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Original poster

SIL and BIL really struggling with two young children

104 replies

BowermansNose · 02/03/2020 10:48

I'm interested in tips that might help my SIL and BIL. They live a long way from the family (think another continent), and have two DCs (8 months and 2.5), who are healthy. We don't have children, so it's hard to get a bit of perspective, and so I was interested in views, and tips on how we can help them.

SIL doesn't work and has been a SAHM since the birth of their eldest. BIL has quite a flexible job. They are really perfectionist, so for example, breakfast takes around 2 hours from start to finish (smoothies, freshly made pancakes). This means BIL doesn't get to work until 11am. His work is less than pleased and his contract has not been renewed (understandably). Not only that, but SIL and BIL don't shower more than once or twice a week (saying they don't have time for it, with two children).

From the outside, they seem to be in a real mire, but they can't seem to find a way out. We visited them recently, but they seem to find everything so difficult. As a result, their finances are in a poor state, they're cooped up in a flat (as SIL finds it hard to leave the house with two children) and they have no family nearby. They are looking to move back home, but with no money, it's really hard. Any advice would be welcome.

OP posts:
worldsworststepfordwife · 02/03/2020 17:39

These sound like the types who could bleed you dry op, keep them at arms length once they’re home or they’ll be some right falling out between you all as they use you all to try and keep their ridiculous existence going as it’s all they’ve ever known and you’ll all get sick of them taking the piss

BlueHarry · 02/03/2020 17:43

It sounds like they need professional help if they are that set in this particular routine that it is affecting their life so badly. It's not rational behaviour. If you're two hours late for work each day because of how you have breakfast then you either change what you have for breakfast, or prepare it at a more convienient time so that mornings are just eat and go, or you get up two hours earlier. And the shower thing, there's nothing to stop them taking turns to stay with the kids while the other showers - that's more of a luxury than a single parent has - but their insistence in doing things the particular way they do just sounds like they either have mental health issues of some sort, or that they don't really care about the consequences. I don't see how they will manage when the children start school, they can't be two hours late every day!

SittingAround1 · 02/03/2020 18:06

They'd be better hiring a home help to come in the mornings and help SIL rather than he loses his job. He could then shower in the morning before work then she showers once the helper / babysitter arrives.

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TenCornMaidens · 02/03/2020 18:23

Have you heard of 'Why Don't You...? Yes, But...' game? It sounds like they are refusing perfectly valid solutions.

lifestoogood.net/victim-persecutor/

diddl · 02/03/2020 18:30

Tbh they are just sounding ridiculous now & I'd be pretty pissed off at trying to help two adults who won't help themselves.

Long breakfasts & no showers ffs!

midwestspring · 02/03/2020 19:24

The trouble is they're isolated on the far side of the world without any network, and so normal has changed.

I don't buy this.
As I said I've lived on the other side of world in a different Language situation and know a lot of other couples who have done the same.
None of them have arrived at work at 11am unshowered because they had two dc.
I wouldn't expect the issues to be any less when they return to the UK unless they seek mental health support.
This is an internal issue not external. It may be exacerbated by being abroad but being abroad does not create these kinds of issues by itself.

Caterina99 · 03/03/2020 02:29

Why did they move to the other side of the world in the first place? BILs work?

I live abroad with no family on this continent and have 2 small children. But it’s the USA, so no language barrier thankfully.

DH has never been late for work or unable to shower because of family life. I might have had days in the toddler/newborn fog where showering was a challenge (haven’t we all?) but as a sahm that really wasn’t a big deal. I certainly don’t faff about with 2 hour breakfasts on a work day, but if I wanted to make pancakes and smoothies I could do it and still have DH out the door on time. Especially as he’s the only one that has to leave, the rest of them can be in pjs still eating.

I would imagine your SIL is suffering from some kind of depression/anxiety/agoraphobia and is unable to cope with the kids and your BIL feels he can’t leave her. Perhaps he has his own issues too. I mean why can’t he leave his wife with his own kids for 10 min to take a shower? That’s just bizarre

I’m not sure what you can actually do for them except suggest they seek some kind of medical help. Maybe if they do make it back to the UK then you can give more practical help like babysitting, but ultimately they’re unlikely to ever be able to cope if they don’t get some help for the mental health issues

mathanxiety · 03/03/2020 05:47

Both of them have mental health problems and when they come home and find somewhere to live, please phone social services and tell them what is going on. SS can support them as they find their feet.

BIL's adamant talk of no TV sounds like the talk of someone who is utterly lost in a mental cul de sac. He has completely lost sight of priorities.

SIL's problem sounds like PND, possibly orthorexia. What were her food issues when she was younger?

There are expats who manage to make a social life for themselves in non-English speaking countries, function well as human beings, and keep their jobs regardless of babies. I agree 100% with midwestspring on this.

Is there an issue of one or other of them losing the plot, becoming even a little paranoid, and becoming very controlling of the other, to the extent that it's hard for the BIL to leave to get to the job, or hard for BIL to trust that SIL will obey house rules when he is away?

Sometimes when someone is dead set against TV and food has to be organic, homemade, etc. it's a sign that there is an underlying issue of fear and anxiety contributing to obsessive control of the environment, with resulting loss of interest in social interaction, and obsessive focus on keeping a partner and dependents in line. It can be extremely unhealthy as it is very rigid and contributes to utter isolation, setting up a vicious circle.

mathanxiety · 03/03/2020 05:51

fear and anxiety about the outside world contributing to obsessive control of the environment,

Mangoandlimes · 03/03/2020 06:08

I think you need to try to convince them to move home as soon as possible if you want to help them. It's honestly not normal to be struggling this much with 2 kids given one doesn't work and one is about to lose their job. They are either really unwell, or just not facing up to reality. Is one any worse/better than the other? Can you work on them first to help them find some perspective?

Blackbear19 · 03/03/2020 06:37

No wonder he's lost his job, 2 hours late and stinking, who wants to employ that?

How are they going to live when they return to the UK?
Has he started looking for work?
I have limited knowledge of the benefits system but don't think they'll be able to claim benefits for 3 mths.

A bit late now but they should have got involved in the expat community where they are. Her having no contact with the outside world sounds a disaster for her MH.

BreatheAndFocus · 03/03/2020 07:13

BIL was saying he simply does not have time to shower in the week with two children

Do you accept what he says when he says things like that, or do you calmly but continually refute them? You say he’s stubborn, so presumably has rejected a few of your suggestions about when he could shower, but have you simply pointed out that everyone else manages to shower, including single parents?

Have you ever suggested that one or both of them need help with their mental health? If so, what was their response?

What country are they in? How did they have their children there if they don’t speak the language? Ante-natal appointments? Delivery itself? Vaccination?

diddl · 03/03/2020 07:59

What is keeping them there until May?

BIL has a contract to finish?

In all honesty, I'd be worried about the kids even for another couple of months.

saraclara · 03/03/2020 08:11

If he's not getting to work until 11 and they're not happy, how easy is it going to be for him to get another job? Word will have got around.

They need to see how other families operate. To see what breakfast time is like for normal families. But I don't know how that can be arranged.

If they're so intelligent, can they not understand logic? That there are millions of families with two children that age, who get the morning routine sorted so that they get to work on time? Some even single parents! And they all manage to get showers.
Surely they can see that there are changes they can make, because virtually every other family achieves this!

saraclara · 03/03/2020 08:14

BIL was saying he simply does not have time to shower in the week with two children

"BIL, millions of families have two children this age. Some even have one parent. They manage to shower. This is not an impossible situation"

Verily1 · 03/03/2020 08:40

It sounds like they are perfectionists and I suspect that SILs eating issues are a factor.

Can she speak to her gp there?

I assume they are somewhere with no health visitors?

Original poster
BowermansNose · 03/03/2020 09:57

The problem (at least) is that they are in an East Asian Country where the language is very different, and other than the basics, they struggle. They managed to go through two pregancies with a mixture of English, but getting good MH support is very difficult.

I see that they both have severe MH problems and they are making each other worse, by trying to be the perfect parents, they are achieving the opposite.

OP posts:
Original poster
BowermansNose · 03/03/2020 10:01

PS, we have suggested that they get some MH support, but I don't see how they can get it effectively where they are.

OP posts:
Isthistrueor · 03/03/2020 10:28

I think SIL has PND and BIL is possibly overwhelmed with it all. I had PND and anxiety when my eldest three were small and I never went to a single baby group which I regret now they’re older and I have a fourth who I take to such groups all of the time. I just genuinely couldn’t bring myself to leave the house, most days none of us would even get dressed so we’d just be in the house in pyjamas. I did make exceptionally nutritional food for them and almost prided myself on it, I remember posting pics of the amount of fruit and veg we had in the fridge for example Confused. I was mentally ill, just didn’t realise it at the time.

Your SIL needs professional help.

cupoftea84 · 03/03/2020 10:32

Do they see that their priorities aren't normal?
I think that's the first step towards change.
The main priority is financial stability and a family home they can afford.
Coffee and pancakes don't sound particularly healthy either. Over night oats would be healthier and quicker. Even saying that pancakes shouldn't take them that long. If they're both home why can't one shower whilst the other minds the kids?
They sound very highly strung and changing them will be difficult.
Do you think the contract stopping might be the lack of showering as well, hot country?

BreatheAndFocus · 03/03/2020 10:52

PS, we have suggested that they get some MH support, but I don't see how they can get it effectively where they are

Is there an expat forum for that country? Are there English-speaking private clinics? Is there any way a telephone line based in another country could be used? Or, could they get a translator and access the MH services of the country they’re in? Does BIL have health insurance?

HoppingPavlova · 03/03/2020 11:15

Agree, at this point they both have severe mental health issues. They are two adults that have completely lost the ability to function. Unfortunately that means the children are now at risk.

The issue as OP sees it is that they are in a location with no access to suitable mental health services. However, when they move back home will they actually engage with mental health services? Are they accepting that they have mental health issues that need to be addressed? If not, I would be very wary of trying to support as it will be a losing battle and will not assist them but may even serve to enable them. For example someone goes over and assists so each adult can shower. In their mind that may ‘solve’ that problem and may even reinforce that it’s impossible for two adults to find a way to shower and it ‘obviously’ needs 3 adults.

Gadgnkk · 03/03/2020 11:24

Can your PILs pay the costs of getting SIL, BIL and kids back home?

Figgygal · 03/03/2020 11:29

God they sound absolutely nutty and not like the type of people who would heed any advice that you could give them

I don’t know what the solution is there I really don’t

UYScuti · 03/03/2020 11:38

They both sound bonkers ☹️

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