Universal Credit has docked me £300 due to BH pay dates - am sick with worry

[FeelSickItsSoUnfair]

Background info - I am a single mum, I work as a TA on just above minimum wage so am at home when DCs are. My earnings are tiny and I rely on UC to get by. I am 1st port of call for ill and aged parents, and have various illnesses myself so cant work F/T but do as many hours as I can, whilst balancing not over doing it and being ill.

My work paid me on July 31st and then again at the end of August. Because of Bank Holiday Monday (31st) they paid me on the previous Friday (28th).

Due to this, UC have seen that I was paid 2 lots of amounts in a 4 week period and have taken £300 from my payment and I have been told they cant do anything about it - just sent me
a link www.gov.uk/universal-credit/how-youre-paid

Has anyone had this before and managed to get their payment rectified for the full amount or is that it and Im stuffed? Looking at other bank holidays I see this could happen again next May/June and possibly this December as work may decide to do payments a week early for xmas. So that will be 3 times in a year I will be penalised and overall down nearly £1000. I have explained that is my electricity money and a large part of my food bill bill I am down, but no luck.

If anyone has been in a similar position and managed to sort it I would really appreciate the help.

Yes I get that. Writing to your MP helps identify and unpick these issues with UC.

Thanks @AnotherEmma. It's incredibly stressful navigating this system, especially when you are on your own.

I was paid early due to the bank holiday weekend on Friday 28th Aug and received a request on Sat 29th from UC to report PAYE income received. This was unusual since I normally only have to declare any self employed earnings, as my Employer usually submits my PAYE income. I queried this on my journal, to be told it was because my employer hadn’t submitted it (I guess due to it being a bank holiday weekend!). I had to declare the date it was received into my bank account. My next pay date is Wed 30th Sept, so for my next accounting period (30th Aug-29th Sept) it will appear I have received no income at all? Your guess is as good as mine as to whether I will be penalised for this.

The problem appears to be that I have no "usual" pay date. As it is on the last working day of the month, not calendar day and flexes according to weekends/bank hols. This isn't catered for in the scenarios described in the guidance link provided. In their diagrams, there appears to be no issues with monthly payments, only weekly/fortnightly/4 weekly or at Christmas.

I don't like that the onus is on me to ensure my employer knows what they should be doing. (And as it's a public institution one would think more clued up on this than private companies, but that might be naive!).

Neither do I like the general tone (in the guidance) that I should budget more effectively to allow for such fluctuations. For example, I don’t have to pay Council Tax currently, due to being laid off without Furlough (zero hrs contract) in March with no income. I am lucky to have a job and have just started to go back (again on zero hrs) but my local Council won’t tell me the criteria at which I will have to start paying again. They will only calculate it once they have received the amount due from UC. I am able (and expected!) to calculate the amount of UC I will get, based on my hours worked. If I can do this, why can’t I for Council Tax? How else am I to budget for it? How do I budget for being laid off again/having to self-isolate?

Sorry OP for the hijack and rant but it is hugely stressful.

So I got an email back from payroll saying they have to pay on the last working day of the month, that cant be changed. So I have asked if they can fill any forms from Gov/UC stating my actual due date for pay, not the date my wages went through. Will wait to see.

Our local MP seems pretty on the ball I must say! I emailed him last night and he has replied saying he has passed my case on to UC and will let me any news from them. I emailed him again with the June case link too, saying nothing appears to have changed still. So will hopefully get some sort of reply about it.

Have done a request for a review in my journal too which the UC worker should pick up on monday

[quote Alwaysinpain]@FeelSickItsSoUnfair Put a request on your journal for a 'Budgeting Advance'
They will pay you up to a max of £812 and they take an agreed amount out of your ongoing payment each month. You can choose the amount. It will help tide you over.
If you ask nicely, they can send it as a same day payment. [/quote]
You can only get this if you been on UC for 6 months and have earnt less than £2,600 in the last 6 months.

Your payroll department should’ve sent their RTI submission with the date that your pay should’ve been, rather than the date it was.

Send them this - www.gov.uk/running-payroll/reporting-to-hmrc

You shouldn’t be detrimentally affected because you were paid early due to a bank holiday.

They can send an amended FPS Submission and it will fix this.

"Your payroll department should’ve sent their RTI submission with the date that your pay should’ve been, rather than the date it was."

So it should have been paid on the last working day of the month, for example.

And it was.

Nothing you can do I'm afraid, happens to me twice a year, next month you will get more tho probably won't add up to the £300.. Its very annoying. I Do think I read its currently going through the courts to get changed not sure where it is at tho.

"You shouldn’t be detrimentally affected because you were paid early due to a bank holiday."

And who designed and built the benefit system?

What happens to people who are paid weekly? Sometimes there are five paydays in a month

"If this happens, you will be notified that your income is too high and you will no longer get Universal Credit."

So it automatically stops. Does it automatically restart the next month? No it doesn't.

“So it should have been paid on the last working day of the month, for example”

No, it should’ve been paid on 31st which was a bank holiday. That’s the date they should’ve used on their RTI Submission.

Same as if they paid early at xmas.

@FeelSickItsSoUnfair

Do your future payments show on the Gov.Uk website?

You can access your past & future CTC & WTC payments on their, by signing up. It only takes a minute, hopefully you can view your UC on there?

Here you go (If you haven't seen it before)

www.gov.uk/sign-in-universal-credit

I'm pretty sure a UC claimant knows how to log in

The vast majority have to manage their claims online, there are a minority of exceptions for people with no internet access or ability, who can manage their claims over the phone, but it is discouraged.

" the date they should’ve used on their RTI Submission."

tell me more about this word "should"

in your world where people "should" be paid on a Bank Holiday.

Do you know anyone who is paid in the way you think they "should?"

Are Benefits paid in the way they "should?"

[quote CurtainsforRonnie]@FeelSickItsSoUnfair

Do your future payments show on the Gov.Uk website?

You can access your past & future CTC & WTC payments on their, by signing up. It only takes a minute, hopefully you can view your UC on there?[/quote]
No, only past payments show. As it changes every month according to what I am paid they dont predict your payment

@AnotherEmma - Sorry, I didn't know how it worked, I get WTC & CTC still and thought I was quite modern for being able to access my details online as we still get the paper statements through the post, the world is moving too fast for me

I didn't realise you have to UC online, Im dreading being moved on to it I think I will ne worse off each month looking at the calculator.

Yes the UC system works very differently from tax credits. Some people are actually better off on UC, although some are worse off and others are about the same. You probably won't have to switch for a long time though unless you have a significant change of circumstances. And if you want to double check the figures you could always ask Citizens Advice. i work for them and love a nice complicated benefit calculation

If actually be slightly better off on UC as I'd get the housing element but it's such a shambles that I'm hoping I can hang on to tax credits for another year as that's all I've got left until DD is past the age for eligibility.

Only good thing if I do get moved over is I process my own payroll so no chance of the dates being an issue!

Aa a single mother you would be better off not working. The system is flawed x

@Advicewouldbeappreciated

Aa a single mother you would be better off not working. The system is flawed x

What a ridiculous thing to say ! On universal credit you have to work or be looking for work once your child is aged 3 unless you are a carer or have been deemed incapable of working. The Uc work allowance and then the taper rate means that people are significantly better off working.

@NatashaAlianovaRomanova

If actually be slightly better off on UC as I'd get the housing element but it's such a shambles that I'm hoping I can hang on to tax credits for another year as that's all I've got left until DD is past the age for eligibility.

Only good thing if I do get moved over is I process my own payroll so no chance of the dates being an issue!

Uc isn't good for the self employed but for most people things go very smoothly. Some people like the fact that Uc adjusts each month rather than with tax credits where you earn slightly more for a few months because you do a bit of overtime and then find yourself having to pay hundreds back at the end of the tax year. Uc works well for a lot of people but the pay days are an issue that needs fixing.

Have you ever been on benefits? I doubt it
You may be poor on benefits but the transition to work is awful.

And the 'significantly better off working' argument is something most people dont experience unless they can manage a well paid full time role.
Dont comment until you have lived it.

This is why I'm scared to move onto UC, they are still running tax credits in my area and although sometimes I get an overpayment and have to pay the money back I pay in small regular amounts rather than one huge hit!
I will have to move onto UC though when they decide everyone has to move over but when that is I'm in no rush.

@Advicewouldbeappreciated

And the 'significantly better off working' argument is something most people dont experience unless they can manage a well paid full time role. Dont comment until you have lived it.

On UC the first £292 at least of earnings is completely disregarded before wages reduce your UC meaning you can earn below that and still keep your whole Uc amount and your wages on top. Do you have any idea how it works ??

So there is absolutely no need to do a full time job to be significantly better off. It encourages people to work even a few hours and be better off.