covid. The NHS is useful only up to a point and many people do use private medical care as a backup option.

From what I understand, medical care in the USA is quicker than the NHS and easily accessible if you have the insurance/money. So for rich people, it is preferable. Its just not great for 90% of the population.

But comparing the NHS with the top quality (and also expensive) medical care with minimal waiting times in the USA is not really comparable.[/quote]
92% of the US population has medical insurance, either public or private.

www.census.gov/library/publications/2020/demo/p60-271.html

@ivykaty44 healthcare for the wealthy. The US has the best medical research and hence if the wealthy want some niche treatments that arentyet available, they fly to the USA. I grew up in Singapore which has one of the best healthcare systems in the world but our government ministers would go to the US for niche medical treatment. It's just very expensive and not indicative of the whole system. Not really good for any non millionaires.

You can see it how quickly trump.recovered despite being an obese 70 year old. They gave him some drugs that wouldn't have been available to the average person. Meanwhile Boris used the NHS and took forever to recover. When we measure healthcare systems, we look at per capita spending and health outcomes and admittedly a healthcare system like the US which is reserved for the rich doesn't stack up well at all.

@MissConductUS the premiums are vastly more expensive than what DH and I pay in nino and his private health insurance combined. Its in the thousands for a family.

@MissConductUS I am better off in the UK with the NHS and topping up with private healthcare when I need to. Its more cost effective

[quote hopingforonlychild]@MissConductUS I am better off in the UK with the NHS and topping up with private healthcare when I need to. Its more cost effective[/quote]
Be that as it may, you said:

Its just not great for 90% of the population.

Which is simply not true.

You can see it how quickly trump.recovered despite being an obese 70 year old. They gave him some drugs that wouldn't have been available to the average person. Meanwhile Boris used the NHS and took forever to recover. When we measure healthcare systems, we look at per capita spending and health outcomes and admittedly a healthcare system like the US which is reserved for the rich doesn't stack up well at all

I struggle to compare Covid19 between people as it strikes differently. That’s if trump ever had Covid19 and as he lies about everything this was possibly another lie

Can you show the rankings that give US as having top notch medical care?

Out of the top 10 hospitals in the world, 4 are in america..granted the us is a large country but there are none from the UK featured. The usa has a dysfunctional medical system with limited access for low income people but that doesn't mean you don't get good doctors and hospitals. The NHS is focused on providing universal healthcare for the masses so if it means that you sit and wait for months for a diagnosis, so be it so that people who are far more sick than you would be saved. It's too bad if you died while waiting.. I mean it's more about the common good.
www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2019/04/01/best-hospitals

But I still prefer the nhs because even though it's basic and I may wait , it's not a guarantee I w would die while waiting. I may even make a.full recovery. However if you don't have insurance in the U S, that's a far worse situation to be in.

I have been on both sides of this healthcare divide and I would much rather be in the UK now than in the USA. It’s another level of peace of mind to know that you won’t be on the street should you inherit an unlucky set of genes. Then there is the comfort of knowing that this is true for all your family and friends too.

Like someone said upthread, the best of both worlds is to live in the UK and get a medical insurance to cover basic bills or pay for private care selectively. So let’s say you have a chronic condition and need life-long treatment, nothing like NHS in the world. Then something ramped you and your needed urgent intervention, pay private and get it sorted and go back to NHS for the rest. It’s the peace of mind that is of value.

92% have health insurance, that's a larger percentage than I expected. Would that cover everyday healthcare as well as established treatments for the big illnesses or is it really too much of a mixed bag to generalise?

@7Days

92% have health insurance, that's a larger percentage than I expected. Would that cover everyday healthcare as well as established treatments for the big illnesses or is it really too much of a mixed bag to generalise?

All health insurance in the US has to meet minimum standards set by the ACA (Affordable Care Act) and cover routine and major care.

Most plans have a copay and a deductible. I pay $20 for a doctor's visit (unless it's my annual physical exam, which is exempt) and have a $300 annual deductible, which means that the insurance becomes active after I've spent $300 in that calendar year.

That's actually quite all right, if that's representative.
We hear such terrible things about US health insurance, but then we hear terrible things about the NHS as well.

hopingforonlychild

and who are the advisory board and what do they do?

strange that France isn't in the top list yet according to the WHO rank at the top for health care

@7Days

That's actually quite all right, if that's representative. We hear such terrible things about US health insurance, but then we hear terrible things about the NHS as well.

I'd say it's pretty typical. I have private insurance, the copays and deductibles are much lower if you have public coverage (principally Medicare for the elderly and Medicaid for low income).

One reason there's resistance to single-payer health care in the US is because most people with private health insurance are quite happy with it.

www.cnn.com/2019/12/09/politics/gallup-private-health-insurance-satisfaction/index.html

I'm an RN and I'm surprised with I hear people on MN talk about how difficult it is to see a specialist or get diagnostic testing done with the NHS.

I think that both systems ration care but do it in different ways.

@ivykaty44 Newsweek, in collaboration with global market research and consumer data company Statista, formed an expert panel of medical professionals, doctors, and administrators from four continents to create the rankings.

That's why the rankings differ so.much from WHO..they are looking at hospitals and medical care on its own, not evaluating it based on how an average person can access it. It means nothing to have a top hospital locally if you can't afford it. But if you are a medical tourist, you would go to the best hospital with the best doctors..

hopingforonlychild - thanks

its recommendation hopingforonlychild www.statista.com/page/worlds-best-hospitals-2020

not quite impartial

"You can see it how quickly trump.recovered despite being an obese 70 year old. They gave him some drugs that wouldn't have been available to the average person. Meanwhile Boris used the NHS and took forever to recover. When we measure healthcare systems, we look at per capita spending and health outcomes and admittedly a healthcare system like the US which is reserved for the rich doesn't stack up well at all"

Chris Christie was in critical care for almost a week, similar to Boris. And he used to be A governor of NJ

I dont think it's fair to reduce Trumps good outcome down to him receiving care no one else would get.
It's a wildly unpredictable disease.

Socialism is fine until you run out of other peoples' money...Mrs T