Social collapse imminent?

[AdultHumanFemale]

DP and I have just been listening to R4 PM, and the unfolding conflict surrounding tiered regional restrictions. DP reckons we are potentially 6 weeks away from some degree of escalating social collapse in the UK, and should take precautions to insulate ourselves from the impact.
Prudent or unnecessary?
What measures might those of you who may be thinking along the same lines be taking?

Our great grandparents would still tell us how good we have things when we can get Ocado deliver fresh avocado for brunch. Or we can stream Ghostbusters 2 without leaving the house or worrying about late rental fees.

I would ask them if they'd like to swap - they can have Ghostbusters 2 AND avocados if they take Boris and let us have Churchill

@Carpedimum

In March/April there were a lot of posts speculating about how long lockdown would last & if the kids would do their exams etc. I remember one respondent saying that it would be at least 12-18 months before the virus could be under control... oh how she was shot down in flames, accused of scaremongering & being dramatic and worse. I can’t help hearing the same tone in response to this post. If you can’t see that global society isn’t already damaged by the pandemic, or that unless govts. act to stop the economic decline, we will very soon reach a tipping point when collapse is inevitable, you are delusional.

I did this on here and on my parents WhatsApp chat.

Watch out for the councils collapsing and going bankrupt in Feb, March, April and how this means people lose local elected representation and masses of local services (including policing).

Of course this is all scaremongering blah blah blah.

Im past caring about that accusation. Its not me who is the one failing to pay attention.

@EdnaSilem

Come on now Pelleas we shouldn't laugh at people who are posting here for the first time, even if they do adopt a monitoring style. Unless they're an old hand and have changed their name of course

No I'm new here not a between in disguise. She can laugh about Ghostbusters 2 it was meant to be tongue in cheek.

Also I'm not monitoring anyone. Just my opinion. I think we owe our kids the responsibility of not perpetuating civil unrest and people withdrawing cash from the UK. The irony of the original post is that scaremongering like this is exactly how economic and social collapse does start.

@JesusInTheCabbageVan

Our great grandparents would still tell us how good we have things when we can get Ocado deliver fresh avocado for brunch. Or we can stream Ghostbusters 2 without leaving the house or worrying about late rental fees.

I would ask them if they'd like to swap - they can have Ghostbusters 2 AND avocados if they take Boris and let us have Churchill

Yes I see your point although I don't fancy being called up to fight in ww2, rather netflix and chill.

Nothing wrong with a bit of catastrophizing. Keeps the mind occupied while knitting. Oh yeah, it was OP's dh wasn't it. Keeps his mind occupied while playing with engines.

@Usernametaken100 think we've seen everything on Netflix now, and after 7 months cooped up in the house I wouldn't mind bayonetting someone, tbh

It has got me wondering, though. People talk about Blitz spirit, but surely they can't have sustained that level of optimism and courage for the whole 6 years? I wonder if there was an initial burst of 'We're all in this together' which eventually unraveled into numbness and general foreboding (punctuated by occasional moments of terror). Side-eyeing her across the street for having a light on during blackout. Reporting that neighbour who always seemed to have enough sugar for baking.

In 90 years time, people will be chiding each other for not showing more lockdown spirit. That's my prediction. 'Remember how they all used to clap for the NHS and pin rainbows in their windows? AND bake their own banana bread, no robot butlers in them days.'

In 90 years time, people will be chiding each other for not showing more lockdown spirit. That's my prediction. 'Remember how they all used to clap for the NHS and pin rainbows in their windows? AND bake their own banana bread, no robot butlers in them days.'

Yes! I'm going be a tiny wizened old lady in a rocking chair hissing "lockdown spirit BOLLOCKS, you should've seen my local facebook page!"

This will be forgotten in 90 years, same as Spanish flu was a distant memory.

@GoldenOmber They won't listen to us. Kids these days, think they know it all .

Only if money stops flowing. Which it might. But I think thats one thing this shower of a government will see and throw money at it to stop.

Jesus in WWII in the UK I think people had a lot of changes. Eg a lot of women got the chance to work in factories with free childcare which was quite liberating. Huge numbers of women got to have affairs when husband were away not that I am saying that is good but I expect it was very exciting. Others got to work in fields of code breaking. Also many children went to remote country places (whch was not nice at all as away from parents but it did let them get out of London slums at times, have good healthy foods, run around). Some came back and went back again so lots of variety and change. Lots of awful things too and plenty of people had PTSD particularly men including those held by the Japanese in appalling conditions in breach of human rights. Anyway blitz spirit - I never use that term but we didn't lock most people up other than illegal aliens whereas now we have gone too far with CV19 rules and we are paying the price.

“The irony of the original post is that scaremongering like this is exactly how economic and social collapse does start.”

Only if it’s fragile to start with. It would take a bit more than someone with a placard saying “we’re all doomed” to push a robust and secure economy, one where that robust security is distributed throughout the population, over the edge.

@MayYouLiveInInterestingTimes

“The irony of the original post is that scaremongering like this is exactly how economic and social collapse does start.”

Only if it’s fragile to start with. It would take a bit more than someone with a placard saying “we’re all doomed” to push a robust and secure economy, one where that robust security is distributed throughout the population, over the edge.

Firstly I think enough people presenting themselves as stable and respectable members of society in forums other than a street corner and with arguments other than a 'we are doomed' placard are likely to be taken more seriously than your straw person example. Secondly, what is your actual point because from my point of view you seem to be saying 'you might as well jump around a bit on the ice covering that lake as it's pretty thin to start with anyway'.

It has got me wondering, though. People talk about Blitz spirit, but surely they can't have sustained that level of optimism and courage for the whole 6 years?

They didn't - mass-observation investigators often reported population was down depressed and fed up. Saw a program recently about Bristol - they felt ignore as their big bombing raid was covered over too soon after Coventry and there were fears about national moral.

There was a lot of propaganda done at the time and afterwards -Chrurchill recorded his most famous speakes at his house Chartwell after the war - those are the one we tend hear today - there are mass-observation report recording people complaining he sounded drunk in some of the BBC broadcasts and other speaches that were at time only done in the House of Commons.

There a lot of national myth in the blitz spirit idea.

We have an incredibly selective national memory when it comes to the Home Front in WWII. Crime was absolutely endemic, partly because so many criminals with relatively short sentences remaining were released en masse at the start of the war. Bombed houses were looted. Organised criminals made literally millions on the black market, which was used by pretty much everybody who could afford it, even if they were otherwise law-abiding.

On a much smaller scale we all seem to have forgotten that we fully expected London 2012 to be an absolute disaster, not least because the streets of London were literally on fire with riots a year before. Now it’s remembered as a triumph.

The same will happen with the current period. The collective memory will be all rainbows and clapping for the NHS.

I was going to mention mass observation telling a very different story to the propoganda. I expect clapping and nhs thank you placards will be used in the future for covid.

Anyway the boss of Tesco says there may be shortages of some fresh foods if there are border delays in Jan, so I expect as soon as the shelves don't look full people will start panic buying.

I didn't think anything could be worse than a no deal Brexit but here we are in the midst of a scandalously mismanaged global pandemic. So whilst I don't know what a social collapse would look like, I do know there's only so much shit people can take.

@EmilySpinach

We have an incredibly selective national memory when it comes to the Home Front in WWII. Crime was absolutely endemic, partly because so many criminals with relatively short sentences remaining were released en masse at the start of the war. Bombed houses were looted. Organised criminals made literally millions on the black market, which was used by pretty much everybody who could afford it, even if they were otherwise law-abiding.

On a much smaller scale we all seem to have forgotten that we fully expected London 2012 to be an absolute disaster, not least because the streets of London were literally on fire with riots a year before. Now it’s remembered as a triumph.

The same will happen with the current period. The collective memory will be all rainbows and clapping for the NHS.

Yep, our grandkids will tell us all the exciting things they learned at school about the "COVID spirit", and what some gooey muppet guest speaker recounted of the wonderful time, with their "little family" and "lovely neighbours", all clappy rainbows, banging pots and shit ... and grandkids will ask us all about it and we'll be "we all got angry, bored, fat and broke, it was marvellous." I'm going to be a delightful old person.

Exactly! And all historical records will be drawn from Facebook and Instagram....

We have an incredibly selective national memory when it comes to the Home Front in WWII.

Indeed. I loved watching Foyle's War. In addition to being great television, it was a real eye-opener about what went on then - fire brigades looting bombed houses, draft-dodging, stealing war supplies, etc. You could be hung for some of those crimes during the war.

I thought of Foyle's War when someone mentioned only illegal aliens getting locked up!

The war was an ideal time to let xenophobia and racism go wild!

Oh...!

@Xenia

Jesus in WWII in the UK I think people had a lot of changes. Eg a lot of women got the chance to work in factories with free childcare which was quite liberating. Huge numbers of women got to have affairs when husband were away not that I am saying that is good but I expect it was very exciting. Others got to work in fields of code breaking. Also many children went to remote country places (whch was not nice at all as away from parents but it did let them get out of London slums at times, have good healthy foods, run around). Some came back and went back again so lots of variety and change. Lots of awful things too and plenty of people had PTSD particularly men including those held by the Japanese in appalling conditions in breach of human rights. Anyway blitz spirit - I never use that term but we didn't lock most people up other than illegal aliens whereas now we have gone too far with CV19 rules and we are paying the price.

In fairness, the majority of the population that would be committing petty crimes (ie, men aged 18 - 51) were conscripted and had slightly more pressing things to do.

The military prisons were pretty busy, though.

@Usernametaken100 I am no doubt as guilty as you are of taking the internet too seriously because I have been thinking about what you said.

Perhaps it is a function of my age and that ‘taking it too seriously’. Things do feel different now, as if we have no options left, and are slipping past the point of no return. At that point I am on here just to watch how things go, gather what information I can as regular media doesn’t report fully any more, and have a vent myself when I need to. I hope for the best still, but hope seems to have failed us. I don’t think simply telling others who feel the same to keep quiet about it will help.

[quote MayYouLiveInInterestingTimes]@Usernametaken100 I am no doubt as guilty as you are of taking the internet too seriously because I have been thinking about what you said.

Perhaps it is a function of my age and that ‘taking it too seriously’. Things do feel different now, as if we have no options left, and are slipping past the point of no return. At that point I am on here just to watch how things go, gather what information I can as regular media doesn’t report fully any more, and have a vent myself when I need to. I hope for the best still, but hope seems to have failed us. I don’t think simply telling others who feel the same to keep quiet about it will help.[/quote]
I appreciate your honesty. But you are reshaping what I said to then knock it over which is classic straw man. I'm not saying keep quiet about your genuine fears and anxiety about the world today. But I think some people are going overboard, the title of this thread and main post is inflammatory and irresponsible clickbait which some people feed off and add to.

I also think that you can't accuse anyone of taking the internet too seriously. Dangerous propoganda was spread in ww2 by posters and word of mouth, why is the internet any different?

You’re quick to respond. Are we in a WW2 situation do you think? Are we supposed to be?