Black section on MN

[PatricksRum]

I think it would be great if Mumsnet could make a black parents section/ section for black users.

Yes, segregate yourselves (I am bame too beofre anyone takes exception to ‘yourselves’) and make it easier for people to identify and discriminate against black users, if they wished to.

Why can’t these topics be discussed on the usual boards, whichever one is relevant to your question.

I can’t see an end to it really. Black boards, asian boards, white boards, black LGBT boards, asian LGBT boards ad infinitum

It will only serve to fracture discussions and like it or not it just encourages segregation.

Because they bore me Wow, the sheer arrogance of this response. Is it that? Or is it that you actually don’t have an answer. Let’s face it, all your posts so far are an obfuscatory attempt to cover your racism.

This thread is embarrassingly out of touch on so many levels, I don’t even know where to begin.

I think is a fantastic idea Op. The fact that so many white posters are up in arms should be reason enough for MNHQ to seriously consider it.

I can't believe so many MNetters are against this.

How in God's name is it going to affect anyone's life negatively if MNHQ adds another topic on an internet chat forum? If you don't like it, don't click on it. Or is that too sensible an idea?

I don't think I've ever read so much angst and drama, which kind of proves the OP's point.

Genuinely, why is a BAME section not enough for specifics?

I do understand that people are different and have different needs and concerns, but really, how far do you split it down into ethnicities? And why?

I saw Samuel L Jackson discussing racism and he was quite direct, don't refer to me as a black man, refer to me as a man.

I can see many here would disagree, but surely that is the ideal? I also accept that we are a long way from that, but surely, more integration not less, is the way forward?

@Home2018

It has been asked before. About 2 years back. It was rejected.

A lot has happened in the last two years, I don't think that's a reason not to ask again.

I think Venice that whilst full integration would be lovely, we are far away from that, so space for people to discuss things outside of the white norm would be useful

If it was the white majority saying black stuff should be elsewhere that would be very off, but that community is asking for some space as a minority group . LBTQ have space, feminists have space, SN have space ....

@PersephonePromotesEquanimity I’m really sorry that I came across as offensive then. I am in support of this idea and I think I worded this wrong. I was thinking that if mnhq/other users aren’t in favour of the idea then it might be an alternative way of showing that there is a need and desire for the topic. I definitely don’t think it’s not worthy of a proper place on the board. I’m sorry for how my words came across.

*I'm tempted to start a thread on AIBU simply stating that DS kissed his teeth at me today and I'm wondering what the best punishment is.

Tell me honestly, all you dissenters, would I get:

A) oh my goodness, how rude, when I was a child if I did that my mum would...

Or

B) so? Well what does that mean? It's a noise, right? Hardly worth grounding him over. Tell him it sounds like a funny animal, that'll learn him.*

This!!!

And the BAME poster saying segregate yourselves then is exactly why almost every black person I know rejects the BAME moniker, because not all minorities have the same experiences or struggles. Using the BAME umbrella some people dismiss us and say our experiences are not valid because they do not experience those things. You can be "BAME" and antiblack.

@PatricksRum

I love this idea. What subheadings would you like? And what would others like?

I’m thinking of an employment section and going for internal promotions.

You can be "BAME" and antiblack.

Surely, you can be anything and anti-anything?

I don't have an issue with a black section it at all, but it doesn't seem to move anti racism forward. It is a form of segragation, but I suppose if that is what people feel is needed then why would anyone object except on the grounds of feeling uncomfortable with the premise?

@Venicelover it's the same principle that women face in many other walks of life. Women tend the be the default "accepters" and are vilified for asking for anything just for them, lest they be labelled 'selfish'. It's inappropriate to suggest that black people who want a black talk space should be including every other race and culture in their request. They want a space for them. If Indians want a space for Indians then no black person would take issue with them asking for that. So far, black people have said that they can see a huge potential for a space dedicated to black issues, and many are excited at the prospect. Please can that just be enough?

Black alternatives exist because there is no space for black people in the mainstream which by default caters to white people. By saying we shouldn't carve out a space for ourselves that caters to us, you are saying we should remain without a support system or space that caters to us and gives us a voice like everyone else has. Everyone else is entitled to what we are not. I honestly struggle to see how it is so different from Scotet of CraicNet.

Yes you can be anything and anti-anything but the BAME label is used by some to discount, dismiss and minimize black experiences because we don't encounter the same challenges. An asian person with straight hair doesn't experience hair discrimination like a black person with 4c hair or mixed race person with 3c or 4a hair. But if an asian person chooses to say "as a BAME person, hair discrimination doesn't exist, it's just people kicking up a fuss over nothing" that's harmful, antiblack and a time when someone should actually stop and listen and consider that their experience as a minority is not a universal one.

@OverTheRainbow88 definitely a food/cooking board. About where to find certain things in shops in the UK (breadfruit, please 😩) , recipes from 'back home', and a fun bit to discuss what your culture calls 'X' (Jamaicans say Guinep, where Grenadians say 'skinup', so it would help to narrow down what ingredients we're actually looking for 😁)

Oh wow @AMemeByAnyOtherName that's true. I hadn't even thought of that. That would be extremely helpful in sourcing certain ingredients as well.

@Dastardlythefriendlymutt I agree wholeheartedly. Even if you look past the frivolities of some of the potential topics on a black board, hair is going to be one of the most important areas. I think that area on its own could attract new users to the site. And if anybody who isn't black has questions about black hair (because they have mixed race children with a black partner perhaps) then it will be a lot easier to talk about.

I remain unbruised, Sunshine! But I'm sure, if you have the time to really think about it, you'll see why hiding the proposed board in a dark, unfrequented corner, under a borrowed name - to accommodate the fragilities of dissenters - would be offensive?

Yes you can be anything and anti-anything but the BAME label is used by some to discount, dismiss and minimize black experiences because we don't encounter the same challenges

This really saddens me. If that is the case, then is it racism we are fighting or simply the fact that as humans we are inherently pre disposed/genetically programmed to behave differently to those who are in any obvious way different to us?

@Venicelover

Yes you can be anything and anti-anything but the BAME label is used by some to discount, dismiss and minimize black experiences because we don't encounter the same challenges

This really saddens me. If that is the case, then is it racism we are fighting or simply the fact that as humans we are inherently pre disposed/genetically programmed to behave differently to those who are in any obvious way different to us?

Of course that's an important question. But the suggestion of a black space on MN hasn't been put forward in any attempt to counter racism. It's just something that would make some people feel more at home and comfortable on a site where currently the status quo is very white leaning. If somebody asks a question, the poster is often assumed to be white. Or asked if they're from 'another culture', which wouldn't even be a question if all cultures were equal here, would it? Black people living in Britain have a good understanding of white issues, because they're everywhere. A lot of things that black people experience happen behind closed doors within their own communities, so even a white person living next door to them wouldn't know what the problem is.

If topics about colour come up in a black section, how as a white mum can I ever learn and teach my daughter not to make the same mistakes.

I get the the augmented, about being there a sen section. It’s not the same.

If a separated section is created, these topics that I should be reading may not get read.

Most U.K. news papers are managed by white public school boys. The voices are there, the U.K. badly lacks platforms.

@Gardenfish which topics that specifically affect black people do you feel would be of any use to your daughter, though? Is your daughter mixed race?

Also, right now, black people dont talk about their issues here. Full stop. It's not worth the drama. You'd be more likely to learn about anything you want to by lurking on an active board, than you would be by reading nothing about the subject. It can only serve to add perspectives in my opinion. And then of your daughter has an issue that's typically seen as a 'black' issue, you'll know exactly where to look.

@Gardenfish

If topics about colour come up in a black section, how as a white mum can I ever learn and teach my daughter not to make the same mistakes.

I get the the augmented, about being there a sen section. It’s not the same.

If a separated section is created, these topics that I should be reading may not get read.

Most U.K. news papers are managed by white public school boys. The voices are there, the U.K. badly lacks platforms.

I understand what you're saying but with respect the purpose of the board isn't to educate you it's to provide a safe, inclusive, understanding space for black women to discuss experiences and situations unique to them amongst others in the same position.

If white people can read the threads and learn something that's a bonus!

I know from my DH it's exhausting always having to be on an educational crusade and to have the responsibility to be constantly educating white people on the black experience. Sometimes he just wants to speak to other black guys about which curl cream is best for his hair or something day to day...

If a separated section is created, these topics that I should be reading may not get read.
Leaving aside the fact that this board is not being proposed in order to educate you and your DD, why would you not get to read them @Gardenfish?

If topics about colour come up in a black section, how as a white mum can I ever learn and teach my daughter not to make the same mistakes.
With all due respect, it's not about you. There is nothing to stop you perusing the board. The existence of SEN, LGBT etc., doesn't stop you from learning about homophobia or disablism.

Also can you not see how asking people to put aside their need for support and a space relevant to them to cater to your need to educate yourself when they are a plethora of resources readily available all over the internet is selfish and smacks of privilege

If topics about colour come up in a black section, how as a white mum can I ever learn and teach my daughter not to make the same mistakes.

I wasn’t going to post again because apparently it’s HILARIOUS that white women have defended this.

However it’s not black peoples job to educate you and your daughter. Your desire to be educated doesn’t trump their desire for a space of their own.

You sound lovely and I’m sure that’s not how you meant it but that’s how it came across to me.