Universal Credit has docked me £300 due to BH pay dates - am sick with worry

[FeelSickItsSoUnfair]

Background info - I am a single mum, I work as a TA on just above minimum wage so am at home when DCs are. My earnings are tiny and I rely on UC to get by. I am 1st port of call for ill and aged parents, and have various illnesses myself so cant work F/T but do as many hours as I can, whilst balancing not over doing it and being ill.

My work paid me on July 31st and then again at the end of August. Because of Bank Holiday Monday (31st) they paid me on the previous Friday (28th).

Due to this, UC have seen that I was paid 2 lots of amounts in a 4 week period and have taken £300 from my payment and I have been told they cant do anything about it - just sent me
a link www.gov.uk/universal-credit/how-youre-paid

Has anyone had this before and managed to get their payment rectified for the full amount or is that it and Im stuffed? Looking at other bank holidays I see this could happen again next May/June and possibly this December as work may decide to do payments a week early for xmas. So that will be 3 times in a year I will be penalised and overall down nearly £1000. I have explained that is my electricity money and a large part of my food bill bill I am down, but no luck.

If anyone has been in a similar position and managed to sort it I would really appreciate the help.

I would try and change your pay date is the issue is likely to arise again as I expect when C19 changes go back to normal you'll have a minimum earnings to achieve each month and earning nothing could cause bigger problems

This is an error which can and should be rectified.

The guidelines for employers say that they should report the usual pay date (ie 31st) even if they actually pay you early.

You should send these links to your work HR/payroll:

www.gov.uk/running-payroll/reporting-to-hmrc
It says:
"You must enter the usual date that you pay your employees, even if you pay them earlier or later. For example, if you pay your employees early because your usual payday falls on a Bank Holiday, you should still enter your regular payday."

www.gov.uk/payroll-errors/correcting-your-fps-or-eps
It says:
"Correct the payment date in your FPS
You should use the date you paid your employees in your FPS.
Send an additional FPS with the correct payment date if you’ve sent one with the wrong payment date. Write ‘H - correction to earlier submission’ in the ‘Late reporting reason’ field.
Send your corrected FPS by the 19th of the tax month after you sent your original FPS. HMRC will apply the correction to the right month."

You should also request a Mandatory Reconsideration to get the UC calculation corrected:
www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/universal-credit/problems-with-your-payment/challenging-a-universal-credit-decision-mandatory-consideration/

@CornishTiger

Section 1.8 HMRC guidance states that where a regular payday falls on a non-banking day (Saturday, Sunday or bank holiday) and, because of this, payment is made on the last working day before the regular payday or next working day after the regular payday, the date reported on the FPS submission should be the contractual pay date instead of the date the person was actually paid. This can be important for UC claimants as explained below.

Thank you, I had just googled this. But it only seems to be about National Insurance contributions though, it doesnt talk about UC assessments?

OP, the point is that your employer submits payroll information to HMRC (for tax/NI purposes) but this "real time information" is then shared with DWP to work out your UC award.

So it is relevant to the UC, they can only correct your UC award once the employer has submitted the correct information to HMRC.

Hi i'm new here,just a quick question about universal credit..i work part time,i get about 630.00 per month.would i be entitled to Universal credit? or is it for those who have been out of work for a long while and just found a job,and get universal credit on top of their wages? or is it for those on low income?..

I had this happen in reverse, my salary did not get logged on the correct day and they paid as if I wasn't earning. It will correct itself as it will show no earnings for next month and you will get paid as if you don't work.

I believe they can give you an advance which could tide you over and then be paid back from the extra next month but not sure as haven't been through that process.

I wouldn't bother with trying to get it corrected as it was such hard work trying to get them to understand they had overpaid me and pay them back and even when I did it didn't register in their system and they had to give it me all back as they had no way round it.

Thank you @AnotherEmma, I will be getting on to them on Monday about it

👍

It's sweet to see the government agency trying to divert responsibility for circumventing the vicious UC system, onto employers.

@sunset900

I had this happen in reverse, my salary did not get logged on the correct day and they paid as if I wasn't earning. It will correct itself as it will show no earnings for next month and you will get paid as if you don't work.

I believe they can give you an advance which could tide you over and then be paid back from the extra next month but not sure as haven't been through that process.

I wouldn't bother with trying to get it corrected as it was such hard work trying to get them to understand they had overpaid me and pay them back and even when I did it didn't register in their system and they had to give it me all back as they had no way round it.

The trouble is I wont get the full amount back that they have deducted. For example if I get £1000 a month and they deduct 63p per pound for every £1 I earn over £282 (£250) then they take off usually £100. This month they took off an extra £300 because the amount I earned over £282 was £750 as they took 2 lots of wages into account, not one.

The problem is my maximum amount I am entitled to is £1000. So even if I get my usual £850, there is no way I will get the £300 given back that they deducted as it would be over the £1000 have been assessed I am entitled to.

Goodness, I understood that when I was writing it...reading it back it is very confusing sorry.....

"You should use the date you paid your employees in your FPS."

but

"You must enter the usual date that you pay your employees, even if you pay them earlier or later."

@AnotherEmma has explained it better than I could. Your pay roll need to understand how to report it correctly.

@Pinkferrari21

put your details into entitledto.co.uk and see what it comes up with, definitely worth 10 minutes of your time

@Pinkferrari21

Hi i'm new here,just a quick question about universal credit..i work part time,i get about 630.00 per month.would i be entitled to Universal credit? or is it for those who have been out of work for a long while and just found a job,and get universal credit on top of their wages? or is it for those on low income?..

Yes I earn less than that but you should get a fair amount unless you are due to be paid on a ruddy bank holiday of course

I had this with a tax rebate, I couldn't get over the level of extreme fuckery, where I got effed twice. First paying too much tax in my temp job, then it being declared as earnings when my job came to an end and I was forced to claim UC. So horrifically unfair.

@Pinkferrari21, I agree with Littleposh it is so confusing because no 2 circumstances are the same, so definitely worth applying. I was forced to use it when I was out of work (doesn't need to be long term unemployed) but I was kept on the system when I found work again. In a way, it can be a good system because I only ever work full time, so would not even think to apply when I'm in work but it automatically calculates the months when you earn less. But the following month when your earnings are back to normal, you get nothing.

Though not ideal, and given I haven't known anyone to get their lost uc back, I'd cancel the claim and restart on a date midmonth between 10-16th,so the claim period runs then and you get paid week after, full uc amount regardless of pay date.

Ask for a mandatory reconsideration, then appeal. They should go back, 4 women won a tribunal earlier this year due to the known pay date issue within UC.

There really should be no need to appeal if you get your employer to submit corrected payroll information. When that's done, an MR request should be sufficient.

@SoloMummy

Though not ideal, and given I haven't known anyone to get their lost uc back, I'd cancel the claim and restart on a date midmonth between 10-16th,so the claim period runs then and you get paid week after, full uc amount regardless of pay date.

You can't do this. Firstly even if it was possible, it would be an almighty faff and would mean the OP has a longer gap with no UC. And It's not even possible anyway because if you reclaim UC, having claimed it before (in the last 6 months IIRC) your assessment period is the same as it was before.

@Suzi888

Ask for a mandatory reconsideration, then appeal. They should go back, 4 women won a tribunal earlier this year due to the known pay date issue within UC.

Just done that in my Journal, I am presuming that when my case person sees it on Monday they will get the ball rolling

@SoloMummy Though not ideal, and given I haven't known anyone to get their lost uc back, I'd cancel the claim and restart on a date midmonth between 10-16th,so the claim period runs then and you get paid week after, full uc amount regardless of pay date
I could be wrong but I thought it went from paydate to paydate anyway, whatever date you originally applied? But that would be a good idea if it doesnt

Please go to universal credit essentials group on Facebook. Very knowledgeable admins will be able to advise

OP it can be difficult to tell the difference between right and wrong advice on mumsnet, so please proceed with caution and make sure you read the links that people have shared, don't follow any advice that isn't backed up with links (or at least research it yourself first) as some of it is just plain wrong.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/universal-credit-different-earning-patterns-and-your-payments/universal-credit-different-earning-patterns-and-your-payments-payment-cycles#claiming-universal-credit-within-6-months-of-your-previous-claim-ending

Please write to your MP about this. It seems pointless but it’s one of the few ways to get government to listen.