AIBU for not letting my lodger go on the council tax bill?

[Georgeoftheinternet]

She’s under the assumption it will give her magical powers with regards to residency and it’s a better utility bill. I’ve already put her on the water and electric (2 by mistake) and she keeps on asking me to put her on the council tax.

She’s got an eu passport but from South America. Wants residency.

I’ve told her to get on the electoral roll as it’s good for credit checks/finding your last address etc.

I’ve given her a utility bill (was easy to add at 7pm on a Friday night and bill the next day).

She’s under the assumption that it’s going to help her open a bank account and the banks have already told her the water utility bill is fine.

I’ve lived overseas for many years and came back - so I’ve gone through this process.

She’s read that if you are in council tax arrears it can affect your permanent resident status - she’s read this as “if you don’t pay council tax” which she does, as part of her rent.

I’ve told her to get a driving licence as it’s good ID and address.

I just don’t want to feel pressurised into doing stuff because she disbelieves everything I say.

@Ellmau

Students can register either at their parental home or in student accommodation (actually they can register at both but can only actually vote at one). It used to be the head of household who was responsible for supplying the info to the council, but in recent years responsibility has passed to individuals.

She’s not a student “living away from home”. Also She’s studying part time.

Does it really matter whether it's you being oversensitive or her being a CF? (For my money it's the latter)

The bottom line is that it's not working, so since this is YOUR home surely the sensible thing would be to get her out and someone else in

@Sometimesonly

She needs to be a British or EU citizen to be on the electoral roll.

Rubbish. My dh is Australian and doesn't have a British or an EU passport or citizenship and he is in the electoral roll.

@Georgeoftheinternet

What boundaries do I have to specify?

When you secure a new lodger, you need to list the house rules very clearly, perhaps send them an email so there is no doubt.

You need to state explicitly that they are a lodger, not a tenant, and the areas of the house they have access to.

You need to tell the new lodger that the money they pay you for board is all inclusive, and that bills are your business, and you won't be adding them to any of them.

I say all of the above as your current lodger seems to be confused about these, given her status as a lodger.

You need to be very careful. Having her name on the CT and utility companies records of your private address, could be used as evidence that she is NOT a lodger, but a tenant , and living with you as your partner sharing all bills. (If she's named on the accounts you pay, all she has to say is that she pays her half in cash to you. You'd have a hard job disproving that.).

Lodgers have virtually no occupancy rights. Tenants occupancy rights are very highly protected in UK law so it can be very hard to get rid of an unwelcome tenant.

 Currently  her EU passport gives her the right to enter,  live  and work in UK. Those  EU rights all end on December 31st.   

As a foreigner seeking UK residency , it's possible that unknown to you, she is seeking a paper trail of "evidence" that you are her partner. Perhaps she is fraudulently applying for residency to "be with her British partner"; or using you as a character reference or financial guarantor.

     She appears to be deceitfully  playing you , to get hold of  paperwork  to use   fraudulently in an application for residence. . Be aware, if  you appear to be complicit in that kind of fraud   you would face charges and fines. 

I would not tolerate a dodgy  lodger who lied to me or   tried to financially disadvantage me ;  god knows what other dishonesty she's  up to in your home.   

    Get her name  off all  the property and  utility bills right away. 

Worse, unknown to you she may be representing you as her partner.sharing your accommodation and bills, and using that pretence in her residency application.

Sorry, I should have added that it's not as if the woman's a formal tenant with all the hassle attached of getting rid of her

I certainly wouldn't suggest chucking her out on the street, but a short yet suitable period of notice and you're done ... or rather you can be if you choose

@NightRiders Thats because as an Australian he is covered as he is considered a commonwealth citizen and clearly has leave to remain. To be on the electoral roll in the UK you need to be a British citizen, EU citizen or commonwealth citizen who has been granted leave to remain.

On the point about the single occupant discount on council tax, you can still qualify for it if the other person living there is a student.

That isn't the same as saying you don't need to put them on the electoral register. They might need to be on it or they might not, as they could be registered elsewhere, for instance.

You will usually get a form every year to fill in to update who is registered.

She’s got an eu passport but from South America. Wants residency.

I may have watched too many episodes of UK Border Force but are you sure the eu passport is genuine?

@starfishmummy

She’s got an eu passport but from South America. Wants residency.

I may have watched too many episodes of UK Border Force but are you sure the eu passport is genuine?

You’ve watched too many epoisodes

@2bazookas EU citizens don’t need any of the things you state to remain in the UK after brexit.

@Abitofalark

On the point about the single occupant discount on council tax, you can still qualify for it if the other person living there is a student.

That isn't the same as saying you don't need to put them on the electoral register. They might need to be on it or they might not, as they could be registered elsewhere, for instance.

You will usually get a form every year to fill in to update who is registered.

She’s not a full time student

Citizens of the European Union who are not Commonwealth citizens can vote in European and local elections in the UK, but are not able to vote in UK general elections.

Agree with Aros it's a terrible idea to put her on any of the utilities as you could become financially linked. As in if she has a poor credit score for any reason it could affect you eg when Ioved into my second house it has been repossessed. Until I told everyone they no longer lived there I couldn't get any credit, anywhere for at least 6 months despite having an excellent rating.

I think they then changed it so that to become financially linked you had to apply for a financial product or service (like utilities) jointly, which you have....

Do not put her on the council tax bill! I’ve worked in benefits in the past. Do not do it, she can say she was not your lodger and that she’s a partner.
If you tell the council tax Dept she’s a lodger, then they will not make her jointly liable for council tax in any case.

Did you make a thread not so long ago complaining about her knocking on your door and walking in and her comment about the sink?

@GrouchyKiwi I wasn't saying that she couldn't have 2 passports. I have 2 myself. What I am saying is that there have been several documented cases where some people from countries like Brazil have gone to Portugal and have gained EU passports illegally by saying they are from Portugal when in actual fact they are not and are not entitled to an EU passport through the normal legal process that most people go through. It is a well known loophole that immigration services are regularly finding and also happens with people from European countries that are not in the EU. The eagerness to be on the CT bill is a red flag and I was just highlighting this the OP

What boundaries do I have to specify? Because when she moved in she wasn’t on any bill so wasn’t the agreement. I’m kinda like 50\50 with being over the top worrying about the future and protecting myself.

Not so much specific things, just being TOUGHER! Basically she is your lodger - you do not owe her anything! And you HAVE to think that way because if you don't, you'll get taken advantage of. So - she asks to go on a bill - it makes you feel uncomfortable - the answer should be, IMMEDIATELY - 'No, I don't want to do that'. You don't 'feel pressurised'. You simply smile and say No because this is a business transaction not a friendship. If she pressurises, you smile again and say ' The answer is no, because it doesn't suit the way I wish to run my lodging arrangement. Please don't ask again or I'll have to conclude that this set up isn't for you and ask you to leave.'

You just need to be STRICT. Don't fuck with me. Nice, but 'don't fuck with me'.

You haven't done that with this one and she's set the tone, so it's too late now. Get rid. Then get someone else, and before they start hand them a list of the rules. Then as soon as they push over something, you say the above. Smile, refuse and make it crystal clear that if they don't like the rules, you'll ask them to leave.

@Farle29 Fair enough.

Her comment on the sink is EXACTLY what I mean about setting the tone. It's YOUR HOUSE and she is lodging. How fucking dare she make it obvious that she 'disapproves' of something YOU do in YOUR house?

Basically she feels in charge. You've let her boss you around enough to sete the tone as she can be rude, she can demand, and you'll not be happy but you'll give in.

Another landlord would have laughed in her face the first time she tried any pressurising and simply said, if you don't like it, perhaps you'd prefer I just handed you your notice? You're a lodger, it's my home, I do what I want here and if it doesn't suit you you are free to leave.

@YoniAndGuy

Her comment on the sink is EXACTLY what I mean about setting the tone. It's YOUR HOUSE and she is lodging. How fucking dare she make it obvious that she 'disapproves' of something YOU do in YOUR house?

Basically she feels in charge. You've let her boss you around enough to sete the tone as she can be rude, she can demand, and you'll not be happy but you'll give in.

Another landlord would have laughed in her face the first time she tried any pressurising and simply said, if you don't like it, perhaps you'd prefer I just handed you your notice? You're a lodger, it's my home, I do what I want here and if it doesn't suit you you are free to leave.

My house but she’s also paying rent to live there. I did make a AIBU at the time and the general consensus was I was being unreasonable.

walked in my room when I didn’t answer the door and was resting. It was late morning and I was in bed. She knocked and I didn’t answer because cbf and she often knocks on my door for no good reason (I work from home). She then opened the door apparently looking for the WiFi password

So basically she'll enter if she thinks you're not in the room, since you didn't answer and she entered anyway. You realise that this makes her a very untrustworthy snoop. Get rid.

Hmmmm I just thought, what’s to stop her from saying she’s my partner and getting half of my house?

@rorosemary

walked in my room when I didn’t answer the door and was resting. It was late morning and I was in bed. She knocked and I didn’t answer because cbf and she often knocks on my door for no good reason (I work from home). She then opened the door apparently looking for the WiFi password

So basically she'll enter if she thinks you're not in the room, since you didn't answer and she entered anyway. You realise that this makes her a very untrustworthy snoop. Get rid.

See the issue is a few weeks before she was isolating with her mates WITH positive corona tests and I put a shelf up in her room. I didn’t ask permission but obviously as a lodger I don’t have to. I have two issues

1. I did say I had some shelves and told her. I didn’t say when the shelves would go up.

2. when I told her about the shelves she said she didn’t need two, one was enough. Again it’s my house so people are correct.

3. however she may have assumed I was perhaps asking but because the shelves were already purchased then there was no excuse really.

4. our old landlord used to tell us to keep
   Stuff of the work surfaces. It was a HMO. None is us cared and tried to argue our point. So I have to “practice what I preach”

Also my morals don’t sit with saying “my house my rules” for eberuyjing

I’d remove her from the bills asap, soon as that’s done, hand her notice and look for a new lodger and have a firm list of rules.
She’s taking the piss and has pushed way over your boundaries.
p.s you were unreasonable about the door knocking, a quick I’ll be there in a mini ure would be ok, none of this cbf to speak & get a lock on your door.