What constitutes to someone being Irish?

[Cybercubed]

Born there? Parents from there? Grandparents from there?

I'm born and raised in England, my parents are both Irish (mum from Belfast Dad from the ROI). In England whilst growing up people routinely called me Irish and so that's how I saw myself. Then I moved to Northern Ireland as teenager and had a reality check, because then everyone started calling me English. I still have an English accent so everyone still refers me to as an English person here. I've always understandably have a bit of an identity crisis therefore, compounded by the fact that the "British vs Irish" issue is right of the forefront of Northern Ireland politics as well I don't feel I fit in with either community here.

We've all heard of the term 'plastic paddy' which usually gets thrown at anyone with a non Irish accent calling themselves Irish. I personally don't really identify as anything more and feel kinda stateless but do you think calling yourself Irish should be reserved for those who are born and/or raised there only?

My maternal grandfather was Irish, my grandmother's father was irish and we have a large contingent still living in the republic of ireland and some living in northern Ireland who were born in England

Dh parents were both born in ireland

There are five nuclear armed nations in Europe. From memory they are Britain, France, Germany Turkey and Russia. Then you have the US and then you have the middle east. I'm not sure that China is armed. I think it is. I genuinely wouldn't have thought that Britain was nuked up. Russia is always a cat among the pigeons. China is armed so says google. Pakistan too and Israel, though Israel denies it.
Ireland wasn't ever armed in such a sense. We're as well off keeping out of the thug wars.

Russia used to be part of the G8, though I'm not sure if they were ever let back in when they were banned a few years ago. I don't keep up with the news.

I think you are the country that you are raised in, regardless of what your parents are. I'm born and raised in England to a Welsh dad and a Spanish mum. I have never thought of myself as anything but English - that's where I live, what my accent is etc. I think it would be wrong to say I was "Spanish" because I'm just not.

All these Americans who say they're "Irish American" or whatever because Great Uncle Patrick came over on a boat once seems very tenuous to me.

@OchonAgusOchonO

I could say the same about France and England couldnt I? We have a long and bloody history. But the two countries managed to work together in WW2 just fine. Are you saying they should've refused and just let the Nazis push ahead with world domination, because their grudge was far more important? 🙄

@isabellerossignol

Good as those things are, it is nowhere near the efforts of England, Scotland and Wales.

@Howallergic

No, you sound like a bully saying, your Dad didn't fight in the war so he's a coward. I'm just saying, we had no reason to fight another country's war.

Stop projecting, I never said anything of the sort.

You keep saying 'another country's war' - whose was it then? Given that they planned to invade the whole world? Should nobody have stopped them or intervened, as it wasn't 'their war'?

I'd guess the impact in practical terms might have been limited? Although obviously it would have made a big impact politically

Yes I'm not for one moment suggesting Ireland couldve made the same level of contribution that England did. Politically it could have been a really good move, not only to join the 'moral' fight against Nazism but also to bury the hatchet with the UK & work together. I think it wouldve afforded Ireland a lot of respect from the UK.

I think it wouldve afforded Ireland a lot of respect from the UK.

Ireland has never been afforded much respect from the UK and I don't think that anything they do or did would change that. It would never be enough.

You only have to witness the reaction to Ireland not rolling over and doing the UKs bidding over Brexit and the border. The UK government were like some minor celeb shouting 'but don't you know who I am?'. They seemed astounded that Ireland would dare to challenge them.

Obviously you have your own experience, but like the PP who said about Liverpool having a large percentage of people with Irish heritage, I live in a major city, know lots of people with Irish parents and nobody is thought of as not British because it is so common where I live.

My family are Catholic, Irish Grandparents in both sides, my friend has Irish parents. When we went into an Irish bar in America, we were given stick about being English from an American.

I think if you don't have an accent and weren't raised in a country, went through school there etc, not many people are going to think you're from there.

Also with my friends who have Irish parents, most of the parents moved to the UK aged about 18, are now in their 70s. Obviously the parents are Irish and the friends have grown up around Irish culture etc, but haven't had the experience of an Irish education, living in a modern Ireland. Things change in a country over the years, its different to somebody who has lived there their whole life.

In the UK, you can get a termination if you want one etc.

Actually being from a country is different.

I can’t tell you how much this thread is amusing me. I’d forgotten the mass delusion that is Ireland’s perception of itself.

Yes it seems extraordinary doesn’t it, that human rights violation was embraced as a matter of national pride. No abortion in Ireland! Brilliant! Like that made them better than the English, those baby murderers!

@isabellerossignol

I agree 100% with what you just said about Brexit. Like I said, I'm not deluded. I am very aware of the British government's failings (as we suffer the most from them).

However, the thread started out all 'All countries should recognise their good and bad deeds.'

But further down the line we have established what that really means is 'England should only acknowledge it's bad deeds, repeat them over and over, but when it comes to Ireland's there is always an excuse.'

God, I know I should stay out of it but...did France occupy Britain for hundreds of years, with this only coming to an end with a bloody war only 15 years before? Jesus, there’s a lot of people in the UK still going on about WW2, including yourself (I presume because it was one of the few times in history the British army could be considered to be the “good guys”) and that was 80 years ago...

@Grapesoda7, abortion is legal in Ireland.

Abortion was fully legal in Ireland before it was fully legal in the UK as a whole. There's still a grey area over part of the UK.

I have one Irish grandparent. Me and my brother completely identify as English. Our cousins, also with one Irish grandparent, seem to make a much bigger deal of their irish ancestry which makes little sense to us. I don't know if it's in part to do with them being brought up as practising catholics whereas we weren't. I think that put them in touch with more Irish people and people of irish ancestry.

Not quite the same but a similar thing I was brought up by southern parents in the north of England.
As a young child picked up my parents southern accent and so had a bit of a southern twang - had the mickey taken out of me when started school but by the time I was a teenager had a full-blown northern accent.
Moved south aged 19 and had the mickey taken because of my northern accent. Everyone thought of me as a northerner.
Moved north again recently after 35 years and everyone thinks I'm a southerner.

@MMN123

I know! If the shoe was on the other foot I would say without hesitation, 'Yes England has mistreated us, but I acknowledge we wouldve been toast without the Allies, so I am grateful for that'.

Instead it is all 'Why should Ireland take on another country's war?' Totally ignoring the fact it was their war as well as the Nazis had drawn up plans to invade them! 🤦‍♀️

But it wasn't for years, so a 40 year old that grew up in Ireland wanting a termination as a teenager and the same person growing up in England would have had a different experience.

Here is a prime example of my ignorance about when the laws changed, so it proves that me having Irish blood doesn't make me the same as somebody actually Irish living in Ireland.

@Wolfgirrl

Many fine histories of Ireland and WW2 have emerged in the last few decades.

I strongly suggest you read a few before you trot out your poorly informed personal opinions on a public forum.